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Downloaded from
YTS.MX

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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

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(Ominous music)

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[Director] This is a film
about storytelling.

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About how we tell the story
of our country's past.

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Why do we want to believe
one version and not another?

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Maybe because it makes
us feel safe at night.

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There's one episode

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of America's history that is
told very differently,

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depending on who you
are and where you live.

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It is the story of our civil
war and what came after.

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(explosion)

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(drums)

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- The hot winds of
war blew across

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the land, made of it
a country divided.

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Friend turned into foe,
brother fought against brother.

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It was such a long
and drawn out

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struggle and a feeling
on both sides was so intense.

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- We're all just romantics lost

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in contemporary times,
you might say every one of us

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feels like we born
125 years too late.

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(slow music)

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- To introduce myself,
my name is Rachel Boynton.

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This is Nelson Walker.

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We are independent
documentary filmmakers.

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We're making a film about how we
tell the story of the Civil War.

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We're filming in lots of
different schools

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all over the country.

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And going to places with a deep
connection to this history.

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(loud cheering)

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- There's a lot more coming.

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[Student] What made you choose
the civil war

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and reconstruction?

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[Director] Well, you know,
America is kind of like a big

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family that tore itself
apart during the civil war.

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And in order to make peace,

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we told ourselves
a certain story about it.

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And for a long time,
we had trouble telling

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the difference between
that story and the truth.

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You can ask me
anything you want.

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[Student] What did you
want to do when you

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were little and did you have

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a backup for if you
couldn't get that?

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[Director] When I was really
little, I wanted to be Superman.

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When I got a little bit older, I
wanted to be an anthropologist.

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Do you know what an
anthropologists is?

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- No
- Somebody

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who goes around the
world and studies the way other

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people live like this.
- So like this?

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[Director] Kind of like this.

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Yeah.

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[Isabel] People are
having to come

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to grips with the civil war
and enslavement,

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which are the sort of founding
bases of the country.

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Our country is like
a really old house.

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You may not want to go

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into that basement,
but if you really don't go

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into that basement,
it's at your own peril.

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Whatever you're
ignoring will be

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there to be reckoned
with until you reckon with it.

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(ominous music)

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(children talking)

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[Instructor] These voices
were all happening

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on the eve of the civil war.

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I'm interested in what
you think about it.

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I'm interested in who,
who's saying this.

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And I'm also
going to give you

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the secession documents
from South Carolina.

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Where is he from?
What's what's he about?

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Who is he?

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[Student] He's a Philadelphia
congressman, I believe.

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[Instructor] No, Ohio.
I think he's from Ohio.

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So he delivers this when?

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When is this written?
Because that's one of the

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questions that I asked.
- December, 22nd, 1860.

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[Instructor] Exactly.

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And what is he basically saying?

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- He doesn't
want secession

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because he knows
if there is secession

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there will be a huge war.

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[Instructor] People will know
this war with their own eyes.

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They will, you know, really
experience war amongst
ourselves.

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He sounds scared, doesn't he?
[Student] Yeah.

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[Instructor] Yeah.
I think he probably was.

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What stood out to you
in the arguments?

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[Student] So our article
was presented

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by Alexander Stephens
in Atlanta, Georgia.

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And not once does
he talk about

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slavery, property
and what the war is really

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about, what they're really
fighting for.

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[Instructor] Other voices?
Yeah.

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[Student] I noticed
there seems to be

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a common idea that the civil
war was totally about slavery.

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I'm going to disagree with that.

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The South did want to leave

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the union because of slavery,
but the issue of the Civil War

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was keeping the south
in the union.

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So slavery isn't like

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the entire issue.
- Push back? Comments?

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(school bell rings)

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We will continue tomorrow.

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(student chatter)

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[Instructor] You are a thinker.

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That is for sure.

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The wedge is the slavery
issue, right?

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I think we're agreed on that.

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It's just a way
of describing it.

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Yeah.
Good, good job.

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Go, go, go.

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[Director] You're
spending a lot of time

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telling the story
of the Civil War

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and Reconstruction in your
eighth grade class.

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Why?

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- Because I think

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we have not adequately,

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you know, understood
who we are as a nation.

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There's so much of this history

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that has been way too difficult
for this country to look at.

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The reason it's important

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to understand this history is
because we carry it within us.

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These things need to be unpacked
and looked at and talked about

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and and we need to decide
what we think about them now.

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It's challenging, but it's,
it's where the juice is.

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(distant dog bark)

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- We call it a war between
the states here.

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We don't call it a civil war.

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[Director] Why is it
important to cause

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the war between the states?

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- Because that's what it was.

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It wasn't a civil war.

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[Herb] Or the war of
northern aggression.

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The North came down
here and divided us.

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We didn't go up there.
- My grandmother was saying they

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had to hide the food
in the chimney because

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the soldiers came in,
would take everything they had.

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They took all their livestock,
any food that was in the house.

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It was terrible.

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And the war took place
in our backyard.

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But the people up north,
the war was a distant thing.

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We're both members of the local
Sons of Confederate Veterans

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and we are responsible for
taking care of this cemetery.

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But I'm afraid when the Herb

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are gone and our
generations, that it'll,

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there's not gonna be anybody
around to take care of it.

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[Herb] Or to promote
the true history

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of the 1860-1865
period of time.

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[Director] This class
that I'm filming,

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the teacher is teaching the
cause of the war is slavery.

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- Oh, really?

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[Director] And so

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does that offend you?
[Herb] Yes.

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[Director] can you
explain to me why?

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[Herb] Because it's not true.

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You're telling stories
that aren't true about

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my my ancestry, about my family,
about my country, the south.

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[Director] And what's,
tell me what

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the untrue thing is?
[Herb] Slavery.

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They are not
telling the whole story.

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Slavery was
one of the reasons.

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But but for that professor
to say that economics

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had nothing to do with that war
is totally false.

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- I would have fought
for the South.

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You know why? It had nothing
to do with political reason.

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Because my home
was being invaded.

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(somber music)

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[Dr. Blight] The Confederacy
lost this war big time.

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No Americans have ever lost

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a war quite like
the Confederacy, lost this war.

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(slow music)

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White southerners are going

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to need to process what
the meaning of that whole

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collapse of their
society really is.

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And their explanation of their
defeat becomes a narrative.

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It becomes a memory,

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it becomes the lost cause
tradition

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and the lost cause tradition was
this argument

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that the Confederacy had
really fought for noble aims.

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The war wasn't really
entirely about slavery.

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It was about defending their

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homelands,
their families, their women.

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The slavery was not the great
issue. If it were left to them,

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they would have handled slavery
over time and maybe even gotten

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rid of it themselves,
they said, which is nonsense.

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There were alternative textbooks

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eventually published
in the South,

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and it wasn't just textbooks
they were trying to control.

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It was the stories being widely
told in the public arena,

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and they had
a tremendous influence.

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So what is at stake
in the memory

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of the American Civil War, is
who gets to control this
narrative?

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The story.

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[Director] Ok, wait. I've got
to move the microphone

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before I get started.

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Yeah.

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Do you have any
questions for me?

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[Student] I had one.
I forgot what it was.

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Do you consider yourself
a radical person?

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[Director] Am I a radical
person?

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No, I'm not a radical person.
I think I'm someone

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who questions things.
I'm questioning the stories we

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tell, like in your class,
the story about slavery, right?

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They tell us something
about why we're so divided.

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Do you see us living
in a divided country?

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- Every day.

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(somber music)

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(somber music)

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(somber music)

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(children chatter)

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(children chatter)

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[Student] The Holmes
Central High School creed.

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I am a member of the Holmes
Central High School family.

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Education first our motto.

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[Instructor] The kids that I
have here are determined to not

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follow in the footsteps
of what was in the past.

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I'm hoping I can spark
something to say.

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I want to know more.

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I want to learn more.
[Director] In Mississippi,

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do people talk about slavery
as the cause of the war?

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[Instructor] You don't
really hear the word

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slavery or slaves
in Mississippi.

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That was an incidental
part of it.

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I guess the simple
term is whitewash.

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As I told my clients, is that

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a lot of time you want to
see the good part

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of the history,
especially the history that you

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are part of,
and you want to minimize

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the bad part about it.

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Slavery is not an easy topic to
tackle for black or for white.

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[Director] So how do you tackle
the story of slavery?

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[Instructor] One thing
is that, the slaves

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were more powerful than
you give them credit for.

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[Student] People say
that Lincoln freed

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the slaves, but you say
actually they freed themselves.

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[Instructor] That
was a question?

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- Why couldn't
slaves free themselves

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in a sense, before all of
this if they freed themselves?

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[Instructor] We didn't have the
abolition. We we did have was

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Nat Turner, you know, you had
those people who step forward.

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Those people to me were
just as brave

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as the 1960's,
probably more brave.

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[Student] Come on.

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[Instructor] Think about
Nat Turner.

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[Student] Slave.
He's crazy.

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To make a change, you got
to be a little crazy.

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[Instructor] That's it. He
calls people to think. He went

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from plantation to plantation,
killing everybody.

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And he wanted to kill
the women and children.

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He wanted to do that, why?

249
00:14:41,047 --> 00:14:42,966
[Student] you expect for a
dude to be dead,

250
00:14:43,008 --> 00:14:45,760
you expect our mother,
three kids, stuff like that

251
00:14:45,802 --> 00:14:47,679
the pay, you got
him. If you want them,

252
00:14:47,721 --> 00:14:49,222
he's dead.
He set the right tone.

253
00:14:49,264 --> 00:14:52,726
You out here killing wives,
children. Oh yeah.

254
00:14:52,767 --> 00:14:54,978
[Student] He probably was
a grumpy slave owner anyway.

255
00:14:55,020 --> 00:14:58,314
[Instructor] Don't take for
granted the lives that were
lost.

256
00:14:58,356 --> 00:15:01,443
Who was brave enough to try
to system when it's wrong?

257
00:15:01,484 --> 00:15:05,030
That's what makes these
guys to be heroic.

258
00:15:05,071 --> 00:15:07,615
We can't devalue what we did.

259
00:15:07,657 --> 00:15:09,617
A white guy whose grandfather

260
00:15:09,659 --> 00:15:13,538
was a confederate and they
can't keep their memory alive.

261
00:15:13,580 --> 00:15:15,248
Why can't we?

262
00:15:23,923 --> 00:15:25,633
[Student] In Holmes County,

263
00:15:25,675 --> 00:15:30,263
I noticed how we had
the Browns and the Williams.

264
00:15:30,305 --> 00:15:33,892
I mean, we also had Caucasian
people with the same last name.

265
00:15:33,933 --> 00:15:35,769
And I was I always
wondering, like,

266
00:15:35,810 --> 00:15:38,605
is there a relation
between the two?

267
00:15:38,646 --> 00:15:40,273
And then I learned that,

268
00:15:40,315 --> 00:15:43,068
you know, slaves got their last
names from their slave owners.

269
00:15:43,109 --> 00:15:47,864
So is like, did
this family own this

270
00:15:47,906 --> 00:15:52,452
family or like did they? I
always wondered about that.

271
00:15:52,494 --> 00:15:54,913
[Director] There's this
enormous history

272
00:15:54,954 --> 00:15:56,456
of slavery in Holmes County.

273
00:15:56,498 --> 00:15:59,626
Do people ever talk about that?
[Student] About?

274
00:15:59,668 --> 00:16:03,171
[Director] Just the question
of the history of slavery here?

275
00:16:04,756 --> 00:16:06,466
- No.

276
00:16:07,300 --> 00:16:12,472
[Director] Do you know if your
ancestors were enslaved here?

277
00:16:12,514 --> 00:16:14,391
- I don't know.

278
00:16:14,432 --> 00:16:15,975
[Director] Would you
want to know?

279
00:16:16,017 --> 00:16:18,061
- Not really.
[Director] Why?

280
00:16:18,103 --> 00:16:20,605
- Because I don't
want to

281
00:16:20,647 --> 00:16:24,025
think about what all they
went through for us.

282
00:16:24,067 --> 00:16:25,485
[Director] How come?

283
00:16:25,527 --> 00:16:30,824
- Because they
worked for all their life being

284
00:16:30,865 --> 00:16:34,285
enslaved and not
being treated right.

285
00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:36,871
They'll just bring

286
00:16:36,913 --> 00:16:41,668
me down because they suffered
and I wish somebody could've

287
00:16:41,710 --> 00:16:44,587
did something back then
to help them out.

288
00:16:44,629 --> 00:16:46,172
[Director] And so you don't
want to think

289
00:16:46,214 --> 00:16:47,424
about it because
it makes you sad.

290
00:16:47,465 --> 00:16:48,758
- Mm hmm.

291
00:16:49,217 --> 00:16:52,303
- I don't want
to hate people.

292
00:16:52,345 --> 00:16:58,476
And I want to hate
people based on their

293
00:16:58,518 --> 00:17:03,356
character towards me now,
not what they did

294
00:17:03,398 --> 00:17:05,984
hundreds of years
to go or their family did

295
00:17:06,026 --> 00:17:07,402
hundreds of years ago.

296
00:17:07,444 --> 00:17:09,029
[Director] I think white
people are afraid

297
00:17:09,070 --> 00:17:10,739
that it's going to make
them feel ashamed.

298
00:17:10,780 --> 00:17:12,866
- Yeah,
I think so, too.

299
00:17:12,907 --> 00:17:17,537
That's why it's, they probably
when they're teaching,

300
00:17:17,579 --> 00:17:19,748
I know I keep going back to,
you know, the teaching. But it's

301
00:17:19,789 --> 00:17:23,460
where it all starts
because I doubt you, if

302
00:17:23,501 --> 00:17:28,089
a white man would tell his six
year old daughter,

303
00:17:28,131 --> 00:17:32,177
we own slaves or we did
this to slaves or like,

304
00:17:32,218 --> 00:17:33,970
I doubt if that happens.

305
00:17:34,012 --> 00:17:38,350
- I think we all should
learn the real history because

306
00:17:38,391 --> 00:17:41,227
as black people, we think
we know, but we don't.

307
00:17:41,811 --> 00:17:43,396
I never met my great

308
00:17:43,438 --> 00:17:48,318
grandmother, and, you know,
they don't talk about slavery,

309
00:17:49,194 --> 00:17:51,321
and the racial desegregation.

310
00:17:51,363 --> 00:17:53,239
They don't talk about it.

311
00:17:53,281 --> 00:17:55,075
[Director] Would you want
to ask her about it?

312
00:17:55,116 --> 00:17:57,077
- I would,

313
00:17:57,118 --> 00:17:59,079
but I wouldn't.

314
00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:04,042
I think she would say she don't
know, to avoid the conversation.

315
00:18:04,626 --> 00:18:06,086
[Director] And why do
you think she would

316
00:18:06,127 --> 00:18:07,462
want to avoid the conversation?

317
00:18:09,673 --> 00:18:11,966
- It might hurt her,

318
00:18:12,008 --> 00:18:14,761
she might feel mad about it.

319
00:18:15,929 --> 00:18:17,430
[Director] It's hard to talk
about things like that.

320
00:18:17,472 --> 00:18:18,640
- Yeah.

321
00:18:27,899 --> 00:18:31,152
(slow music)

322
00:18:48,044 --> 00:18:50,755
[Instructor] It's personal
around here, we're in a southern

323
00:18:50,797 --> 00:18:53,341
city and we're talking
about the civil war.

324
00:18:55,468 --> 00:18:56,970
And I'm going to have students

325
00:18:57,012 --> 00:18:59,347
who are pulling
for the Confederacy.

326
00:18:59,389 --> 00:19:00,807
I was that student, I pulled

327
00:19:00,849 --> 00:19:03,309
for the Confederacy
because they're southern.

328
00:19:03,351 --> 00:19:04,602
I'm Southern, right.

329
00:19:04,644 --> 00:19:06,813
And it's not about
slavery in your mind.

330
00:19:06,855 --> 00:19:09,482
It's just like it's the Cowboys
versus the Redskins.

331
00:19:09,524 --> 00:19:11,985
And you want the Cowboys to win
the football game, right?

332
00:19:12,027 --> 00:19:13,987
That's what it is in their head.

333
00:19:14,029 --> 00:19:18,366
So when you throw slavery
in there, it complicates it.

334
00:19:19,534 --> 00:19:21,119
It's not a football game.

335
00:19:21,161 --> 00:19:23,204
This was real.

336
00:19:24,039 --> 00:19:25,331
Most history classes we teach

337
00:19:25,373 --> 00:19:27,709
that the winners write
history, the civil war,

338
00:19:27,751 --> 00:19:29,878
the losers end up
writing the history.

339
00:19:29,919 --> 00:19:32,422
When we look
at Southerners and how they try

340
00:19:32,464 --> 00:19:35,008
to twist the narrative of what
happens, I want us to put

341
00:19:35,050 --> 00:19:37,469
ourselves in their shoes
and look at why.

342
00:19:37,510 --> 00:19:39,929
If you can teach empathy
when it comes to history.

343
00:19:39,971 --> 00:19:41,014
I think it's such a powerful

344
00:19:41,056 --> 00:19:42,891
thing for the rest
of your lives.

345
00:19:42,932 --> 00:19:45,560
All right, boys, in your packet,

346
00:19:45,602 --> 00:19:48,897
turn to new perspectives
on slavery.

347
00:19:48,938 --> 00:19:53,485
What we've got here are
statistics about slavery.

348
00:19:53,526 --> 00:19:56,279
And I want you to talk about
what jumps out at you.

349
00:19:56,321 --> 00:19:57,781
[Student] It says about

350
00:19:57,822 --> 00:20:00,867
like one point one million
Southern white families owned no

351
00:20:00,909 --> 00:20:04,204
slaves and that only
about three hundred and fifty

352
00:20:04,245 --> 00:20:06,081
a little over 350,000
owned slaves.

353
00:20:06,122 --> 00:20:07,499
That's only like a fourth or

354
00:20:07,540 --> 00:20:09,959
fifth, which actually
a pretty crazy statistic.

355
00:20:10,001 --> 00:20:11,544
So a handful of people have,

356
00:20:11,586 --> 00:20:13,630
you know, one like five slaves
that probably was just around

357
00:20:13,672 --> 00:20:16,633
the household, which probably
were treated pretty well.

358
00:20:16,675 --> 00:20:18,009
[Instructor] Well, it depends.

359
00:20:18,051 --> 00:20:19,636
[Student] Of course, the
southerners were trying to,

360
00:20:19,678 --> 00:20:21,596
you know,
I mean, they weren't treated

361
00:20:21,638 --> 00:20:24,182
like regular humans,
but they they took care of them

362
00:20:24,224 --> 00:20:25,809
because they were like
a way to make money.

363
00:20:25,850 --> 00:20:27,727
[Instructor] Correct.
It's an investment.

364
00:20:27,769 --> 00:20:29,688
That's my money.
I need to take care of my money.

365
00:20:29,729 --> 00:20:31,981
I want that to keep
producing more money for me.

366
00:20:32,023 --> 00:20:34,901
Therefore, I take care of it
and I don't take care of it

367
00:20:34,943 --> 00:20:38,780
and provide. I mean, it's still
a dirt floor they sleep on.

368
00:20:38,822 --> 00:20:41,116
You know, it's still I'm
working 10 to 12 hours.

369
00:20:41,157 --> 00:20:42,409
It's not.

370
00:20:42,450 --> 00:20:46,079
Let's look at 210,
whippings per person.

371
00:20:46,454 --> 00:20:48,707
In the south,
where was the wealth?

372
00:20:48,748 --> 00:20:52,836
So owning land
and owning slaves?

373
00:20:53,628 --> 00:20:56,339
if I invested twenty three
thousand dollars in something,

374
00:20:56,381 --> 00:20:58,883
I don't want to beat
it to a pulp.

375
00:20:58,925 --> 00:21:00,010
Right?

376
00:21:00,051 --> 00:21:01,928
So why do they do it?
[Student] Fear.

377
00:21:01,970 --> 00:21:04,597
[Instructor] Fear, you hit
on it. That's the word.

378
00:21:04,639 --> 00:21:08,226
Here's what American slavery is
about, money and fear.

379
00:21:08,601 --> 00:21:10,061
They are making lots of money

380
00:21:10,103 --> 00:21:13,606
and they are terrified of what
happens if this goes away.

381
00:21:13,648 --> 00:21:15,066
What happens when people talk

382
00:21:15,108 --> 00:21:16,693
about abolition
and emancipation?

383
00:21:16,735 --> 00:21:20,030
What do I start
picturing in my head?

384
00:21:20,655 --> 00:21:23,533
[Student] Getting lynched?
[Instructor] Yes, retribution.

385
00:21:23,575 --> 00:21:25,493
They're going to come after us.

386
00:21:25,535 --> 00:21:26,661
So you could look at and say,

387
00:21:26,703 --> 00:21:29,956
you know, the situation's
not great, but

388
00:21:29,998 --> 00:21:31,499
I don't want to get lynched.

389
00:21:31,541 --> 00:21:34,586
I don't like people throwing
rocks through my windows.

390
00:21:37,672 --> 00:21:39,799
(woman on tv) The violence.

391
00:21:39,841 --> 00:21:45,263
Police officers pointed guns
into crowds of young people.

392
00:21:45,305 --> 00:21:47,599
It was shocking to me.

393
00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:51,353
Why are we still in a war in
this country over race?

394
00:21:51,394 --> 00:21:55,106
- Slavery?
- Slavery, It lasted 200 years.

395
00:21:55,148 --> 00:21:58,818
You have to develop a psychology
on the part of the white people

396
00:21:58,860 --> 00:22:03,239
who are doing this that involves
enormous acts of denial.

397
00:22:03,281 --> 00:22:08,495
We haven't even claimed it as
the horrific system that it was.

398
00:22:08,536 --> 00:22:12,040
- She says slavery is the cause.

399
00:22:13,333 --> 00:22:16,336
And so many white people that we
hear say, don't talk to me about

400
00:22:16,378 --> 00:22:20,048
slavery, I didn't own slaves,
my parents didn't own slaves.

401
00:22:20,090 --> 00:22:25,553
- The cultural conditioning that
began in slavery has continued.

402
00:22:25,595 --> 00:22:28,014
The privileges that you see some

403
00:22:28,056 --> 00:22:31,393
white people have
goes back to, I'm more than you.

404
00:22:31,434 --> 00:22:34,479
I'm better than you.
- Why? why? why?

405
00:22:34,521 --> 00:22:37,399
Why are they better?

406
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:38,817
- Oh, I don't believe it.
- I know it,

407
00:22:38,858 --> 00:22:40,985
but why do they
think they're better?

408
00:22:41,820 --> 00:22:43,363
- Privilege.

409
00:22:43,405 --> 00:22:44,948
Privilege has told
them they're better.

410
00:22:44,989 --> 00:22:46,950
- I mean, they don't even
know that they're privileged.

411
00:22:46,991 --> 00:22:48,660
I remember a book I read in
seminary.

412
00:22:48,702 --> 00:22:50,495
- Excuse me. I don't buy that.

413
00:22:50,537 --> 00:22:53,540
They don't
know they're privileged.

414
00:22:53,581 --> 00:22:55,083
- They have a

415
00:22:55,125 --> 00:23:00,630
well, no, I serve a congregation
of overeducated white people

416
00:23:00,672 --> 00:23:02,841
who don't recognize
their privilege.

417
00:23:02,882 --> 00:23:05,552
They don't see
that you start that.

418
00:23:05,593 --> 00:23:08,596
It's just the norm.
It's their norm.

419
00:23:08,638 --> 00:23:10,807
- If you don't feel that you
are privileged,

420
00:23:10,849 --> 00:23:15,562
how do you account
for the differences between

421
00:23:15,603 --> 00:23:18,231
white people and disadvantaged
black people?

422
00:23:18,273 --> 00:23:20,233
- They're not comparing
themselves to black people.

423
00:23:20,275 --> 00:23:23,111
Like my white friends are
mostly comparing themselves

424
00:23:23,153 --> 00:23:27,574
to other highly educated,
well-off white friends.

425
00:23:27,615 --> 00:23:31,494
- But when you say white people
can't get it, I don't.

426
00:23:31,536 --> 00:23:33,288
I don't buy it.

427
00:23:33,329 --> 00:23:34,497
- Well, I don't know why
they can't get.

428
00:23:34,539 --> 00:23:35,707
- I don't buy it for a moment.

429
00:23:35,749 --> 00:23:40,712
Since the 60s,
I have been proving myself.

430
00:23:40,754 --> 00:23:45,633
And there comes a point
in life when you say I'm done.

431
00:23:46,384 --> 00:23:50,013
It's on them now
because I know I'm Ok.

432
00:23:50,930 --> 00:23:53,516
So the way I look
at it, is your loss.

433
00:23:54,351 --> 00:23:57,687
I don't intend to spend all
of my life proving to white

434
00:23:57,729 --> 00:24:00,940
people that I'm Ok.
- Don't prove it

435
00:24:00,982 --> 00:24:03,485
just I think we've got to
educate.

436
00:24:03,526 --> 00:24:04,778
We got to educate them.
- No, we don't.

437
00:24:04,819 --> 00:24:06,112
- Well, I'm what I'm
saying is that

438
00:24:06,154 --> 00:24:09,824
there's nothing wrong with
having a conversation...

439
00:24:18,792 --> 00:24:20,335
[Instructor] Last night
I was at this dinner,

440
00:24:20,377 --> 00:24:22,003
it was this conversation about

441
00:24:22,045 --> 00:24:24,881
slavery being the source
of our racial problems.

442
00:24:24,923 --> 00:24:27,133
The topic of white
privilege came up a lot.

443
00:24:27,175 --> 00:24:28,760
You know, the idea of, you know,

444
00:24:28,802 --> 00:24:32,847
white people have
advantages in this country

445
00:24:32,889 --> 00:24:34,182
or,

446
00:24:34,224 --> 00:24:35,558
yeah, I mean, advantages.

447
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,936
Or you could flip it around,
say black people have

448
00:24:37,977 --> 00:24:42,524
disadvantages in this country
simply because of skin tone.

449
00:24:42,565 --> 00:24:44,150
[Student] I feel like it kind
of goes both ways.

450
00:24:44,192 --> 00:24:46,403
Sometimes white people
have a disadvantage.

451
00:24:46,444 --> 00:24:47,529
I had a friend
a couple of years ago,

452
00:24:47,570 --> 00:24:50,323
his cumulative GPA was
like a 4.26

453
00:24:50,365 --> 00:24:52,784
and then he had a friend
that was black

454
00:24:52,826 --> 00:24:55,078
that had like a 3.9
like a 33.

455
00:24:55,120 --> 00:24:56,162
And they both applied

456
00:24:56,204 --> 00:24:58,665
to Princeton
and the black kid got in.

457
00:24:58,707 --> 00:25:00,875
I feel like everyone says, well,
there's a lot of white

458
00:25:00,917 --> 00:25:04,170
privilege, so we have to give
other, like

459
00:25:04,212 --> 00:25:07,132
other ethnicities advantages
in this place instead of trying

460
00:25:07,173 --> 00:25:09,759
to view everyone as
just like an American.

461
00:25:09,801 --> 00:25:11,428
[Student] I mean, just
not talking about

462
00:25:11,469 --> 00:25:13,763
the race issue, just not

463
00:25:13,805 --> 00:25:18,393
bringing it up to the next
generation would

464
00:25:18,435 --> 00:25:22,522
keep them natural in that sense
and they would not be racist.

465
00:25:22,564 --> 00:25:24,274
- I don't
think that slavery

466
00:25:24,315 --> 00:25:27,694
and the Civil War and Jim Crow
should be forgotten.

467
00:25:27,736 --> 00:25:29,362
I think that they should be
remembered because I think

468
00:25:29,404 --> 00:25:32,699
they're an important lesson
that America isn't perfect

469
00:25:32,741 --> 00:25:35,994
and to, like, work against
that in the future.

470
00:25:36,036 --> 00:25:37,704
[Instructor] If you look
at things like

471
00:25:37,746 --> 00:25:40,040
the incarceration rate for,
you know,

472
00:25:40,081 --> 00:25:44,419
young black men in this country,
why it's so disproportional or

473
00:25:44,461 --> 00:25:48,173
why you have the socioeconomic
situations that you have

474
00:25:48,214 --> 00:25:50,717
between, say,
white people and black people,

475
00:25:50,759 --> 00:25:54,012
that you can see this
didn't come out of nowhere.

476
00:25:54,054 --> 00:25:57,432
This isn't a reflection of
the tone of somebody's skin.

477
00:25:57,474 --> 00:26:00,894
It's based in history that goes
back before your generation,

478
00:26:00,935 --> 00:26:03,521
before my generation,
before my grandparents.

479
00:26:03,563 --> 00:26:05,106
It goes way back.

480
00:26:05,148 --> 00:26:06,399
[Student] I think
there's a balance

481
00:26:06,441 --> 00:26:08,318
between recognizing our past,

482
00:26:08,360 --> 00:26:12,113
but also not over talking it
and just overemphasizing

483
00:26:12,155 --> 00:26:14,032
the problem to where it's
always on our minds.

484
00:26:14,074 --> 00:26:18,370
And then it's difficult to be
very equal when that's something

485
00:26:18,411 --> 00:26:22,791
that's always on your mind,
is racism and things like that.

486
00:26:29,631 --> 00:26:32,634
(somber music)

487
00:26:33,301 --> 00:26:34,844
- So please welcome

488
00:26:34,886 --> 00:26:36,971
Dr. Kelly Carter Jackson.

489
00:26:37,013 --> 00:26:38,390
(applause)

490
00:26:39,140 --> 00:26:40,767
[Kelly] So first off,
I want to tell you

491
00:26:40,809 --> 00:26:43,353
a story about one
of my students,

492
00:26:43,395 --> 00:26:48,441
he raised his hand and he said,
who is Harriet Tubman?

493
00:26:48,483 --> 00:26:52,112
I was like, oh, my God,
I tried really hard, you know,

494
00:26:52,153 --> 00:26:53,905
to sort of like as a professor,
you have to, like,

495
00:26:53,947 --> 00:26:56,783
fix your face before I
could answer the question.

496
00:26:56,825 --> 00:26:59,703
He goes, oh, I remember.

497
00:26:59,744 --> 00:27:01,913
She's the woman who wouldn't
get off the bus.

498
00:27:01,955 --> 00:27:05,500
And I was like, no, no,
that's not her at all.

499
00:27:05,542 --> 00:27:06,918
But it's important because I

500
00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:09,963
think it highlights the fact
that we only see, like,

501
00:27:10,005 --> 00:27:13,967
one great black man and one
great black woman per century.

502
00:27:14,009 --> 00:27:16,386
So, Force and Freedom,
my book really tries

503
00:27:16,428 --> 00:27:20,306
to introduce new voices and
to highlight black abolitionist

504
00:27:20,348 --> 00:27:21,599
in particular.

505
00:27:21,641 --> 00:27:24,185
The moment the first black
person is enslaved,

506
00:27:24,227 --> 00:27:27,230
they're pushing back. They're
collecting arms as much as they

507
00:27:27,272 --> 00:27:31,317
possibly can to prepare for what
they believe is inevitable,

508
00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,237
and that is the violent
overthrow of slavery.

509
00:27:34,279 --> 00:27:37,741
- There seems to be a kind
of particular resistance

510
00:27:37,782 --> 00:27:42,954
to teaching this aspect
of American history.

511
00:27:42,996 --> 00:27:45,123
And, look and I think,
you know, I'm also a historian

512
00:27:45,165 --> 00:27:47,834
I can understand.
I can dissipate why.

513
00:27:47,876 --> 00:27:51,171
But I just want to get
you to talk about

514
00:27:51,212 --> 00:27:52,714
it takes your book

515
00:27:52,756 --> 00:27:56,551
to underscore force
as well as freedom.

516
00:27:56,593 --> 00:27:58,011
You know,
and we all know that that's

517
00:27:58,053 --> 00:28:00,972
a part of this history, but it's
not taught that way.

518
00:28:01,014 --> 00:28:02,682
[Kelly] It's not taught,
I think,

519
00:28:02,724 --> 00:28:07,687
because we have this
hypocritical, I think,

520
00:28:07,729 --> 00:28:09,939
hypocritical love
affair with violence.

521
00:28:09,981 --> 00:28:14,527
We talk about violence, I think,
in these really romantic ways.

522
00:28:14,569 --> 00:28:17,989
But that's only when we're
talking about white men.

523
00:28:18,031 --> 00:28:20,283
When the situation is reversed,

524
00:28:20,325 --> 00:28:25,246
it is terrifying to think
of black people using force or

525
00:28:25,288 --> 00:28:27,457
using violence to bring
about their freedom.

526
00:28:33,254 --> 00:28:36,049
(crew chatter)

527
00:28:36,091 --> 00:28:37,342
[Director] so I want
to talk to you about

528
00:28:37,384 --> 00:28:40,470
what you've learned so far,
right, in college.

529
00:28:40,512 --> 00:28:41,846
Is there anything you've learned

530
00:28:41,888 --> 00:28:44,057
here about the story
of the civil war that would be

531
00:28:44,099 --> 00:28:46,309
hard to talk about
with people back home?

532
00:28:46,351 --> 00:28:48,937
[Student] Yeah, my
daddy is that typical

533
00:28:48,978 --> 00:28:51,147
Southern male,
a lot of he knows

534
00:28:51,189 --> 00:28:53,900
everything and you
don't question him.

535
00:28:53,942 --> 00:28:56,069
And, you know,
I love him to death.

536
00:28:56,111 --> 00:28:57,195
That's just the way he

537
00:28:57,237 --> 00:28:58,530
is, that's the way people
are down here.

538
00:28:58,571 --> 00:29:00,615
If I told him that the main

539
00:29:00,657 --> 00:29:05,870
cause of the Civil War was
slavery and he would probably

540
00:29:06,538 --> 00:29:09,040
like open the Bible and start

541
00:29:09,082 --> 00:29:12,752
preaching at me and stuff
like that, I don't know.

542
00:29:12,794 --> 00:29:14,754
[Director] How would he
find that offensive?

543
00:29:14,796 --> 00:29:16,715
Well, my

544
00:29:16,756 --> 00:29:18,174
great great grandfather did

545
00:29:18,216 --> 00:29:21,928
fight in the Civil War
and he did come back like he

546
00:29:21,970 --> 00:29:23,722
didn't die or anything.
He came back alive.

547
00:29:23,763 --> 00:29:25,015
But it may set him up so bad.

548
00:29:25,056 --> 00:29:26,558
And it was a bad situation

549
00:29:26,599 --> 00:29:29,769
for my family at the time that
I would not know near enough

550
00:29:29,811 --> 00:29:32,772
about to really like
be able to give details.

551
00:29:32,814 --> 00:29:34,190
But

552
00:29:34,232 --> 00:29:38,236
it's just like a remembrance
of how hard times were

553
00:29:38,278 --> 00:29:40,530
at that time,
because it was really hard

554
00:29:40,572 --> 00:29:45,577
for my family because we're
born and raised in Pontotoc,
Mississippi.

555
00:29:45,618 --> 00:29:48,455
And like in my grandparents

556
00:29:48,496 --> 00:29:52,208
house, there's a no telling
how old rebel

557
00:29:52,250 --> 00:29:55,628
flag like in one of those
flag boxes like this.

558
00:29:55,670 --> 00:29:58,631
And we don't,
you know, take it out.

559
00:29:58,673 --> 00:29:59,966
We don't rub it
in people's noses.

560
00:30:00,008 --> 00:30:03,011
It's just, you know,
up there above a cabinet.

561
00:30:06,806 --> 00:30:09,267
(Rhythmic drum music)

562
00:30:16,191 --> 00:30:18,151
- It has been called the war

563
00:30:18,193 --> 00:30:21,571
brother against brother,
the Civil War

564
00:30:21,613 --> 00:30:25,241
soldier and nation together
found that their fears

565
00:30:25,283 --> 00:30:28,620
and doubts were not so
strong as their faith.

566
00:30:28,661 --> 00:30:30,830
And in national shrines like

567
00:30:30,872 --> 00:30:33,667
Gettysburg,
we memorialize the men of both

568
00:30:33,708 --> 00:30:37,337
sides who gave of themselves
unreservedly for what they

569
00:30:37,379 --> 00:30:42,509
believe to be right.
Remember and be proud.

570
00:30:47,347 --> 00:30:51,184
[Dr. Blight] We've never really
had a racial reckoning.

571
00:30:52,310 --> 00:30:56,356
The problem started first
immediately after the war,

572
00:30:56,398 --> 00:30:59,609
if you want north and south
to get together and get along

573
00:30:59,651 --> 00:31:03,196
again, you don't talk about
causes and consequences.

574
00:31:03,238 --> 00:31:07,117
You talk about the mutual
valor on that battlefield.

575
00:31:11,329 --> 00:31:13,623
(somber music)

576
00:31:19,671 --> 00:31:21,214
Why doesn't that Confederacy,

577
00:31:21,256 --> 00:31:24,300
which only lasted four
years, just go away?

578
00:31:24,342 --> 00:31:27,470
The racial reasons are
paramount, but it also has to do

579
00:31:27,512 --> 00:31:31,891
with this idea that the
Confederacy was a decent.

580
00:31:31,933 --> 00:31:33,435
Man, they went to the limit and

581
00:31:33,476 --> 00:31:37,022
they deserved respect
for all that courage.

582
00:31:38,273 --> 00:31:41,234
They claim after they've lost
that they were only reacting

583
00:31:41,276 --> 00:31:45,071
to the overreach
of centralized federal power.

584
00:31:46,364 --> 00:31:50,493
And there's a kind of admiration
for that still in our culture.

585
00:31:53,830 --> 00:31:57,375
(upbeat music)

586
00:32:05,008 --> 00:32:09,137
- James McGill,
he settled this farm almost 200

587
00:32:09,179 --> 00:32:13,141
years ago, and I felt like I've
followed in his footsteps.

588
00:32:13,183 --> 00:32:16,519
My wife raised the children.

589
00:32:16,561 --> 00:32:18,438
All I ever did was work.

590
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:20,440
Of course, now, federal
government took my farm.

591
00:32:20,482 --> 00:32:21,649
So

592
00:32:22,067 --> 00:32:24,110
so I had it financed

593
00:32:24,152 --> 00:32:26,905
with federal government,
farmers, home administration.

594
00:32:26,946 --> 00:32:28,782
They wouldn't redo my loans.

595
00:32:28,823 --> 00:32:30,784
During the war
and reconstruction.

596
00:32:30,825 --> 00:32:32,786
People in the South
lost everything.

597
00:32:32,827 --> 00:32:35,455
Well, I can empathize with them.

598
00:32:35,497 --> 00:32:38,541
It made me mad and I couldn't
understand why they were mad.

599
00:32:38,583 --> 00:32:41,252
And they and they spent 150
years and them

600
00:32:41,294 --> 00:32:44,005
people are still mad
in the south about it.

601
00:32:44,047 --> 00:32:47,634
It's wrong for the federal
government to dictate

602
00:32:47,676 --> 00:32:50,720
to the states what they
should or should not do.

603
00:32:50,762 --> 00:32:55,475
And ever since the war, no
one's property has been secure.

604
00:32:55,517 --> 00:32:59,229
And there's a lot of talk
of reparations for slaves.

605
00:32:59,270 --> 00:33:03,983
You know, my great great
grandfather, nobody paid

606
00:33:04,025 --> 00:33:06,194
Abraham Lincoln,
emancipated the slaves.

607
00:33:06,236 --> 00:33:08,113
He didn't get paid for it.

608
00:33:08,154 --> 00:33:10,407
The war to prevent southern

609
00:33:10,448 --> 00:33:14,828
independence changed our
country for the worse.

610
00:33:15,412 --> 00:33:18,289
In my opinion.
- And what do you think?

611
00:33:18,331 --> 00:33:20,458
Do you think the war changed
the country for the worse?

612
00:33:20,500 --> 00:33:23,336
- I'm trying to process
everything.

613
00:33:24,671 --> 00:33:27,215
I do understand

614
00:33:28,508 --> 00:33:32,303
parts of what my father's
speaking on because I feel

615
00:33:32,345 --> 00:33:37,726
that way, that the government is
too big and has too much power.

616
00:33:37,767 --> 00:33:39,019
It's an invasion.

617
00:33:39,060 --> 00:33:42,689
But how long would it take
to free the slaves?

618
00:33:42,731 --> 00:33:44,649
How long would it have taken

619
00:33:44,691 --> 00:33:48,028
for them to realize
that slavery is wrong?

620
00:33:48,069 --> 00:33:49,320
[Director] Do you
think slavery left

621
00:33:49,362 --> 00:33:52,198
an imprint on the mindset
of people in America?

622
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,994
- Sure.
It left an imprint, but

623
00:33:56,661 --> 00:33:58,872
I'm saying the war left
more of an imprint.

624
00:33:58,913 --> 00:34:02,042
That's my personal opinion.
[Director] For black and white?

625
00:34:02,083 --> 00:34:03,251
- Yes.

626
00:34:03,293 --> 00:34:04,961
[Director] So you feel
like the war itself

627
00:34:05,003 --> 00:34:07,047
was a bigger aggression
than slavery?

628
00:34:07,088 --> 00:34:08,298
- Yes.

629
00:34:08,340 --> 00:34:10,467
[Director] It feels like
you're dismissing

630
00:34:10,508 --> 00:34:13,511
the experience of millions
of enslaved people.

631
00:34:14,471 --> 00:34:18,016
It feels like you're
not seeing what they

632
00:34:18,058 --> 00:34:23,355
experienced at the hands of the
people who were enslaving them.

633
00:34:23,813 --> 00:34:25,899
I mean, how is treating people

634
00:34:25,940 --> 00:34:29,069
as property not
a greater horror?

635
00:34:29,110 --> 00:34:31,279
- Well, my feeling was
that it was legal.

636
00:34:31,321 --> 00:34:35,909
It was a settled way of or they
had laws that they

637
00:34:35,950 --> 00:34:42,123
had to live up to and forced
on them and treat them like

638
00:34:42,165 --> 00:34:46,628
civilly.
I don't hate James McGill.

639
00:34:46,670 --> 00:34:49,756
I just want our schools
and universities to stop

640
00:34:49,798 --> 00:34:53,218
teaching our children to hate
our southern ancestors.

641
00:34:53,259 --> 00:34:55,220
They don't deserve that.

642
00:35:00,308 --> 00:35:03,311
(ominous music)

643
00:35:08,942 --> 00:35:11,319
[Director] Do you know what
the Confederate flag looks like?

644
00:35:11,361 --> 00:35:14,656
[Student] Yes, it has a cross
and it's red, white and blue

645
00:35:14,698 --> 00:35:17,158
with stars going
through the cross.

646
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:19,119
[Director] Where have you
seen that flag?

647
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:21,621
- I see it
when I'm driving,

648
00:35:21,663 --> 00:35:25,333
when I'm traveling,
I see at, where I live,

649
00:35:25,375 --> 00:35:28,294
I live in the countryside,
and the countryside

650
00:35:28,336 --> 00:35:29,838
I travel to Greenwood and it's

651
00:35:29,879 --> 00:35:32,966
white people back
there, there's no black people.

652
00:35:33,008 --> 00:35:34,467
And I see a lot of Confederate

653
00:35:34,509 --> 00:35:37,262
flags that hang out the houses
to hang out the mailboxes.

654
00:35:37,303 --> 00:35:39,556
I see it on the back
of people trucks.

655
00:35:39,597 --> 00:35:41,433
[Director] And what does
it make you think?

656
00:35:43,018 --> 00:35:44,561
- Grow up.

657
00:35:46,062 --> 00:35:47,647
Basically.

658
00:35:47,689 --> 00:35:49,816
[Director] In class, you said
you were a good public speaker.

659
00:35:49,858 --> 00:35:51,568
- Yes, I am.

660
00:35:51,609 --> 00:35:53,570
[Director] What makes
you a good speaker?

661
00:35:53,611 --> 00:35:56,322
- My projection,
my performance.

662
00:35:56,364 --> 00:35:59,284
When I speak,
I capture your attention.

663
00:35:59,325 --> 00:36:01,286
I know that I capture attention.

664
00:36:01,327 --> 00:36:05,040
I do oratoricals. I've
won first place in

665
00:36:05,749 --> 00:36:08,293
five, six oratoriclas. That's
all of them I

666
00:36:08,335 --> 00:36:12,297
competed in and I won
second place once.

667
00:36:13,256 --> 00:36:14,674
[Director] I hadn't
noticed any white kids

668
00:36:14,716 --> 00:36:16,676
at the school, are there any
white kids at this school?

669
00:36:16,718 --> 00:36:19,304
- No.
[Director] Why is that?

670
00:36:21,639 --> 00:36:23,350
- I would say,
in my personal opinion,

671
00:36:23,391 --> 00:36:26,978
I don't know if this why,
but I will simply say

672
00:36:27,020 --> 00:36:31,858
the fact of segregation like is,
is how we are here, like.

673
00:36:31,900 --> 00:36:34,736
It just socially happened like
this is the black kids school,

674
00:36:34,778 --> 00:36:37,697
Central Holmes is the
white kids school,

675
00:36:37,739 --> 00:36:40,283
that's just how
the neighborhood,

676
00:36:40,325 --> 00:36:42,702
that's how the parents
separated everything.

677
00:36:42,744 --> 00:36:45,955
[Director] Have you ever had
a white friend?

678
00:36:45,997 --> 00:36:47,540
- No.

679
00:36:48,500 --> 00:36:52,504
No, I've never, I've never.

680
00:36:53,713 --> 00:36:56,049
Been around a white person
long enough. I've never had

681
00:36:56,091 --> 00:37:01,388
a complete conversation
to even become associates.

682
00:37:01,429 --> 00:37:02,639
[Director] Do you
think that the civil

683
00:37:02,681 --> 00:37:04,265
war was relevant to your life?

684
00:37:04,307 --> 00:37:06,101
- I feel that
it's relevant because

685
00:37:06,142 --> 00:37:09,688
your past, your
history is your story.

686
00:37:10,438 --> 00:37:13,817
Whether or not you know or
not, it's your story.

687
00:37:16,111 --> 00:37:18,571
(children chatter)

688
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:27,914
(dramatic music)

689
00:37:38,425 --> 00:37:41,469
- These are the 209,145
African Americans

690
00:37:41,511 --> 00:37:44,097
in the union army,
that fought in the Civil War.

691
00:37:44,139 --> 00:37:47,434
They served in every branch
in the Army. 142 Color

692
00:37:47,475 --> 00:37:50,061
Infantry Regiments,
7 Color Calvary Regiments,

693
00:37:50,103 --> 00:37:53,523
13 Color Artillery Regiments,
and it's color pioneer
regiments.

694
00:37:53,565 --> 00:37:56,484
They looked at each as family
because if you serving

695
00:37:56,526 --> 00:38:00,780
for three years, all you
have is your comrades,

696
00:38:00,822 --> 00:38:02,115
(marching count)

697
00:38:02,157 --> 00:38:04,200
- your left, your left, right.

698
00:38:04,242 --> 00:38:07,120
Who's on your left.

699
00:38:07,162 --> 00:38:08,580
Your left,

700
00:38:09,414 --> 00:38:13,668
your left, your left, right.
Your left,

701
00:38:15,086 --> 00:38:16,504
your left,

702
00:38:17,380 --> 00:38:20,884
your left, your left, your left,
right.

703
00:38:22,427 --> 00:38:24,012
Company, halt.

704
00:38:24,054 --> 00:38:26,556
So this is the African-American
Civil War Museum.

705
00:38:26,598 --> 00:38:27,932
The monument and museum

706
00:38:27,974 --> 00:38:31,102
were built to correct
a great wrong in history.

707
00:38:31,144 --> 00:38:32,854
America has wrote
a history about

708
00:38:32,896 --> 00:38:36,900
that whole conflict that did not
include African-Americans

709
00:38:36,941 --> 00:38:39,361
and these African-American
soldiers and their great role

710
00:38:39,402 --> 00:38:42,822
in ending that war
to preserve the nation

711
00:38:42,864 --> 00:38:44,783
and enslavement here
in the United States.

712
00:38:44,824 --> 00:38:46,659
The war started,
but for two years,

713
00:38:46,701 --> 00:38:48,661
President Lincoln wouldn't
let blacks join the army.

714
00:38:48,703 --> 00:38:51,623
Well, once he realized he
couldn't win this war without us

715
00:38:51,664 --> 00:38:54,668
then the war starts to change
in Lincoln's favor.

716
00:38:54,709 --> 00:38:58,254
150,000, they were enslaved,
living in those southern states.

717
00:38:58,296 --> 00:38:59,631
They literally end up

718
00:38:59,673 --> 00:39:01,841
with uniforms on and rifles
in their pockets.

719
00:39:01,883 --> 00:39:03,760
So if you're thinking
to yourself, I live in a world

720
00:39:03,802 --> 00:39:05,512
that's out of control
and there's nothing I can do

721
00:39:05,553 --> 00:39:08,098
about it. Well, there is
something you can do about it
and you can

722
00:39:08,139 --> 00:39:10,850
take lessons from these people
whose stories we tell here

723
00:39:10,892 --> 00:39:14,604
in this museum.
I think it's liberating.

724
00:39:17,565 --> 00:39:19,192
[Director] We're making
this film about how

725
00:39:19,234 --> 00:39:20,860
we tell the story
of the Civil War.

726
00:39:20,902 --> 00:39:23,029
And I think you guys just
finished that unit, right?

727
00:39:23,071 --> 00:39:24,114
[Student] yeah.

728
00:39:24,155 --> 00:39:25,740
[Director] What did you think?

729
00:39:25,782 --> 00:39:27,784
[Student] You know, I feel like
it's living in this country is

730
00:39:27,826 --> 00:39:29,828
like, oh, the civil war,
you know about it.

731
00:39:29,869 --> 00:39:34,874
But when you start to learn
about it, there's so many, like,

732
00:39:36,334 --> 00:39:39,212
intricate details
of why things happened.

733
00:39:39,254 --> 00:39:43,091
And I think it's important
that we learn about it.

734
00:39:43,133 --> 00:39:45,093
But the one thing that

735
00:39:45,135 --> 00:39:46,970
does,

736
00:39:47,012 --> 00:39:49,431
like, not concern me, but

737
00:39:50,432 --> 00:39:51,933
most people here have the same

738
00:39:51,975 --> 00:39:55,562
kinds of political views which,
you know, it's great to be

739
00:39:55,603 --> 00:39:57,731
around people
who think like you.

740
00:39:57,772 --> 00:40:02,318
But at the same time, there's
no, like, real conversation.

741
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:03,820
There's no real dialog

742
00:40:03,862 --> 00:40:07,032
and understanding like
people who have different views

743
00:40:07,073 --> 00:40:10,326
than you, which is, I think,
how we can move forward.

744
00:40:10,368 --> 00:40:14,039
Um, I think that's important.
- And in order for people

745
00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:16,666
to really get your perspective
and understand where you're

746
00:40:16,708 --> 00:40:20,086
coming from, what's one thing
they should know about you?

747
00:40:20,128 --> 00:40:21,546
- Right.

748
00:40:22,464 --> 00:40:24,132
I mean,

749
00:40:24,716 --> 00:40:26,593
the biggest thing
for me is gender.

750
00:40:26,634 --> 00:40:32,182
I try to present as
masculinely as I can, but,

751
00:40:32,849 --> 00:40:37,354
you know, people still sometimes

752
00:40:37,395 --> 00:40:41,900
take me for a girl and that's
like the biggest thing that's

753
00:40:41,941 --> 00:40:45,028
kind of hard for me
to deal with.

754
00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:54,662
Yeah, that's probably the big
that's the biggest one.

755
00:40:54,704 --> 00:40:58,124
[Director] It's like you're not
getting fully seen.

756
00:40:58,166 --> 00:40:59,834
- Right, yeah.

757
00:41:08,927 --> 00:41:10,804
[Dr. Blight] Reconstruction has
been the most

758
00:41:10,845 --> 00:41:15,183
contested question in America's
historical memory.

759
00:41:15,225 --> 00:41:17,018
Reconstruction is a period

760
00:41:17,060 --> 00:41:20,730
of time that begins immediately
after the war,

761
00:41:20,772 --> 00:41:26,528
a 10 to 12 year era when America
had to truly reinvent itself.

762
00:41:28,363 --> 00:41:30,115
Fourteenth Amendment puts equal

763
00:41:30,156 --> 00:41:34,119
protection of the law
into the U.S. Constitution.

764
00:41:35,537 --> 00:41:39,958
And the right to vote for black
men in the 15th Amendment was

765
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:42,711
a constitutional and legal
revolution,

766
00:41:42,752 --> 00:41:45,547
and some black spokesmen
by the 1890s and the turn

767
00:41:45,588 --> 00:41:51,094
of the 20th century would often
refer to 1865 as the year zero

768
00:41:51,136 --> 00:41:55,223
of a new calendar, a new
beginning to history itself.

769
00:42:00,353 --> 00:42:02,188
But you have to incorporate

770
00:42:02,230 --> 00:42:06,568
the white south
into an American union,

771
00:42:06,609 --> 00:42:10,113
a society
that had just lost approximately

772
00:42:10,155 --> 00:42:15,285
18 percent of its adult
male population in war.

773
00:42:17,412 --> 00:42:21,249
How do you reunify those people

774
00:42:21,291 --> 00:42:26,254
at the emotional level with
the side that is the victor?

775
00:42:34,012 --> 00:42:36,723
- We're having our monthly
Civil War roundtable,

776
00:42:36,765 --> 00:42:39,059
we call ourselves the
East Bridgewater Civil War

777
00:42:39,100 --> 00:42:43,146
Roundtable, named after a town.
- We sent 300 men from this
town.

778
00:42:43,188 --> 00:42:46,900
- I think it was four.
- Closer to 400.

779
00:42:46,941 --> 00:42:49,778
- 50 of them died. The basis
of our meeting tonight.

780
00:42:49,819 --> 00:42:51,613
We call it reconstruction.

781
00:42:51,654 --> 00:42:54,199
You know, what went right
and what went wrong.

782
00:42:54,240 --> 00:42:55,700
All right.

783
00:42:55,742 --> 00:42:57,494
Holy mackerel.
Hello.

784
00:42:57,535 --> 00:42:59,579
Hello.
What a crowd.

785
00:42:59,621 --> 00:43:01,748
We're going to talk about
reconstruction,

786
00:43:01,790 --> 00:43:07,921
the physical period of time
from from 1865 to 1877.

787
00:43:07,962 --> 00:43:10,882
You know, in the school system,
we came to reconstruction

788
00:43:10,924 --> 00:43:13,176
and the chapter ended
on the Civil War.

789
00:43:13,218 --> 00:43:16,221
- How are you going to rebuild
this part of the country

790
00:43:16,262 --> 00:43:20,433
with malice towards...
as Lincoln's words.

791
00:43:20,475 --> 00:43:22,018
How are you going to do that?

792
00:43:22,060 --> 00:43:25,855
- No one on the civilian side
on the Confederate presidency

793
00:43:25,897 --> 00:43:30,276
was ever forced to concede and
repudiate what they believed.

794
00:43:30,318 --> 00:43:34,239
And we allowed a group of people
that waged an armed insurrection

795
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:38,368
against their government to
build statues to their heroes.

796
00:43:38,410 --> 00:43:40,245
So that has kept it alive.

797
00:43:40,286 --> 00:43:43,915
We have never solved the core
problem, the civil war.

798
00:43:43,957 --> 00:43:46,042
And that's why reconstruction
didn't have a chance. The north

799
00:43:46,084 --> 00:43:47,711
was fighting back
and forth during

800
00:43:47,752 --> 00:43:49,004
the whole reconstruction period.

801
00:43:49,045 --> 00:43:50,714
And let's not forget
the elephant in the middle

802
00:43:50,755 --> 00:43:55,969
of the room, north and south
were racists, period.

803
00:43:56,011 --> 00:44:00,098
The black was not considered
to be a human being.

804
00:44:01,182 --> 00:44:02,517
- How are ya?

805
00:44:02,559 --> 00:44:03,518
[Director] Excuse me, I have a
question.

806
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:04,728
Have you ever had

807
00:44:04,769 --> 00:44:06,438
an African-American
member in this group?

808
00:44:06,479 --> 00:44:07,897
Because it struck me

809
00:44:07,939 --> 00:44:10,900
in the conversation about
race that everyone was white.

810
00:44:10,942 --> 00:44:13,194
- No, we haven't.
- Have you looked at

811
00:44:13,236 --> 00:44:17,407
the demographic of east
Bridgewater and the area?

812
00:44:19,409 --> 00:44:21,077
- Where in the 90s,

813
00:44:21,119 --> 00:44:24,664
which is well,
which is an odd thing because we

814
00:44:24,706 --> 00:44:29,753
live, we border Brockton,
which is predominantly

815
00:44:29,794 --> 00:44:33,173
minorities, which are
really the majorities now.

816
00:44:33,214 --> 00:44:36,009
I mean, how do you reach
out to say that they're welcome?

817
00:44:36,051 --> 00:44:37,510
Well, I mean, they're welcome,
but how do you

818
00:44:37,552 --> 00:44:39,846
make them feel that
they're welcome?

819
00:44:39,888 --> 00:44:42,766
I mean, here I think we'd
make them feel welcomed.

820
00:44:42,807 --> 00:44:44,142
How do you how do you do that?

821
00:44:44,184 --> 00:44:47,103
I mean, yeah,
that's a good question.

822
00:44:47,145 --> 00:44:48,688
I'll have to think about that.

823
00:44:48,730 --> 00:44:51,274
The same question is why we live
right next to Brockton and we

824
00:44:51,316 --> 00:44:53,318
don't have a large
population of blacks.

825
00:44:54,527 --> 00:44:57,364
- I live in the town of Kingston
and there's not a large

826
00:44:57,405 --> 00:44:59,657
population of blacks
in the town of Kingston.

827
00:44:59,699 --> 00:45:01,201
You know,

828
00:45:01,242 --> 00:45:03,203
the Silverlake Regional High
School is the fourth or fifth

829
00:45:03,244 --> 00:45:08,041
largest diversified high school
with, you know, 1500 kids in it.

830
00:45:08,083 --> 00:45:09,876
I mean, there are
a few families.

831
00:45:09,918 --> 00:45:13,296
But why? Yet,
you go into Brockton

832
00:45:13,338 --> 00:45:16,841
or you go into New Bedford or
Fall River, the cities,

833
00:45:16,883 --> 00:45:19,886
you tend to find a larger
minority community.

834
00:45:19,928 --> 00:45:21,638
Is it because those minorities

835
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:24,891
feel more comfortable there?
You know?

836
00:45:24,933 --> 00:45:25,934
I don't know.

837
00:45:25,975 --> 00:45:28,061
I don't have the answers.

838
00:45:41,866 --> 00:45:47,455
* Facing the rising sun *

839
00:45:47,497 --> 00:45:52,335
* of our new day begun *

840
00:45:52,377 --> 00:46:02,262
* let's us march on
til victory is won *

841
00:46:02,595 --> 00:46:03,972
Woo!

842
00:46:04,014 --> 00:46:06,182
[Greg] At the end it says
shadow beneath our hand

843
00:46:06,224 --> 00:46:09,602
may be forever stand,
true to our God,

844
00:46:09,644 --> 00:46:12,981
true to our native land.

845
00:46:13,023 --> 00:46:15,233
See, these guys were tricky.
By native land

846
00:46:15,275 --> 00:46:17,360
what were they talking about?
[Student] Us.

847
00:46:17,402 --> 00:46:19,279
[Greg] Us, our land?

848
00:46:19,320 --> 00:46:21,823
Meaning what? What does
us mean to you?

849
00:46:21,865 --> 00:46:23,742
What was reconstruction?

850
00:46:23,783 --> 00:46:28,121
When was it? After slavery.
Yes.

851
00:46:28,163 --> 00:46:30,957
- After the Civil War.
- After the Civil War.

852
00:46:30,999 --> 00:46:33,251
This was when
black people tried to teach

853
00:46:33,293 --> 00:46:35,962
America how to have a real
democracy during reconstruction,

854
00:46:36,004 --> 00:46:38,673
black people were able to vote
in the South and they got

855
00:46:38,715 --> 00:46:41,801
in the state legislators
and passed laws

856
00:46:41,843 --> 00:46:44,679
to say things like, everybody
should go to school for free.

857
00:46:44,721 --> 00:46:45,889
And they say white people too?

858
00:46:45,930 --> 00:46:47,849
Yeah, white people,
you poor white people.

859
00:46:47,891 --> 00:46:49,309
This man right here,

860
00:46:49,351 --> 00:46:51,394
John Mercer Langston, came
out of slavery in Virginia.

861
00:46:51,436 --> 00:46:55,065
He came to D.C.
as a congressman from Virginia.

862
00:46:55,106 --> 00:46:57,317
This man was born into slavery.

863
00:46:57,359 --> 00:47:00,320
You know, he's crazy.
I got seen, no problem, I'll

864
00:47:00,362 --> 00:47:03,073
be back. You know, I mean,
it's Congressman Langston now.

865
00:47:03,114 --> 00:47:04,949
That's why I love
reconstruction.

866
00:47:04,991 --> 00:47:06,451
You had real heroes.

867
00:47:06,493 --> 00:47:09,329
Are we any different
than these people were?

868
00:47:09,371 --> 00:47:11,164
No, we're not.
You know the difference?

869
00:47:11,206 --> 00:47:12,999
We just don't remember.

870
00:47:13,041 --> 00:47:15,502
My name is Greg Carr and I'm

871
00:47:15,543 --> 00:47:17,462
an associate professor and chair
of the Department

872
00:47:17,504 --> 00:47:20,423
of Afro-American Studies
here at Howard University.

873
00:47:20,465 --> 00:47:22,717
[Director] And what connection
do you have to the history,

874
00:47:22,759 --> 00:47:25,512
to the history of the civil
war and reconstruction?

875
00:47:25,553 --> 00:47:26,888
[Greg] Well,

876
00:47:26,930 --> 00:47:29,432
in addition to the direct
history, my ancestors have

877
00:47:29,474 --> 00:47:32,977
been brought here from
North Carolina and Alabama.

878
00:47:33,019 --> 00:47:35,063
No civil war veterans

879
00:47:35,105 --> 00:47:38,858
in my direct family, but we
were enslaved in Alabama.

880
00:47:38,900 --> 00:47:42,028
So obviously coming
out of civil war,

881
00:47:42,070 --> 00:47:45,031
my family
sharecroppers come in the areas

882
00:47:45,073 --> 00:47:48,702
of Jim Crow, Great Migration
moving throughout the south.

883
00:47:48,743 --> 00:47:51,871
You know, I'm a living part
of that stream of history.

884
00:47:51,913 --> 00:47:54,541
And as a professor here
at Howard University

885
00:47:54,582 --> 00:47:56,835
and particularly in Africana
studies, which is my field

886
00:47:56,876 --> 00:48:01,297
of study in the area I work in,
devote a great part of my work

887
00:48:01,339 --> 00:48:03,508
to understanding
the implications of the civil

888
00:48:03,550 --> 00:48:07,053
war and reconstruction in terms
of contemporary American life.

889
00:48:07,095 --> 00:48:08,972
What's this right here?

890
00:48:09,014 --> 00:48:10,849
[Students] Deed of sale.

891
00:48:10,890 --> 00:48:12,142
[Greg] Deed of sale.

892
00:48:12,183 --> 00:48:14,227
These are reconstruction
era documents.

893
00:48:14,269 --> 00:48:16,563
Most people in the country
don't know anything about that.

894
00:48:16,604 --> 00:48:18,064
So you can say, oh,

895
00:48:18,106 --> 00:48:20,108
we saw the charter, we saw
the deed of sale for the land.

896
00:48:20,150 --> 00:48:21,609
[Director] You know,

897
00:48:21,651 --> 00:48:24,237
you're the only teacher I filmed
who's focused on the freed

898
00:48:24,279 --> 00:48:27,574
people's point of view when
teaching reconstruction.

899
00:48:27,615 --> 00:48:29,159
How does teaching

900
00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:31,036
from that point of view make
a difference for your students?

901
00:48:31,077 --> 00:48:32,746
[Greg] What I hope
they will walk out

902
00:48:32,787 --> 00:48:37,917
with a sense of human purpose
that they have a stake in.

903
00:48:37,959 --> 00:48:39,169
There's always the threat

904
00:48:39,210 --> 00:48:42,547
of forgetting in terms
of national memory.

905
00:48:42,589 --> 00:48:44,758
When you start talking about
a settler state like

906
00:48:44,799 --> 00:48:47,385
the United States that came out
of a settler colony with many

907
00:48:47,427 --> 00:48:50,263
different people,
there's almost a required

908
00:48:50,305 --> 00:48:53,391
forgetting of violence,
of forgetting in order to force

909
00:48:53,433 --> 00:48:58,313
a type of unity of culture,
the unity of national identity.

910
00:48:58,355 --> 00:48:59,439
So the work that remains to be

911
00:48:59,481 --> 00:49:02,609
done is to recognize
our full history.

912
00:49:02,650 --> 00:49:05,195
That story will make you
so proud of black people.

913
00:49:05,236 --> 00:49:07,072
Also, break your heart.

914
00:49:15,747 --> 00:49:18,416
(slow music)

915
00:49:37,977 --> 00:49:40,271
- My name is Brother Rogers,
I work at the

916
00:49:40,313 --> 00:49:42,774
Mississippi Department
of Archives and History.

917
00:49:42,816 --> 00:49:44,275
I created a website

918
00:49:44,317 --> 00:49:46,861
with a picture of every
historical marker in the state.

919
00:49:46,903 --> 00:49:48,029
[Director] Have you taken a

920
00:49:48,071 --> 00:49:49,489
picture of the Clinton
riots marker?

921
00:49:49,531 --> 00:49:51,157
[Rogers] I have taken a picture
of that marker.

922
00:49:51,199 --> 00:49:54,202
I know exactly where it is
near the railroad track

923
00:49:54,244 --> 00:49:55,537
in Clinton.
[Director] That's right.

924
00:49:55,578 --> 00:49:56,830
And what do you think?

925
00:49:56,871 --> 00:49:58,039
Tell me what you're, tell me

926
00:49:58,081 --> 00:49:59,749
what do you know
about that marker?

927
00:49:59,791 --> 00:50:01,584
- Well, I
think that the Clinton

928
00:50:01,626 --> 00:50:05,338
riot marker is particularly
important because there was

929
00:50:05,380 --> 00:50:09,467
a riot during reconstruction
in the town of Clinton.

930
00:50:09,509 --> 00:50:13,596
That was not in the history
books that I read growing up

931
00:50:13,638 --> 00:50:16,641
studying Mississippi history
and the local public schools.

932
00:50:16,683 --> 00:50:20,812
Reconstruction in America,
not just in Mississippi,

933
00:50:20,854 --> 00:50:25,191
is one of the most overlooked
and underappreciated historical

934
00:50:25,233 --> 00:50:27,193
eras. And the people
who wrote about it

935
00:50:27,235 --> 00:50:31,406
afterwards, North and South
wrote about it mainly

936
00:50:31,448 --> 00:50:34,534
from a white supremacy point
of view, whether they were in

937
00:50:34,576 --> 00:50:37,579
Ohio and Michigan or
Alabama or Mississippi.

938
00:50:37,620 --> 00:50:40,457
There was lots of violence
throughout America,

939
00:50:40,498 --> 00:50:43,376
during reconstruction
against African-Americans.

940
00:50:43,418 --> 00:50:46,963
It's a terrible time in our
history from that perspective.

941
00:50:47,005 --> 00:50:48,173
It's a great time again

942
00:50:48,214 --> 00:50:50,884
of experimentation
with providing the rights

943
00:50:50,925 --> 00:50:54,471
of citizenship and political
equality to African-Americans.

944
00:50:54,512 --> 00:50:55,805
Unfortunately, through the lens

945
00:50:55,847 --> 00:50:58,224
of white supremacy,
that was too much for a lot

946
00:50:58,266 --> 00:51:00,310
of white people to take
during that time.

947
00:51:00,352 --> 00:51:02,562
[Director] Are there
any other markers

948
00:51:02,604 --> 00:51:04,981
in Mississippi
that acknowledge

949
00:51:05,023 --> 00:51:06,900
white violence against
African-Americans?

950
00:51:06,941 --> 00:51:10,570
- The only marker of
which I am aware that exist,

951
00:51:10,612 --> 00:51:15,283
that depicts and talks about
white violence against black

952
00:51:15,325 --> 00:51:19,329
people during reconstruction
is the Clinton riot marker.

953
00:51:19,371 --> 00:51:22,123
[Director] In Mississippi?
- In Mississippi.

954
00:51:23,458 --> 00:51:25,043
- My name is Missy Jones.

955
00:51:25,085 --> 00:51:26,336
My title is a Visiting

956
00:51:26,378 --> 00:51:29,464
Instructor of History
at Mississippi College.

957
00:51:29,506 --> 00:51:31,675
[Director] How long have you
been working on the Clinton
riot?

958
00:51:31,966 --> 00:51:34,177
- Almost 15 years now

959
00:51:34,219 --> 00:51:36,596
if I think back.

960
00:51:37,806 --> 00:51:39,265
[Director] What is this?

961
00:51:39,307 --> 00:51:41,559
- This is Johnson
Milling Company,

962
00:51:41,601 --> 00:51:47,273
it's been here for ages,
but right behind it is

963
00:51:47,315 --> 00:51:50,151
the location of the
old train depot.

964
00:51:50,193 --> 00:51:51,778
And the thought was that we

965
00:51:51,820 --> 00:51:55,782
would put the marker
for the Clinton riot here

966
00:51:55,824 --> 00:51:59,494
because of the importance
of the train depot.

967
00:52:04,416 --> 00:52:05,834
The Clinton riots began

968
00:52:05,875 --> 00:52:11,339
on September 4th, 1875,
and the diorama behind me

969
00:52:11,381 --> 00:52:16,344
tells a version of those events.
The original train depot is

970
00:52:16,386 --> 00:52:20,348
where white paramilitary
units flocked into Clinton.

971
00:52:20,390 --> 00:52:22,809
There was a political rally

972
00:52:22,851 --> 00:52:26,479
and it was one of the first
times that African-Americans had

973
00:52:26,521 --> 00:52:29,858
gotten together to really
listen to political candidates.

974
00:52:29,899 --> 00:52:32,902
And it was organized
by the Republican Party.

975
00:52:32,944 --> 00:52:34,654
But there was also a group

976
00:52:34,696 --> 00:52:38,533
of white Democrats who were
sent there to disrupt things.

977
00:52:38,575 --> 00:52:41,161
Shots rang out, African-American

978
00:52:41,202 --> 00:52:43,872
families began
to flee the scene.

979
00:52:43,913 --> 00:52:46,207
Even one mother left her child

980
00:52:46,249 --> 00:52:48,835
in the hollow of a tree
just for protection.

981
00:52:48,877 --> 00:52:52,630
And then over the course
of the next several days,

982
00:52:52,672 --> 00:52:56,009
white liner's began to flood
into Clinton and then

983
00:52:56,051 --> 00:52:59,929
systematically round up those
who organized the rally and then

984
00:52:59,971 --> 00:53:03,683
kill them, sometimes in front
of their own family members.

985
00:53:03,725 --> 00:53:05,185
[Director] So this is
a group of white

986
00:53:05,226 --> 00:53:08,188
Democrats killing the black
Republicans?

987
00:53:08,229 --> 00:53:10,607
[Missy] Correct.
It was the plan of the white

988
00:53:10,648 --> 00:53:14,694
Democrats to keep
African-Americans from voting.

989
00:53:19,532 --> 00:53:22,952
The violence served as a pretext
for the return of white rule

990
00:53:22,994 --> 00:53:26,539
and the end of reconstruction
in Mississippi.

991
00:53:26,581 --> 00:53:28,917
[Director] Do you
feel like people

992
00:53:28,958 --> 00:53:30,877
know that this marker exists?

993
00:53:30,919 --> 00:53:32,128
- No, I don't.

994
00:53:32,170 --> 00:53:35,757
Just given where it is behind
this old mill,

995
00:53:35,799 --> 00:53:40,387
I feel like it has
the potential to look hidden.

996
00:53:40,428 --> 00:53:43,556
And that was my fear
with placing it here.

997
00:53:43,598 --> 00:53:46,601
I would definitely prefer it
to be in a more prominent

998
00:53:46,643 --> 00:53:52,273
location because this event is
by far the most important event

999
00:53:52,315 --> 00:53:54,776
that ever took
place in the city.

1000
00:53:55,902 --> 00:54:01,032
The Clinton riot has always been
one of these contested events.

1001
00:54:02,617 --> 00:54:05,036
For years and years and years,
it's been told

1002
00:54:05,078 --> 00:54:07,956
as if it was caused
by African-Americans. That they

1003
00:54:07,997 --> 00:54:11,626
were going to take back
the city, accost the women.

1004
00:54:14,796 --> 00:54:17,507
For essentially one hundred
and forty years,

1005
00:54:17,549 --> 00:54:21,386
the history was told incorrectly
and the violence was blamed

1006
00:54:21,428 --> 00:54:24,472
on the black members
of the Clinton community.

1007
00:54:28,476 --> 00:54:30,520
- Hi, my name is
James Robinson.

1008
00:54:30,562 --> 00:54:32,939
I'm from here in Clinton.

1009
00:54:32,981 --> 00:54:36,109
Lifetime residence, except
for a few years.

1010
00:54:36,151 --> 00:54:37,235
- I'm Deborah.

1011
00:54:37,277 --> 00:54:39,112
James is my cousin.

1012
00:54:39,154 --> 00:54:42,949
- This picture here, Sara Lee,
my grandmother's grandmother.

1013
00:54:42,991 --> 00:54:45,952
When she was caught
in the proximity of the

1014
00:54:45,994 --> 00:54:49,122
Clinton riot in order
to save her child.

1015
00:54:49,164 --> 00:54:51,666
She hid the child in a tree.

1016
00:54:51,708 --> 00:54:54,627
And then after the
skirmish was over,

1017
00:54:54,669 --> 00:54:56,880
then she went back
and and got the child.

1018
00:54:57,881 --> 00:54:59,132
As the article says,

1019
00:54:59,174 --> 00:55:03,803
old Clinton history told
from Tales by Ex Slave.

1020
00:55:03,845 --> 00:55:07,432
This was published
in the newspaper in 1961.

1021
00:55:07,474 --> 00:55:10,310
- As far as the black
citizens in Clinton,

1022
00:55:10,352 --> 00:55:11,811
you don't hear
a lot about our history.

1023
00:55:11,853 --> 00:55:15,982
And a lot of times I think our
elders have tended to just

1024
00:55:16,024 --> 00:55:18,610
discuss things among
themselves as opposed

1025
00:55:18,651 --> 00:55:20,445
to bringing it
to the forefront.

1026
00:55:20,487 --> 00:55:24,366
Because it can stir
up a lot of emotions.

1027
00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:26,409
[Director] And what's
the result

1028
00:55:26,451 --> 00:55:27,744
of stirring up emotions?

1029
00:55:27,786 --> 00:55:29,871
- You get a lot of good
and you get some bad.

1030
00:55:31,247 --> 00:55:32,665
[Director] What's the bad?

1031
00:55:32,707 --> 00:55:33,833
- The fact that somebody could

1032
00:55:33,875 --> 00:55:35,919
vandalize if you put up
anything.

1033
00:55:35,960 --> 00:55:38,505
- I just hope that that
doesn't happen in Clinton.

1034
00:55:38,546 --> 00:55:41,216
There's still a lot
of racist attitudes.

1035
00:55:41,257 --> 00:55:44,761
- There are some that
and I'm thinking about Missy.

1036
00:55:44,803 --> 00:55:48,181
When I first met Missy,
she said the first word

1037
00:55:48,223 --> 00:55:49,891
that came out of her
mouth was nigger.

1038
00:55:50,767 --> 00:55:52,268
And her parents were so proud

1039
00:55:52,310 --> 00:55:56,690
of her when she said that word
because that meant that you

1040
00:55:56,731 --> 00:55:59,275
knew you were superior
to somebody else.

1041
00:56:00,068 --> 00:56:03,113
[Director] You've been so
dedicated for so long.

1042
00:56:03,154 --> 00:56:08,952
You've dedicated so much care
and time and effort to this.

1043
00:56:10,704 --> 00:56:12,497
Why do you care about this?

1044
00:56:18,628 --> 00:56:20,380
- I'm going to get emotional,

1045
00:56:20,422 --> 00:56:25,468
but I grew up in a family
in Mississippi.

1046
00:56:25,510 --> 00:56:29,305
My dad was from New York,
my mom's family was from

1047
00:56:29,347 --> 00:56:32,100
South Mississippi.
90 percent white,

1048
00:56:32,142 --> 00:56:35,895
10 percent black,
still segregated in the ways

1049
00:56:35,937 --> 00:56:38,732
in which people
in the communities live.

1050
00:56:40,233 --> 00:56:41,693
But I was raised in a racist

1051
00:56:41,735 --> 00:56:45,905
family, racist community at
the time in which I grew up.

1052
00:56:45,947 --> 00:56:53,204
Things have changed in a good
bit now, but for me, I think

1053
00:56:53,246 --> 00:56:55,248
they want to repeat that.

1054
00:56:55,290 --> 00:56:59,669
I feel responsibility
with a profession that I've

1055
00:56:59,711 --> 00:57:03,798
chosen to tell things
accurately and to not

1056
00:57:05,508 --> 00:57:07,886
repeat generational

1057
00:57:08,970 --> 00:57:09,971
umm

1058
00:57:11,973 --> 00:57:13,433
incorrectness

1059
00:57:14,309 --> 00:57:17,687
with my own family. I want
to do something different.

1060
00:57:24,652 --> 00:57:26,321
[Student] Why are you passionate
about this project?

1061
00:57:26,363 --> 00:57:30,450
Just like what drives you
with making this documentary?

1062
00:57:30,492 --> 00:57:32,452
- You know, I didn't
start as passionate.

1063
00:57:32,494 --> 00:57:35,080
I started as curious.
- Yeah.

1064
00:57:35,121 --> 00:57:36,790
- And I had this sense
that there was something

1065
00:57:36,831 --> 00:57:39,542
missing in the story
that I had been taught.

1066
00:57:39,584 --> 00:57:40,960
And it's only through

1067
00:57:41,002 --> 00:57:43,963
the making of this film
that I've really come to see

1068
00:57:44,005 --> 00:57:46,675
that that story
was totally white.

1069
00:57:46,716 --> 00:57:48,802
I used to think that white
supremacy means a bunch

1070
00:57:48,843 --> 00:57:51,805
of guys in white robes,
but it really means not even

1071
00:57:51,846 --> 00:57:54,808
recognizing that we're only
telling white stories.

1072
00:58:06,528 --> 00:58:10,532
(southern instrumental music)

1073
00:58:32,846 --> 00:58:34,848
[Dr. Blight] During the
reconstruction era,

1074
00:58:34,889 --> 00:58:36,933
there's fear
all over the place.

1075
00:58:40,145 --> 00:58:42,188
White fear of those black

1076
00:58:42,230 --> 00:58:47,360
majority populations, if they
really vote, was colossal.

1077
00:58:47,402 --> 00:58:49,571
So many white Southerners saw

1078
00:58:49,612 --> 00:58:52,323
this idea of black people
serving on juries,

1079
00:58:52,365 --> 00:58:57,287
of black people owning land
as an intolerable revolution.

1080
00:59:01,916 --> 00:59:04,711
And it necessitated
a counter-revolution,

1081
00:59:04,753 --> 00:59:07,672
even if it necessitated the
use of terror as violence.

1082
00:59:12,677 --> 00:59:14,554
A lost cause tradition was

1083
00:59:14,596 --> 00:59:17,307
a response to that
tremendous fear.

1084
00:59:18,350 --> 00:59:20,060
We like to go to
bed at night

1085
00:59:20,101 --> 00:59:23,480
believing our society
is in social order.

1086
00:59:24,356 --> 00:59:26,733
I don't have to worry about
my child tomorrow being

1087
00:59:26,775 --> 00:59:32,572
confronted by totally
unusual and repugnant ideas or

1088
00:59:32,614 --> 00:59:34,699
totally unusual
and repugnant people.

1089
00:59:35,575 --> 00:59:39,829
I'm safe by the
history I know.

1090
00:59:40,789 --> 00:59:42,999
So the lost cause tradition

1091
00:59:43,041 --> 00:59:46,169
that Southerners
developed, this story

1092
00:59:46,211 --> 00:59:49,756
for their explanation of their
defeat became ultimately

1093
00:59:49,798 --> 00:59:53,426
a victory narrative.
Victory over reconstruction.

1094
00:59:53,468 --> 00:59:57,222
And they crushed the very idea
of slavery as the central

1095
00:59:57,263 --> 01:00:00,392
cause and the very idea
of emancipation of four

1096
01:00:00,433 --> 01:00:04,521
million slaves as the central
result of the civil war.

1097
01:00:04,562 --> 01:00:11,027
You begin to see wide scale,
even official efforts to crush

1098
01:00:11,069 --> 01:00:13,613
what we might call
black memory.

1099
01:00:13,655 --> 01:00:15,865
- If we throw away our

1100
01:00:15,907 --> 01:00:20,161
Confederate flag,
we throw away the history

1101
01:00:20,203 --> 01:00:25,000
of South Carolina
and of the United States.

1102
01:00:29,754 --> 01:00:32,507
- We are true Southerners,
I guess.

1103
01:00:32,924 --> 01:00:35,176
To me it's a flag
for everybody,

1104
01:00:35,218 --> 01:00:37,470
black and white,
representing our heritage.

1105
01:00:37,804 --> 01:00:40,223
Can understand to some degree

1106
01:00:40,265 --> 01:00:42,809
how they would have
been upset years ago.

1107
01:00:42,851 --> 01:00:44,853
That's been one hundred
and thirty years ago now.

1108
01:00:44,894 --> 01:00:46,688
To me, it's our flag.

1109
01:00:47,772 --> 01:00:51,317
(crowd chanting)

1110
01:01:11,504 --> 01:01:13,089
- White only, no blacks!

1111
01:01:13,465 --> 01:01:15,175
Send them home!

1112
01:01:18,094 --> 01:01:20,263
[News Reporter] Breaking news,
a horrific scene

1113
01:01:20,305 --> 01:01:23,350
in Charlottesville, Virginia.
A white nationalist rally

1114
01:01:23,391 --> 01:01:27,020
that descended into deadly
violence and chaos.

1115
01:01:27,062 --> 01:01:28,688
- Since the city voted
to remove the

1116
01:01:28,730 --> 01:01:29,939
Robert E. Lee statue,

1117
01:01:29,981 --> 01:01:33,943
there have been protests,
and now violence.

1118
01:01:35,695 --> 01:01:37,530
[Director] Tell me your name.
Who are you?

1119
01:01:37,572 --> 01:01:40,992
- I'm Stephanie Rolph and I'm
an assistant professor

1120
01:01:41,034 --> 01:01:44,371
of history at Millsaps College
in Jackson, Mississippi.

1121
01:01:44,412 --> 01:01:45,872
The images that we're seeing

1122
01:01:45,914 --> 01:01:48,875
on our computers and on our
phones and on television,

1123
01:01:48,917 --> 01:01:51,586
you can't divorce this
from the need to return

1124
01:01:51,628 --> 01:01:53,380
to some sort of
innocent past.

1125
01:01:53,421 --> 01:01:54,422
[Director] Like the old South?

1126
01:01:54,464 --> 01:01:55,507
- Yes.

1127
01:01:55,548 --> 01:01:57,509
[Director] What is the
old South?

1128
01:01:57,550 --> 01:01:58,885
- After the Civil War?

1129
01:01:58,927 --> 01:02:04,766
The old South myth is this
mythologized place of

1130
01:02:05,767 --> 01:02:08,353
big plantation houses

1131
01:02:08,395 --> 01:02:13,066
with Corinthian columns and
mint juleps and hoop skirts

1132
01:02:13,108 --> 01:02:16,152
and Southern gentleman
and happy slaves.

1133
01:02:16,194 --> 01:02:18,196
Everyone is well
taken care of.

1134
01:02:18,238 --> 01:02:21,199
Some people are owned by other
people, but everyone is well

1135
01:02:21,241 --> 01:02:24,744
fed, well clothed,
loved and appreciated.

1136
01:02:24,786 --> 01:02:26,162
And that is not--

1137
01:02:26,204 --> 01:02:28,248
this is why something like
this would appeal to white

1138
01:02:28,289 --> 01:02:30,125
northerners,
because that's not

1139
01:02:30,166 --> 01:02:32,669
the environment
that they lived in.

1140
01:02:32,711 --> 01:02:34,421
[Director] It's really a story
about the

1141
01:02:34,462 --> 01:02:36,089
merits of white supremacy.

1142
01:02:36,131 --> 01:02:37,507
You know,
I filmed with another

1143
01:02:37,549 --> 01:02:39,634
historian who said that it was
really white supremacy

1144
01:02:39,676 --> 01:02:43,096
that helped the north and the
south reunify after the war.

1145
01:02:43,138 --> 01:02:44,973
Do you think that's true?

1146
01:02:45,015 --> 01:02:48,852
- I fully believe that
when we're talking,

1147
01:02:48,893 --> 01:02:51,229
even across the spectrum
from the coming of the civil

1148
01:02:51,271 --> 01:02:53,982
war to the prosecution of it
and the aftermath,

1149
01:02:54,024 --> 01:02:56,901
I think it's a much more
productive approach

1150
01:02:56,943 --> 01:03:00,363
to describe
and understand white supremacy

1151
01:03:00,405 --> 01:03:03,783
than it is to even
talk about slavery.

1152
01:03:03,825 --> 01:03:07,203
Slavery doesn't survive,
but white supremacy does.

1153
01:03:11,082 --> 01:03:14,919
The war ends,
reconciliation has been

1154
01:03:14,961 --> 01:03:19,674
achieved,
what happens unexpectedly is

1155
01:03:19,716 --> 01:03:24,971
that in that reconciliation,
the nation itself embraces

1156
01:03:25,013 --> 01:03:29,100
the Confederacy and the memory
of the Confederacy.

1157
01:03:29,142 --> 01:03:31,811
This is why by the time you
get to the 1930's,

1158
01:03:31,853 --> 01:03:33,938
people from all over
the country are coming

1159
01:03:33,980 --> 01:03:35,982
to places like Natchez,
Mississippi,

1160
01:03:36,024 --> 01:03:39,611
to tour antebellum homes
and to see women in

1161
01:03:39,652 --> 01:03:43,948
hoop skirts and people dressed
up as enslaved persons.

1162
01:03:43,990 --> 01:03:46,534
This is a vacation for them.

1163
01:03:46,576 --> 01:03:51,206
Can you think of a cultural
footprint of this today?

1164
01:03:52,040 --> 01:03:55,168
Where the South gets sort
of fetishized?

1165
01:03:55,210 --> 01:03:58,254
- Grades second through fifth,
like we used to go almost

1166
01:03:58,296 --> 01:04:00,924
every year to the
Destrehan Plantation.

1167
01:04:00,965 --> 01:04:05,220
- And what does that
tour include?

1168
01:04:06,429 --> 01:04:08,348
- It included tours
of the plantation.

1169
01:04:08,390 --> 01:04:11,935
They also had a little show
put on, people dressed up

1170
01:04:11,976 --> 01:04:15,397
and stuff, and they sang
songs, played music.

1171
01:04:17,565 --> 01:04:19,776
It was like a, it's almost
like a little party.

1172
01:04:20,610 --> 01:04:23,947
- Are the tours in any way
engaging enslavement?

1173
01:04:23,988 --> 01:04:26,032
- They don't really talk
about the slavery part.

1174
01:04:26,074 --> 01:04:28,910
You might have a good time
because, I used to look

1175
01:04:28,952 --> 01:04:30,537
forward to going
to the plantation.

1176
01:04:30,578 --> 01:04:32,122
It was a big deal.

1177
01:04:32,163 --> 01:04:33,623
- I mean, can we even think

1178
01:04:33,665 --> 01:04:38,586
about these plantations
as spaces of violence?

1179
01:04:39,796 --> 01:04:43,299
When we think about things
like Confederate monuments or

1180
01:04:43,341 --> 01:04:46,386
symbols and flags,
all of these remembrances

1181
01:04:46,428 --> 01:04:50,890
on white visions, those are
renewals of white supremacy.

1182
01:04:50,932 --> 01:04:52,517
And in my mind,

1183
01:04:52,559 --> 01:04:55,854
keeping that Confederate
battle flag in the top left

1184
01:04:55,895 --> 01:04:58,106
corner of
Mississippi State flag,

1185
01:05:00,108 --> 01:05:03,028
is a way to keep
that narrative alive.

1186
01:05:03,069 --> 01:05:04,404
And it's threatening because

1187
01:05:04,446 --> 01:05:07,574
if we lose it,
what happens to our memory?

1188
01:05:08,158 --> 01:05:12,120
(quiet thoughtful music)

1189
01:05:17,625 --> 01:05:20,253
- My name is William Shirley.

1190
01:05:21,129 --> 01:05:22,797
I serve in the Mississippi
House of Representatives

1191
01:05:22,839 --> 01:05:27,552
for District 84, about 16,000
people in the whole county.

1192
01:05:27,594 --> 01:05:29,095
Everybody knows everybody.

1193
01:05:29,137 --> 01:05:31,348
You get a speeding ticket,
everybody knows.

1194
01:05:31,389 --> 01:05:34,059
I'm not here to argue
the design of the flag.

1195
01:05:34,100 --> 01:05:36,936
That is not my intent.

1196
01:05:36,978 --> 01:05:39,314
Some universities
took the flag down.

1197
01:05:39,939 --> 01:05:41,399
If you're receiving state

1198
01:05:41,441 --> 01:05:44,152
dollars and you're a public
university, then you should

1199
01:05:44,194 --> 01:05:46,946
display whatever
that symbol is.

1200
01:05:46,988 --> 01:05:48,323
[Director] And do you
think this is

1201
01:05:48,365 --> 01:05:50,450
an issue that matters to the
people in your district?

1202
01:05:50,992 --> 01:05:53,370
- Yes, ma'am.
- Why?

1203
01:05:53,411 --> 01:05:56,664
- Well, I just think it's a
heritage, it's a history.

1204
01:05:56,706 --> 01:06:01,711
There's a big movement to
remove Confederate history.

1205
01:06:01,753 --> 01:06:04,005
Well, it's part of history.

1206
01:06:04,047 --> 01:06:07,634
You know,
where and when is enough?

1207
01:06:07,676 --> 01:06:09,135
[Director] Do you feel like

1208
01:06:09,177 --> 01:06:11,054
slavery was something
that was in the past?

1209
01:06:11,096 --> 01:06:12,722
Let's move on.

1210
01:06:12,764 --> 01:06:16,184
Or do you feel like slavery
still has an effect today?

1211
01:06:17,477 --> 01:06:21,147
- It's over and
it is part of history,

1212
01:06:21,189 --> 01:06:22,982
it's part of the past.
I don't know of a

1213
01:06:23,024 --> 01:06:27,070
person that owns
a slave or has been a slave.

1214
01:06:27,904 --> 01:06:29,364
To this day.

1215
01:06:30,031 --> 01:06:31,241
I think we're going to make it

1216
01:06:31,282 --> 01:06:34,244
a major issue as long as we
keep rubbing it

1217
01:06:34,285 --> 01:06:38,164
in from the standpoint
of the minority saying, well,

1218
01:06:38,206 --> 01:06:41,167
we were slaves and mistreated.
I understand that.

1219
01:06:41,209 --> 01:06:43,378
What the hell do you
want me to do about it?

1220
01:06:43,420 --> 01:06:44,504
I'm sorry.

1221
01:06:44,546 --> 01:06:46,631
I wasn't there.
I'm 50 years old.

1222
01:06:46,673 --> 01:06:48,049
I wasn't there.

1223
01:06:48,091 --> 01:06:49,509
[Director] And what do you say
to historically black

1224
01:06:49,551 --> 01:06:52,012
universities that say, we're
not going to fly this flag

1225
01:06:52,053 --> 01:06:54,014
because it's
a symbol of slavery?

1226
01:06:54,055 --> 01:06:55,640
Do you think about
their point of view?

1227
01:06:56,766 --> 01:06:59,602
- It is. It's a state flag
of Mississippi.

1228
01:07:01,730 --> 01:07:04,107
[Director] But if they say
it actually hurts us,

1229
01:07:04,149 --> 01:07:05,525
it deeply offends us,

1230
01:07:05,567 --> 01:07:08,111
it represents something
that gives us pain.

1231
01:07:08,153 --> 01:07:09,404
What do you say to that?

1232
01:07:14,617 --> 01:07:18,538
- I don't see the pain
in in the symbol.

1233
01:07:22,167 --> 01:07:25,587
(chanting and sirens)

1234
01:07:29,257 --> 01:07:31,051
- New Orleans is just
the latest city

1235
01:07:31,092 --> 01:07:33,219
to start taking
down historical,

1236
01:07:33,261 --> 01:07:35,972
but controversial
monuments that many say

1237
01:07:36,014 --> 01:07:38,141
celebrates slavery
and the Confederacy.

1238
01:07:38,183 --> 01:07:39,893
- White supremacy!
- Must go!

1239
01:07:39,934 --> 01:07:41,561
- When?
- Now!

1240
01:07:41,603 --> 01:07:42,729
- When?
- Now!

1241
01:07:42,771 --> 01:07:44,439
- All right! All right!

1242
01:07:44,481 --> 01:07:46,649
We're here to celebrate
the taking down

1243
01:07:46,691 --> 01:07:49,986
of the Jefferson Davis statue
here in New Orleans Center.

1244
01:07:50,612 --> 01:07:55,367
These were all Jim Crow era
statues meant to emphasize

1245
01:07:55,408 --> 01:07:57,369
that white people
were in control.

1246
01:07:57,410 --> 01:07:58,787
[Director] Is there any value--

1247
01:07:58,828 --> 01:08:01,873
- There is no value
in keeping those statues.

1248
01:08:02,332 --> 01:08:03,875
There is value in remembering

1249
01:08:03,917 --> 01:08:05,710
what these statues
were put up for.

1250
01:08:05,752 --> 01:08:07,170
(people yelling)

1251
01:08:07,212 --> 01:08:09,422
- What do you say to the
people across the street

1252
01:08:09,464 --> 01:08:10,757
who are marching with flags--

1253
01:08:10,799 --> 01:08:12,092
- I don't say nothing

1254
01:08:12,133 --> 01:08:13,635
to the people across
the street who are marching.

1255
01:08:13,677 --> 01:08:16,262
They are not on my radar.
They are unredeemable

1256
01:08:16,304 --> 01:08:17,681
as far as I know.

1257
01:08:17,722 --> 01:08:19,974
- We pray, oh Lord, that
those who are attacking

1258
01:08:20,016 --> 01:08:22,602
our heritage may
repent of their sins.

1259
01:08:22,644 --> 01:08:24,145
We pray, oh Lord,

1260
01:08:24,187 --> 01:08:26,648
that the truth of history
would triumph.

1261
01:08:27,691 --> 01:08:29,484
[Director] I feel like
the country never

1262
01:08:29,526 --> 01:08:31,194
really reunified after the war

1263
01:08:31,236 --> 01:08:33,947
in a way that included all
of its citizens, right?

1264
01:08:33,988 --> 01:08:35,615
Like maybe taking down these

1265
01:08:35,657 --> 01:08:38,368
statues now could
help us reunify.

1266
01:08:38,410 --> 01:08:40,286
- But don't try to take away

1267
01:08:40,328 --> 01:08:42,122
history just because you
don't agree with it.

1268
01:08:42,163 --> 01:08:43,832
And if you really
study history,

1269
01:08:43,873 --> 01:08:46,751
you'll see there's more...
It was more than just slavery.

1270
01:08:46,793 --> 01:08:48,294
There was taxation issues.

1271
01:08:48,336 --> 01:08:50,338
[Director] Hold on.
Is he putting on a--

1272
01:08:51,339 --> 01:08:52,966
a bulletproof vest?

1273
01:08:53,008 --> 01:08:54,384
- Probably.
- Why?

1274
01:08:54,426 --> 01:08:56,052
- Because they were firing

1275
01:08:56,094 --> 01:08:58,847
paintball at these
guys the other night.

1276
01:08:59,973 --> 01:09:01,766
Sounds harmless,

1277
01:09:01,808 --> 01:09:04,853
but who's to say that they
don't try something more?

1278
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:06,980
A lot of these people
from out of town.

1279
01:09:07,022 --> 01:09:08,690
- These are visitors
from out of town

1280
01:09:09,858 --> 01:09:12,610
who are Confederate
supporters, and they come here

1281
01:09:12,652 --> 01:09:15,238
to occupy a city for a couple
of weeks and stand their

1282
01:09:15,280 --> 01:09:17,532
ground and all
that good stuff.

1283
01:09:17,574 --> 01:09:19,159
[Director] But isn't
the goal to have

1284
01:09:19,200 --> 01:09:20,410
more people feel represented?

1285
01:09:20,452 --> 01:09:22,829
I mean, don't we need
to listen to each other?

1286
01:09:22,871 --> 01:09:25,707
They said the statue's
a source of Southern pride.

1287
01:09:25,749 --> 01:09:28,501
- Fuck the south.
Fuck Southern pride.

1288
01:09:28,543 --> 01:09:29,544
Umm

1289
01:09:30,879 --> 01:09:32,213
The source of all of this
tension and anger comes

1290
01:09:32,255 --> 01:09:35,467
from the erasure
of African-Americans, history,

1291
01:09:35,508 --> 01:09:38,178
bloodlines, culture,
families for hundreds of years

1292
01:09:38,219 --> 01:09:40,138
by way of this thing
that they're upholding.

1293
01:09:40,180 --> 01:09:42,349
Ok, so if you can't balance

1294
01:09:42,390 --> 01:09:45,018
that in your mind,
then I can't do anything

1295
01:09:45,060 --> 01:09:46,936
for your lack of an IQ
or common sense.

1296
01:09:46,978 --> 01:09:47,854
I'm sorry.

1297
01:09:47,896 --> 01:09:48,897
- It's not about race.

1298
01:09:48,938 --> 01:09:50,398
This has never
been about race.

1299
01:09:50,440 --> 01:09:52,567
I feel like we're
having our history

1300
01:09:53,234 --> 01:09:54,611
stolen from us.

1301
01:09:54,652 --> 01:09:56,112
This was our only
Confederate president.

1302
01:09:56,154 --> 01:09:57,197
He died here.

1303
01:09:57,238 --> 01:09:58,365
- You don't need
to have that in

1304
01:09:58,406 --> 01:09:59,783
our diverse neighborhood.

1305
01:09:59,824 --> 01:10:03,036
- How is a inanimate
object like a symbol,

1306
01:10:03,078 --> 01:10:05,246
affecting you so
gravely that you

1307
01:10:05,288 --> 01:10:07,123
cannot see a [inaudible].

1308
01:10:07,165 --> 01:10:08,333
(crowd starts chanting)

1309
01:10:08,375 --> 01:10:11,753
* Get the fuck out
of New Orleans *

1310
01:10:12,212 --> 01:10:15,131
* Get the fuck out
of New Orleans *

1311
01:10:15,173 --> 01:10:17,509
- I pray for America.
I really do.

1312
01:10:18,426 --> 01:10:20,970
(crowd cheering)

1313
01:10:35,527 --> 01:10:36,945
- Dear God, our
Heavenly Father,

1314
01:10:36,986 --> 01:10:38,780
we thank you for your

1315
01:10:38,822 --> 01:10:42,617
love and your grace and your
mercy and please bless us

1316
01:10:42,659 --> 01:10:46,913
during the coming hour as we
pay homage to our ancestors,

1317
01:10:46,955 --> 01:10:50,542
the fifteen thousand two
hundred and sixty five souls

1318
01:10:50,583 --> 01:10:53,294
that gave their life to defend
the great state

1319
01:10:53,336 --> 01:10:55,296
of Mississippi.
For Christ's sake, Amen.

1320
01:10:55,338 --> 01:10:56,548
(all)
- Amen,

1321
01:10:56,589 --> 01:10:58,800
- Our next speaker is
someone that I really

1322
01:10:58,842 --> 01:11:01,094
appreciate and he's
got backbone.

1323
01:11:01,136 --> 01:11:03,805
And that's the kind of people
we need, people to stand up.

1324
01:11:04,347 --> 01:11:07,267
Mr. William Shirley
of Clark County,

1325
01:11:07,308 --> 01:11:08,935
would you come
say a few words?

1326
01:11:09,853 --> 01:11:10,979
Good man!
- Yeah!

1327
01:11:11,688 --> 01:11:14,315
(clapping)

1328
01:11:15,483 --> 01:11:17,360
- Flag means a
whole lot to me.

1329
01:11:17,944 --> 01:11:19,988
You're not going to take the
damn flag down with my vote.

1330
01:11:21,531 --> 01:11:23,491
So I'm going to do
all I can do.

1331
01:11:23,533 --> 01:11:26,578
And I suggest you find your
legislator and make your ear

1332
01:11:26,619 --> 01:11:30,623
known to him or her,
because we all

1333
01:11:30,665 --> 01:11:32,834
in the Mississippi house are
going to get to vote on them

1334
01:11:32,876 --> 01:11:36,755
amendments again
and again and again.

1335
01:11:36,796 --> 01:11:38,965
And they're going to get
tired of seeing me.

1336
01:11:39,007 --> 01:11:40,467
And they're going to try

1337
01:11:40,508 --> 01:11:43,053
to get somebody to replace
people like me that just don't

1338
01:11:43,094 --> 01:11:45,638
go along with y'alls boss man.

1339
01:11:45,680 --> 01:11:47,057
If you're taking state

1340
01:11:47,098 --> 01:11:50,185
dollars, you fly the flag
of the state of Mississippi.

1341
01:11:50,226 --> 01:11:52,645
(clapping)

1342
01:11:55,190 --> 01:11:56,358
Thank y'all.

1343
01:11:56,399 --> 01:11:58,318
- I'm gonna let our
Mississippi Senator

1344
01:11:58,360 --> 01:12:00,320
McDaniel come
up and speak.

1345
01:12:00,362 --> 01:12:02,364
(clapping)

1346
01:12:02,739 --> 01:12:04,324
- Political correctness

1347
01:12:04,366 --> 01:12:06,034
is an incredibly
dangerous doctrine.

1348
01:12:07,369 --> 01:12:09,329
It's anti intellectual.

1349
01:12:09,371 --> 01:12:13,333
It's anti decent.
It demands conformity.

1350
01:12:13,375 --> 01:12:15,001
Do you believe they'll stop
with a monument?

1351
01:12:15,043 --> 01:12:16,836
Do you believe they'll
stop with a pattern

1352
01:12:16,878 --> 01:12:18,046
or design on a flag?

1353
01:12:18,088 --> 01:12:20,507
They ridicule our traditions.

1354
01:12:20,548 --> 01:12:22,550
They mock us,
they laugh at us.

1355
01:12:22,592 --> 01:12:24,469
You feel like you're losing
your country, don't you?

1356
01:12:27,222 --> 01:12:28,890
You feel marginalized.

1357
01:12:29,557 --> 01:12:30,934
You're scared.

1358
01:12:32,352 --> 01:12:33,728
Mississippi has to stand.

1359
01:12:33,770 --> 01:12:35,563
We have nothing
else to surrender.

1360
01:12:35,605 --> 01:12:36,898
We are those warriors,

1361
01:12:36,940 --> 01:12:39,526
men and women of the soil,
stubborn, courageous.

1362
01:12:39,567 --> 01:12:40,777
We stand here on the edge

1363
01:12:40,819 --> 01:12:44,698
of history, ready to push
back one more time.

1364
01:12:44,739 --> 01:12:46,491
Help's not coming
from California.

1365
01:12:46,533 --> 01:12:47,575
It's not coming
from Massachusetts.

1366
01:12:47,617 --> 01:12:48,868
It has to be you.

1367
01:12:48,910 --> 01:12:50,161
What are you going
to do about it?

1368
01:12:55,000 --> 01:12:57,168
(dramatic music swells)

1369
01:13:04,092 --> 01:13:06,469
- How would you like to
see Uncle Billy dance?

1370
01:13:06,511 --> 01:13:08,138
(children clapping)

1371
01:13:08,972 --> 01:13:11,933
(harmonica music)

1372
01:13:11,975 --> 01:13:14,144
(tap dancing)

1373
01:13:18,189 --> 01:13:21,317
[Dr. Blight] At the end of the
day, historical memory is always

1374
01:13:21,359 --> 01:13:24,738
about who is
controlling the story.

1375
01:13:26,531 --> 01:13:29,325
And you got to do it
in a society that has this

1376
01:13:29,367 --> 01:13:34,664
horrible problem with racism.
The theories of race that most

1377
01:13:34,706 --> 01:13:38,877
white Americans,
north or south, still share.

1378
01:13:41,129 --> 01:13:45,467
(dramatic music)

1379
01:13:50,889 --> 01:13:53,975
By the 1890's
in the north,

1380
01:13:54,017 --> 01:13:57,937
there's a tremendous fear
of a world that seems to be

1381
01:13:57,979 --> 01:14:01,274
floating into disorder
in these teeming new cities

1382
01:14:01,316 --> 01:14:05,612
full of these immigrants
speaking unusual languages.

1383
01:14:09,824 --> 01:14:12,994
Maybe the race question should
just be left to the South.

1384
01:14:17,248 --> 01:14:20,752
They've always known how
to handle the race question

1385
01:14:22,671 --> 01:14:25,465
at the same time,
there will be over nine

1386
01:14:25,507 --> 01:14:28,176
million African-Americans,
mostly in the South.

1387
01:14:29,803 --> 01:14:31,471
There's no longer the slavery

1388
01:14:31,513 --> 01:14:33,807
system that kept
this all contained.

1389
01:14:35,350 --> 01:14:37,769
White Southerners need to keep

1390
01:14:37,811 --> 01:14:41,690
this burgeoning black
population on the land as

1391
01:14:41,731 --> 01:14:45,652
laborers not engaging
in educational advancement.

1392
01:14:45,694 --> 01:14:48,738
They need a new system
to keep them there.

1393
01:14:49,864 --> 01:14:53,868
The solution in the south was
a system of Jim Crow laws.

1394
01:14:54,536 --> 01:14:56,037
Everything from schooling

1395
01:14:56,079 --> 01:14:59,666
to voting to transportation,
public accommodation,

1396
01:14:59,708 --> 01:15:03,962
every element of life is
now going to be segregated.

1397
01:15:05,380 --> 01:15:06,923
Lots of white Americans,

1398
01:15:06,965 --> 01:15:10,927
North or South,
can unify around segregation

1399
01:15:10,969 --> 01:15:14,097
as a way to keep society
in social order.

1400
01:15:20,645 --> 01:15:22,272
The way in which this culture

1401
01:15:22,313 --> 01:15:26,818
became within the first half
century after the war,

1402
01:15:26,860 --> 01:15:31,656
an American North South
reunion without racial

1403
01:15:31,698 --> 01:15:35,118
justice left a deep
set of legacies

1404
01:15:35,160 --> 01:15:37,746
we are, of course,
still struggling with.

1405
01:15:37,787 --> 01:15:41,541
And every time we think we
have so much of this put

1406
01:15:41,583 --> 01:15:45,754
aside, we suddenly are
reminded that we don't.

1407
01:15:46,629 --> 01:15:49,132
(crowd yelling)

1408
01:15:51,176 --> 01:15:57,265
The only way today we'll see
a new, more inclusive reunion

1409
01:15:57,307 --> 01:16:01,311
of Americans is if there's
a coalition of interest

1410
01:16:01,353 --> 01:16:04,064
that stops looking only
at their own individual

1411
01:16:04,105 --> 01:16:08,735
interest and sees themselves
in these four or five issues

1412
01:16:08,777 --> 01:16:10,653
and sees themselves
in other people.

1413
01:16:14,115 --> 01:16:15,325
Ok.

1414
01:16:21,915 --> 01:16:23,416
[Director] We're just
going to record

1415
01:16:23,458 --> 01:16:24,793
the sound of the
room a little bit.

1416
01:16:24,834 --> 01:16:27,087
And then if you could
change the frame too.

1417
01:16:27,796 --> 01:16:29,297
There you go.

1418
01:16:30,006 --> 01:16:32,175
If I were going to make
a movie about you,

1419
01:16:32,217 --> 01:16:35,011
what do you want me to make
sure that I include?

1420
01:16:36,346 --> 01:16:37,639
- I want you to show like

1421
01:16:38,932 --> 01:16:41,017
the great things
that I'm capable of.

1422
01:16:41,059 --> 01:16:42,310
Like,

1423
01:16:42,352 --> 01:16:46,981
yeah, I'm if if I
do say so myself, I'm a great

1424
01:16:48,108 --> 01:16:50,944
football player, but I'm
also smart in the classroom.

1425
01:16:50,985 --> 01:16:54,739
I try I try to be-- I'm just
trying to be great in life.

1426
01:16:54,781 --> 01:16:55,865
I'm trying to make something
of my life,

1427
01:16:55,907 --> 01:16:57,367
trying to be successful.

1428
01:16:57,409 --> 01:17:00,453
- To be honest with
you, what I've been through.

1429
01:17:00,495 --> 01:17:02,622
There are people who just look

1430
01:17:02,664 --> 01:17:04,624
at the good things,
look at the good things,

1431
01:17:04,666 --> 01:17:08,128
but I'd rather you see
what the negativity was.

1432
01:17:08,169 --> 01:17:11,214
So it's like it counteracts
it's like here's the bad.

1433
01:17:11,256 --> 01:17:13,299
But now here where
I'm at, I'm good now.

1434
01:17:13,341 --> 01:17:14,718
I'm in a good zone.

1435
01:17:14,759 --> 01:17:17,178
I was in-- you know what
I'm saying? It's more like I'd

1436
01:17:17,220 --> 01:17:19,764
rather you not just tell half
of my story, I'd rather

1437
01:17:19,806 --> 01:17:21,349
you tell the whole story.

1438
01:17:23,268 --> 01:17:26,604
- There was this one where a
teacher once described me as

1439
01:17:27,022 --> 01:17:28,773
I think it was sympathetic.

1440
01:17:30,525 --> 01:17:32,986
I thought she called me
pathetic when she said that.

1441
01:17:33,028 --> 01:17:34,320
[Director] It might have
an empathetic.

1442
01:17:34,362 --> 01:17:35,405
- Empathetic, yeah.

1443
01:17:35,447 --> 01:17:36,364
At the end of the day,
it's just like

1444
01:17:37,574 --> 01:17:39,034
you know, we all
have feelings.

1445
01:17:39,075 --> 01:17:41,953
We all have like a history
that nobody else knows about.

1446
01:17:43,747 --> 01:17:45,331
Yeah.

1447
01:17:46,875 --> 01:17:49,919
(thoughtful music)

1448
01:17:57,927 --> 01:18:01,097
- I was certainly not taught
this way in my high school.

1449
01:18:01,139 --> 01:18:02,807
(all laugh)

1450
01:18:02,849 --> 01:18:04,434
So--
- Neither was I!

1451
01:18:05,226 --> 01:18:08,188
- I'm always shocked when I
find students of a certain age

1452
01:18:08,229 --> 01:18:10,607
who haven't seen
Gone with the Wind.

1453
01:18:10,648 --> 01:18:12,359
And I point them to it.

1454
01:18:12,400 --> 01:18:13,735
You need to watch that film.

1455
01:18:13,777 --> 01:18:17,697
[Kelly] It was the most watched
movie of all time.

1456
01:18:17,739 --> 01:18:19,532
People are eating
this stuff up

1457
01:18:19,574 --> 01:18:21,868
like there's a real reason why

1458
01:18:21,910 --> 01:18:24,120
people have weddings
on plantations.

1459
01:18:24,162 --> 01:18:25,872
Like you would never,
you would

1460
01:18:25,914 --> 01:18:28,375
never go to Auschwitz and be
like, let's get married.

1461
01:18:28,416 --> 01:18:30,460
Like you would never do that.

1462
01:18:30,502 --> 01:18:33,296
But we have so made black pain

1463
01:18:33,338 --> 01:18:36,424
and suffering like a place
of our enjoyment,

1464
01:18:36,466 --> 01:18:40,345
a place that feels good to us,
a place that feels familiar

1465
01:18:40,387 --> 01:18:44,265
to us, that we don't pay
attention to the suffering.

1466
01:18:44,307 --> 01:18:48,853
We don't pay attention
to why it's problematic.

1467
01:18:48,895 --> 01:18:50,605
- I know you talked about
the force in your

1468
01:18:50,647 --> 01:18:55,902
presentation, but how do you
define freedom for yourself?

1469
01:18:55,944 --> 01:18:58,071
- I have been conditioned

1470
01:18:58,113 --> 01:19:01,658
to think of emancipation
as an ending point,

1471
01:19:01,700 --> 01:19:06,579
so I realized that freedom
was not just like liberation.

1472
01:19:06,621 --> 01:19:10,834
Freedom was like
owning your humanity,

1473
01:19:10,875 --> 01:19:13,169
operating in your
full humanity,

1474
01:19:13,211 --> 01:19:16,214
being recognized
for your full humanity.

1475
01:19:16,256 --> 01:19:18,258
I think that the
spirit of slavery,

1476
01:19:18,299 --> 01:19:21,094
that I talked about before,
that makes color a mark

1477
01:19:21,136 --> 01:19:24,180
of degradation is still
very much with us.

1478
01:19:24,222 --> 01:19:27,350
And I think for too long,
the onus of racism has been

1479
01:19:27,392 --> 01:19:30,311
put on people of color
to solve when this is not

1480
01:19:30,353 --> 01:19:31,730
really like a people
of color issue.

1481
01:19:31,771 --> 01:19:33,273
This is like a white

1482
01:19:33,314 --> 01:19:34,941
supremacist issue where white
people need to talk to other

1483
01:19:34,983 --> 01:19:38,820
white people about how they
can overcome these issues.

1484
01:19:38,862 --> 01:19:40,280
White allies today have

1485
01:19:40,321 --> 01:19:44,826
to take a very radical stance
and that they can't just,

1486
01:19:44,868 --> 01:19:46,453
you know, put up
the bumper sticker.

1487
01:19:46,494 --> 01:19:47,662
Black Lives Matter.

1488
01:19:47,704 --> 01:19:49,164
Are you going to allow your

1489
01:19:49,205 --> 01:19:52,292
child to be one of the few
whites in an all black school?

1490
01:19:52,334 --> 01:19:54,377
Are you going to invest
in that school making sure

1491
01:19:54,419 --> 01:19:56,629
that not just your child,
but every child

1492
01:19:56,671 --> 01:20:00,550
in that community gets a fair
shake? To balance like this

1493
01:20:00,592 --> 01:20:04,262
great injustice that's taking
place for hundreds of years

1494
01:20:04,304 --> 01:20:07,265
it requires sacrifice.
I don't know what that will

1495
01:20:07,307 --> 01:20:09,809
look like exactly for you
or for each person.

1496
01:20:09,851 --> 01:20:12,395
It's different.
I think the...

1497
01:20:14,522 --> 01:20:17,359
(reflective music)

1498
01:20:26,284 --> 01:20:29,120
- This is Pleasant Gardens.
This is where most

1499
01:20:29,162 --> 01:20:31,206
of the African-American
in the city were buried.

1500
01:20:32,457 --> 01:20:36,336
It was an operation
from 1891 through 1970.

1501
01:20:37,462 --> 01:20:39,255
Well, one that I saw
in the paper, an article about

1502
01:20:39,297 --> 01:20:41,549
an abandoned cemetery,
and so I thought,

1503
01:20:41,591 --> 01:20:43,885
I can't believe that there's
a place here that's so rich

1504
01:20:43,927 --> 01:20:45,303
with history and I
didn't know about it.

1505
01:20:45,345 --> 01:20:47,847
And so I use the map
on the front of the newspaper

1506
01:20:47,889 --> 01:20:51,351
and drove over to the cemetery
and found this beautiful place

1507
01:20:51,393 --> 01:20:54,938
and immediately felt the need
to organize some community

1508
01:20:54,979 --> 01:20:56,773
cleanups to bring
attention to it.

1509
01:20:57,315 --> 01:20:58,817
Many of the African-Americans

1510
01:20:58,858 --> 01:21:01,903
that are buried here were not
slaves, and so they could be

1511
01:21:01,945 --> 01:21:03,947
buried and recognized
in different ways.

1512
01:21:03,988 --> 01:21:07,701
But there's a very interesting
cemetery called

1513
01:21:07,742 --> 01:21:09,285
Beck Knob Cemetery

1514
01:21:09,327 --> 01:21:12,288
that's located on the
north side of the town.

1515
01:21:12,747 --> 01:21:15,250
And it was a slave cemetery.

1516
01:21:15,291 --> 01:21:19,129
And when you look
at how overgrown it is,

1517
01:21:19,170 --> 01:21:21,589
it's almost sad that

1518
01:21:22,716 --> 01:21:25,176
you can almost drive past it
and not even know it.

1519
01:21:25,218 --> 01:21:26,386
[Director] Would you
take us there?

1520
01:21:26,428 --> 01:21:27,804
- Yeah, I could take
you there,

1521
01:21:27,846 --> 01:21:29,222
but I don't know how much

1522
01:21:29,264 --> 01:21:31,641
you'll be able to see because
it's really overgrown.

1523
01:21:33,143 --> 01:21:36,104
(truck engine roaring)

1524
01:21:48,700 --> 01:21:49,993
Wow.

1525
01:22:02,839 --> 01:22:04,966
(truck engines)

1526
01:22:22,817 --> 01:22:24,569
I knew I wasn't crazy.

1527
01:22:25,445 --> 01:22:28,198
Look how close this
line is to that.

1528
01:22:31,493 --> 01:22:34,162
(peaceful music)

1529
01:23:00,355 --> 01:23:01,815
[Director] What has
been the most

1530
01:23:01,856 --> 01:23:03,149
important story that you've

1531
01:23:03,191 --> 01:23:05,485
talked about in history
class so far this year?

1532
01:23:06,236 --> 01:23:08,238
- Well, slavery was bad.

1533
01:23:08,697 --> 01:23:10,115
We should still feel guilty

1534
01:23:10,156 --> 01:23:12,367
because it's something
that happened.

1535
01:23:12,409 --> 01:23:14,077
[Director] But we
interviewed a kid

1536
01:23:14,119 --> 01:23:15,370
from Estonia and he has white

1537
01:23:15,412 --> 01:23:17,831
skin and his family
wasn't even here.

1538
01:23:17,872 --> 01:23:20,125
Should he feel
guilty about it?

1539
01:23:20,792 --> 01:23:23,712
- Well, if he's living
in our country now,

1540
01:23:25,130 --> 01:23:29,426
then I think he should feel
a little guilt because

1541
01:23:29,467 --> 01:23:32,470
it's still
part of his, it's still part

1542
01:23:32,512 --> 01:23:34,681
of his history,
because now he's part of our

1543
01:23:34,723 --> 01:23:38,435
country and he should
feel a little guilt,

1544
01:23:38,476 --> 01:23:39,436
I think.

1545
01:23:40,061 --> 01:23:41,730
[Director] Is guilt useful?

1546
01:23:42,063 --> 01:23:44,024
- Yes.
- Tell me why.

1547
01:23:44,065 --> 01:23:46,276
- Because it helps
us understand that

1548
01:23:46,317 --> 01:23:48,069
what we did was wrong

1549
01:23:48,111 --> 01:23:53,199
and we shouldn't go back
to doing it and we should

1550
01:23:53,241 --> 01:23:56,619
fix our ways so we can
do better in the future.

1551
01:23:57,829 --> 01:24:01,041
- I personally, like, slavery
is morally wrong.

1552
01:24:01,082 --> 01:24:03,043
Like you just shouldn't
own other people.

1553
01:24:03,084 --> 01:24:05,253
That's not something
that should happen.

1554
01:24:05,295 --> 01:24:08,715
But I see the reasoning

1555
01:24:08,757 --> 01:24:14,220
behind it and I can understand
it and not accept it,

1556
01:24:14,888 --> 01:24:16,431
but I guess,

1557
01:24:17,098 --> 01:24:20,685
see, like, behind it, I guess.

1558
01:24:21,269 --> 01:24:23,063
[Director] I think a lot
depends on whose

1559
01:24:23,104 --> 01:24:25,231
eyes you're looking through.
Right?

1560
01:24:25,273 --> 01:24:27,275
Are we talking about a
white point of view

1561
01:24:27,317 --> 01:24:28,568
or a black point of view?

1562
01:24:28,610 --> 01:24:30,695
A lot depends on
who you are, I think.

1563
01:24:32,280 --> 01:24:34,783
- I want to know, like,
what was your perspective

1564
01:24:34,824 --> 01:24:38,495
of the whole
slavery situation and how you

1565
01:24:38,536 --> 01:24:42,207
feel like, because you you
know, you being, you were

1566
01:24:42,248 --> 01:24:46,419
raised, like how do you feel
when people--

1567
01:24:48,004 --> 01:24:49,881
[Director] I feel like
it was wrong.

1568
01:24:51,966 --> 01:24:54,719
I feel like it
was deeply wrong.

1569
01:24:56,805 --> 01:24:59,099
But I also feel like

1570
01:24:59,140 --> 01:25:01,726
I never learned about
slavery as a white story.

1571
01:25:03,019 --> 01:25:05,563
I mean, most people around me,
we never talk about slavery as

1572
01:25:05,605 --> 01:25:08,900
something white people did
and benefited from, you know?

1573
01:25:09,984 --> 01:25:11,069
It was always just presented

1574
01:25:11,111 --> 01:25:13,321
as something
that just happened.

1575
01:25:26,626 --> 01:25:28,837
[Dr. Blight] I want to introduce
Ibram Kendi.

1576
01:25:28,878 --> 01:25:31,089
Ibram, you argue
that the current

1577
01:25:31,131 --> 01:25:32,841
threat of racism is more

1578
01:25:32,882 --> 01:25:37,012
insidious now than it
has been in the past.

1579
01:25:37,053 --> 01:25:38,179
[Ibram] Precisely.

1580
01:25:38,221 --> 01:25:40,473
Just as Lincoln said

1581
01:25:40,515 --> 01:25:42,851
that the nation will either
become

1582
01:25:42,892 --> 01:25:44,477
all one or all the other,

1583
01:25:44,519 --> 01:25:46,479
meaning slavery
or antislavery.

1584
01:25:46,521 --> 01:25:50,525
I think it's the same thing
for racism and anti-racism.

1585
01:25:52,861 --> 01:25:57,657
If we see America's history
of steady racial progress

1586
01:25:57,699 --> 01:26:00,827
that we have now reached
the mountaintop,

1587
01:26:00,869 --> 01:26:04,873
racism is no longer
critical and important.

1588
01:26:06,082 --> 01:26:10,253
We're also saying the cause
of racial inequities today

1589
01:26:10,295 --> 01:26:13,340
is not racism, because
we've moved beyond racism.

1590
01:26:14,257 --> 01:26:15,842
It's the inferiority

1591
01:26:15,884 --> 01:26:19,387
of particular people that are
not working hard enough.

1592
01:26:20,305 --> 01:26:23,558
(introspective music)

1593
01:26:24,893 --> 01:26:28,688
There was a racist idea
that is still very prominent

1594
01:26:28,730 --> 01:26:31,733
within the community of people
who consider themselves

1595
01:26:31,775 --> 01:26:34,569
liberal, even progressive
or even radical.

1596
01:26:34,611 --> 01:26:37,906
The oppression
inferiority thesis.

1597
01:26:37,947 --> 01:26:41,117
First, it was slavery making
black people into brutes.

1598
01:26:41,159 --> 01:26:43,244
Right now, it's poverty.

1599
01:26:44,329 --> 01:26:47,540
This idea that racism itself

1600
01:26:47,582 --> 01:26:51,419
or discrimination
wasn't just sort of harming

1601
01:26:51,461 --> 01:26:55,840
people, but it was literally
leading to inferior behaviors.

1602
01:26:58,843 --> 01:27:01,596
(introspective music)

1603
01:27:14,943 --> 01:27:16,903
[Director] When you walk
down the street

1604
01:27:16,945 --> 01:27:18,530
and people see you,

1605
01:27:18,571 --> 01:27:20,240
what do you want people
to think about you?

1606
01:27:20,281 --> 01:27:21,700
Do you think about that ever?

1607
01:27:22,617 --> 01:27:24,327
- I want them to
think that I'm

1608
01:27:24,369 --> 01:27:28,123
an intelligent girl
and I'm not bad.

1609
01:27:28,164 --> 01:27:30,625
I'm actually very
good and I'm smart.

1610
01:27:30,667 --> 01:27:32,002
[Director] What makes
you a very good?

1611
01:27:33,169 --> 01:27:35,046
- That I follow directions.

1612
01:27:35,964 --> 01:27:37,507
Well, sometimes.

1613
01:27:37,549 --> 01:27:38,717
[Director] What else?

1614
01:27:39,467 --> 01:27:42,804
- Um, I want them to think
that I'm not ugly.

1615
01:27:44,055 --> 01:27:47,058
(quiet music)

1616
01:27:52,147 --> 01:27:53,523
[Director] It seems
to me that one

1617
01:27:53,565 --> 01:27:55,025
of the major challenges

1618
01:27:55,066 --> 01:27:58,445
for you was a history teacher
would be teaching in a way

1619
01:27:58,486 --> 01:28:00,989
that connects with such
a diverse student body.

1620
01:28:01,031 --> 01:28:02,949
- Yes.
Yeah, it is.

1621
01:28:04,325 --> 01:28:05,952
[Director] Boston Latin
is kind of like

1622
01:28:05,994 --> 01:28:07,245
the nation in miniature

1623
01:28:07,287 --> 01:28:08,455
because it is so old

1624
01:28:08,496 --> 01:28:10,040
and it did start as

1625
01:28:10,081 --> 01:28:12,959
a segregated all
male institution.

1626
01:28:13,001 --> 01:28:14,794
- Yeah, it's the oldest school

1627
01:28:14,836 --> 01:28:19,341
in the country.
Was founded in 1635 by

1628
01:28:19,382 --> 01:28:21,760
a portion of the population
of Boston, England.

1629
01:28:21,801 --> 01:28:23,678
It was all male,
was all white.

1630
01:28:23,720 --> 01:28:26,473
It was all
people of privilege.

1631
01:28:28,308 --> 01:28:29,601
[Director] You know,
I've really come

1632
01:28:29,642 --> 01:28:31,770
to believe that part
of the purpose of history is

1633
01:28:31,811 --> 01:28:33,521
to tell a story
that unites us.

1634
01:28:33,563 --> 01:28:35,482
- Yeah.
- But in order

1635
01:28:35,523 --> 01:28:38,651
for that story to work,
we have to see ourselves as

1636
01:28:38,693 --> 01:28:40,695
being in the same
boat to begin with.

1637
01:28:40,737 --> 01:28:42,197
- Yeah.

1638
01:28:42,238 --> 01:28:43,990
- We have to see ourselves as
connected to other people.

1639
01:28:44,032 --> 01:28:45,492
- I really agree.

1640
01:28:45,533 --> 01:28:47,452
[Director] So in your
class today,

1641
01:28:47,494 --> 01:28:48,995
how do you tell a story

1642
01:28:49,037 --> 01:28:52,499
that helps these kids see
themselves as connected to all

1643
01:28:52,540 --> 01:28:54,959
the diverse people
that surround them?

1644
01:28:55,001 --> 01:28:58,713
- Well, it's important to talk
about race and the history.

1645
01:28:58,755 --> 01:29:00,965
And I want kids to understand

1646
01:29:01,007 --> 01:29:03,927
that where we are today
has its roots in the past.

1647
01:29:03,968 --> 01:29:06,805
But it's really hard to convey
the full scope of the way

1648
01:29:06,846 --> 01:29:10,517
the history of this
country plays out today.

1649
01:29:10,558 --> 01:29:14,229
And I think it's really
difficult to talk about race.

1650
01:29:14,729 --> 01:29:17,524
How do you actually help kids

1651
01:29:17,565 --> 01:29:21,027
to be different than us,
our generation,

1652
01:29:21,069 --> 01:29:23,321
who doesn't really know
how to do this very well?

1653
01:29:23,363 --> 01:29:25,365
How do you,
the only way you do

1654
01:29:25,407 --> 01:29:27,784
that is by having them do it.

1655
01:29:27,826 --> 01:29:29,661
Ok, I want to know what went

1656
01:29:29,703 --> 01:29:32,205
into place after
reconstruction.

1657
01:29:32,247 --> 01:29:33,957
Look at integration

1658
01:29:33,998 --> 01:29:37,335
of schools, fair
treatment by juries.

1659
01:29:37,377 --> 01:29:38,795
Those are the kinds of things.

1660
01:29:38,837 --> 01:29:41,464
How are we doing now?
We'll put the school

1661
01:29:41,506 --> 01:29:43,591
segregation folks
in that corner.

1662
01:29:43,633 --> 01:29:46,761
We'll put the jury selection
folks in the back corner

1663
01:29:46,803 --> 01:29:50,807
- With the black voting race,
I found that the 15th

1664
01:29:50,849 --> 01:29:53,977
Amendment,
it gave African-American males

1665
01:29:54,019 --> 01:29:56,521
the right to vote,
but they kept finding

1666
01:29:56,563 --> 01:29:58,481
loopholes to keep
them from voting.

1667
01:29:58,523 --> 01:30:01,067
And today, 13 percent are

1668
01:30:01,109 --> 01:30:04,612
prohibited from voting because
they have served in prison.

1669
01:30:06,281 --> 01:30:08,700
- Yeah?
- Ok, umm

1670
01:30:09,284 --> 01:30:11,619
well, I guess I'll say I guess

1671
01:30:11,661 --> 01:30:14,748
I think we're running out
of time, but I, I just think

1672
01:30:14,789 --> 01:30:20,045
talking about this is
really not helpful because

1673
01:30:22,547 --> 01:30:24,341
I mean, what it does is--
(school bell rings)

1674
01:30:24,382 --> 01:30:26,509
- Sit still.
- It puts people in an

1675
01:30:26,551 --> 01:30:29,679
unproductive
mindset, because what it does

1676
01:30:29,721 --> 01:30:32,766
is it makes white people feel
guilty and it makes black

1677
01:30:32,807 --> 01:30:35,185
people feel like victims.
- Don't go anywhere.

1678
01:30:35,226 --> 01:30:37,062
And I want to know

1679
01:30:37,103 --> 01:30:39,856
what people want to say back
to that, because I think it's

1680
01:30:39,898 --> 01:30:42,484
important that you have
a chance to say something.

1681
01:30:42,525 --> 01:30:44,152
So I'm going to go
with Andriana first.

1682
01:30:44,194 --> 01:30:45,528
- Like, if you're treated

1683
01:30:45,570 --> 01:30:48,740
differently because of
something you can't change,

1684
01:30:48,782 --> 01:30:50,158
why wouldn't you be a victim?

1685
01:30:50,200 --> 01:30:51,451
Like you don't have to talk

1686
01:30:51,493 --> 01:30:53,578
about something
to feel a certain way.

1687
01:30:53,620 --> 01:30:56,164
[Student] Have you?
- Yes.

1688
01:30:56,206 --> 01:31:01,127
- So I see all these hands
and we had a bell.

1689
01:31:01,169 --> 01:31:03,046
And I'm so sorry that we're

1690
01:31:03,088 --> 01:31:05,799
going to have to stop this,
but we will pick this up.

1691
01:31:05,840 --> 01:31:07,842
Look right where you are.
See your hands in the air?

1692
01:31:07,884 --> 01:31:09,219
Put your hands in the air.

1693
01:31:09,260 --> 01:31:11,680
This is where we
start tomorrow.

1694
01:31:13,348 --> 01:31:14,599
[Director] How did you
feel about the

1695
01:31:14,641 --> 01:31:15,934
conversation in
Section 41 today?

1696
01:31:15,975 --> 01:31:17,185
(gasps)

1697
01:31:17,435 --> 01:31:19,521
(nervous laughter)

1698
01:31:19,562 --> 01:31:20,605
- Terrified.

1699
01:31:20,647 --> 01:31:22,565
- The idea I wanted
to dismantle

1700
01:31:22,607 --> 01:31:25,193
is that there's like a system

1701
01:31:26,403 --> 01:31:27,987
in a place

1702
01:31:28,029 --> 01:31:29,030
like

1703
01:31:30,281 --> 01:31:32,450
that like

1704
01:31:32,492 --> 01:31:34,202
benefits white people

1705
01:31:34,244 --> 01:31:41,084
and like has a negative
effect on black people.

1706
01:31:41,126 --> 01:31:43,253
- I don't want
to squash this child.

1707
01:31:43,294 --> 01:31:44,838
He's, you know,

1708
01:31:44,879 --> 01:31:50,635
bringing sincere,
you know, and rigourous.

1709
01:31:51,720 --> 01:31:55,015
He's I think the
word he used was

1710
01:31:55,265 --> 01:31:57,017
logic.

1711
01:31:57,058 --> 01:31:58,727
He's thinking about
it logically.

1712
01:31:58,768 --> 01:32:02,647
And logic says that there's
got to be a reason for that.

1713
01:32:02,689 --> 01:32:05,191
But he doesn't have an answer
when I say, you know,

1714
01:32:05,233 --> 01:32:08,611
so what might be the reason if
you think it's not systemic

1715
01:32:08,653 --> 01:32:11,823
racism that has caused this,
what what is the reason?

1716
01:32:11,865 --> 01:32:13,324
And he says, I don't know.

1717
01:32:13,366 --> 01:32:16,870
- You shouldn't have something
to blame your problems on.

1718
01:32:16,911 --> 01:32:18,538
And I don't think that's--

1719
01:32:18,580 --> 01:32:20,123
I don't think that's
a good thing.

1720
01:32:20,165 --> 01:32:21,833
Asian-Americans here,

1721
01:32:21,875 --> 01:32:24,711
they have a hard time,
but they still succeed.

1722
01:32:24,753 --> 01:32:26,546
- That's going to be
continued tomorrow.

1723
01:32:26,588 --> 01:32:28,048
And I've got to spend my time

1724
01:32:28,089 --> 01:32:30,592
thinking tonight,
what am I going to say

1725
01:32:30,633 --> 01:32:34,054
that respects
how hard this kid is thinking

1726
01:32:34,095 --> 01:32:36,014
about these things,
which is exactly what I want

1727
01:32:36,056 --> 01:32:40,060
him to do and still push back
a little bit and say,

1728
01:32:40,101 --> 01:32:43,396
you know, so I think you're
missing some of the picture

1729
01:32:43,438 --> 01:32:46,191
here in a really
important way.

1730
01:32:48,943 --> 01:32:52,447
I gave you this document about
the Jim Crow era,

1731
01:32:52,489 --> 01:32:55,742
which was written by Michelle
Alexander in her book.

1732
01:32:55,784 --> 01:32:58,411
So as you're reading through
that, I want you thinking,

1733
01:32:58,453 --> 01:33:02,123
how did they recreate a lower
class based on race

1734
01:33:02,165 --> 01:33:03,625
after reconstruction?

1735
01:33:03,667 --> 01:33:06,461
- Black people in prison,
they auctioned off

1736
01:33:06,503 --> 01:33:09,214
the prisoners
to the highest bidder.

1737
01:33:09,255 --> 01:33:13,259
- There was a loophole about
slavery in the 13th Amendment.

1738
01:33:13,301 --> 01:33:15,303
Did anyone catch that?

1739
01:33:15,345 --> 01:33:16,596
- They outlawed slavery,

1740
01:33:16,638 --> 01:33:19,766
but it was fit
as a punishment for a crime.

1741
01:33:19,808 --> 01:33:23,186
- What she's trying to say is
that the criminal justice

1742
01:33:23,228 --> 01:33:27,565
system, it's literally like
the same thing as Jim Crow,

1743
01:33:27,607 --> 01:33:29,067
which is her point.

1744
01:33:29,109 --> 01:33:30,985
[Instructor] I think you would
say a new iteration of it.

1745
01:33:31,027 --> 01:33:32,987
That's what we're really
trying to look at,

1746
01:33:33,029 --> 01:33:35,907
is the ways
that that is still with us.

1747
01:33:35,949 --> 01:33:38,451
- That's assuming
Jim Crow has a--

1748
01:33:38,493 --> 01:33:39,577
[Instructor] A presence today?

1749
01:33:39,619 --> 01:33:41,204
- Yeah, that's your assumption.
- It is.

1750
01:33:41,246 --> 01:33:43,289
- That's not that's
not my assumption.

1751
01:33:43,331 --> 01:33:45,083
Asian-Americans are routinely

1752
01:33:45,125 --> 01:33:47,043
discriminated against when
applying for colleges.

1753
01:33:47,085 --> 01:33:48,211
They have to get about like

1754
01:33:48,253 --> 01:33:50,839
400 SAT points higher
than black people.

1755
01:33:50,880 --> 01:33:52,507
And also they're discriminated

1756
01:33:52,549 --> 01:33:54,050
against when they're
applying for jobs.

1757
01:33:54,092 --> 01:33:56,511
(school bell rings)
Your mind is so closed off

1758
01:33:56,553 --> 01:33:58,304
to certain ideas.
(students laugh)

1759
01:33:58,346 --> 01:33:59,597
- We'll continue.

1760
01:33:59,639 --> 01:34:01,307
We will continue.

1761
01:34:01,349 --> 01:34:04,352
I love that you hang in there.

1762
01:34:05,687 --> 01:34:07,981
- They're not willing to
consider certain ideas

1763
01:34:08,023 --> 01:34:09,649
because they've been taught to

1764
01:34:09,691 --> 01:34:12,736
[crosstalk]

1765
01:34:12,777 --> 01:34:15,280
- Yeah, but is the certain
idea that you're really

1766
01:34:15,321 --> 01:34:17,782
suggesting that Asians are
better than black people?

1767
01:34:17,824 --> 01:34:20,285
That's not what you're
really saying, is it?

1768
01:34:20,326 --> 01:34:21,578
- I mean,

1769
01:34:21,619 --> 01:34:24,205
I'm not saying they're
like inherently better.

1770
01:34:24,247 --> 01:34:27,000
I'm just saying their
situation is better right now.

1771
01:34:27,959 --> 01:34:30,128
- But what would you
attribute that to?

1772
01:34:31,046 --> 01:34:34,883
- Higher income,
higher representation

1773
01:34:34,924 --> 01:34:37,218
in colleges and in uhh--

1774
01:34:37,260 --> 01:34:39,262
- But why do you think
they have that?

1775
01:34:39,304 --> 01:34:41,473
And why do you think
black people don't?

1776
01:34:42,557 --> 01:34:45,018
- I don't know, I mean,
Asians are discriminated much

1777
01:34:45,060 --> 01:34:47,103
more in those areas
because--

1778
01:34:47,145 --> 01:34:49,147
- Than black people?
- Yes.

1779
01:34:49,898 --> 01:34:51,775
- We'll agree to disagree
on that point,

1780
01:34:51,816 --> 01:34:53,360
but we'll come back to it, Ok?

1781
01:34:53,401 --> 01:34:54,694
- Ok.
- All right.

1782
01:34:54,736 --> 01:34:56,821
- Well, I hope you, I
hope you look into that.

1783
01:34:56,863 --> 01:34:59,115
- I will look into it.
Good.

1784
01:34:59,157 --> 01:35:00,825
Thank you.

1785
01:35:02,035 --> 01:35:05,121
It's a revelation to me
that presenting,

1786
01:35:05,163 --> 01:35:09,084
no matter how much information
you present, sometimes

1787
01:35:09,125 --> 01:35:11,378
people are going to hear it
the way they want to hear it

1788
01:35:11,419 --> 01:35:14,381
and they're not going
to budge, at least not yet.

1789
01:35:14,422 --> 01:35:16,091
He's not.

1790
01:35:17,258 --> 01:35:20,887
But that's exactly what you're
in for when you open the door

1791
01:35:20,929 --> 01:35:22,931
to having these kinds
of conversations.

1792
01:35:22,972 --> 01:35:24,933
That's what's
hard to navigate.

1793
01:35:28,687 --> 01:35:31,231
(quiet music)

1794
01:35:47,288 --> 01:35:49,916
- We're celebrating
Confederate Heroes Day,

1795
01:35:49,958 --> 01:35:51,209
it's a Texas state holiday

1796
01:35:51,251 --> 01:35:53,628
celebrated on the 19th
of January every year,

1797
01:35:53,670 --> 01:35:56,256
which is also
Robert E. Lee's birthday.

1798
01:35:56,297 --> 01:35:59,009
- The bill was filed by a
representative from Pensacola.

1799
01:35:59,050 --> 01:36:01,219
It says that a memorial can't

1800
01:36:01,261 --> 01:36:03,972
be moved unless it needs
to be refurbished.

1801
01:36:04,014 --> 01:36:05,849
- This monument right here

1802
01:36:05,890 --> 01:36:08,435
outside the old courthouse
in downtown Pittsboro was

1803
01:36:08,476 --> 01:36:10,103
given to the county by the

1804
01:36:10,145 --> 01:36:13,023
Daughters of the Confederacy
back in the early 1900's.

1805
01:36:13,064 --> 01:36:15,316
- I'm in favor of the
statues staying.

1806
01:36:16,359 --> 01:36:20,321
A lot of ancestors of mine
had fought and died.

1807
01:36:20,613 --> 01:36:23,366
And they didn't
die for slavery.

1808
01:36:24,367 --> 01:36:25,827
They had no slaves.

1809
01:36:25,869 --> 01:36:27,620
(applause)

1810
01:36:28,163 --> 01:36:32,250
(crowd chanting and yelling)

1811
01:36:32,500 --> 01:36:35,420
[Crowd] Pull! Pull!

1812
01:36:40,258 --> 01:36:44,888
(crowd yelling and cheering)

1813
01:36:57,609 --> 01:36:59,611
(applause)

1814
01:37:01,446 --> 01:37:04,824
- Story starts with seeing
the monuments,

1815
01:37:04,866 --> 01:37:07,535
but it's also about being
in this black body.

1816
01:37:07,577 --> 01:37:09,871
What does that feel like
to have your country,

1817
01:37:09,913 --> 01:37:13,291
your nation say this
is what we stand by?

1818
01:37:13,333 --> 01:37:17,420
No. We want more,
we demand more.

1819
01:37:17,962 --> 01:37:21,174
We say yes to something
that looks like us.

1820
01:37:21,216 --> 01:37:23,426
We say yes to inclusivity.

1821
01:37:25,053 --> 01:37:28,264
We say yes to broader notions

1822
01:37:28,306 --> 01:37:30,058
of what it means
to be an American.

1823
01:37:33,436 --> 01:37:36,398
(dramatic music)

1824
01:37:50,578 --> 01:37:53,915
(dramatic music)