1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 3 00:00:38,275 --> 00:00:40,448 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five, six. 4 00:02:25,034 --> 00:02:28,413 -It was a unique case. 5 00:02:28,517 --> 00:02:29,965 The end of 1969. 6 00:02:30,068 --> 00:02:32,896 We'd never had a kidnapping in Britain. 7 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,206 They just didn't know what was happening. 8 00:02:35,310 --> 00:02:40,724 We didn't have the scientific progress we've had today. 9 00:02:40,827 --> 00:02:42,827 I mean, it's horrifying. 10 00:02:42,931 --> 00:02:44,758 -Since she disappeared early yesterday evening, 11 00:02:44,862 --> 00:02:46,758 there have been a number of telephone calls 12 00:02:46,862 --> 00:02:48,413 demanding ransom money. 13 00:02:48,517 --> 00:02:50,103 -I opened the door only to find 14 00:02:50,206 --> 00:02:51,758 things scattered on the floor, 15 00:02:51,862 --> 00:02:55,413 which had come from her handbag. 16 00:02:55,517 --> 00:02:59,310 Telephone was lying on the floor. 17 00:02:59,413 --> 00:03:04,620 The, uh, chair was... some disarray. 18 00:03:04,724 --> 00:03:08,620 And then I noticed this machete. 19 00:03:08,724 --> 00:03:11,482 -Mr. McKay came home last night expecting to meet his wife, 20 00:03:11,586 --> 00:03:13,413 who should have been indoors. 21 00:03:13,517 --> 00:03:16,034 The doors were open, wife wasn't there. 22 00:03:16,137 --> 00:03:18,310 We're treating this as an abduction. 23 00:03:18,413 --> 00:03:21,275 -The police did not know what to do. 24 00:03:21,379 --> 00:03:23,965 No police force had ever dealt with a kidnapping case. 25 00:03:24,068 --> 00:03:27,344 Not only was that, but there was no Mrs. McKay. 26 00:03:27,448 --> 00:03:30,724 There was no evidence that she was dead or alive. 27 00:03:33,034 --> 00:03:35,103 -This woman is this is Mrs. McKay. 28 00:03:35,206 --> 00:03:38,103 She was wearing a medium green knitted suit, 29 00:03:38,206 --> 00:03:40,413 just below the knee. 30 00:03:40,517 --> 00:03:42,551 Probably wearing low-heeled shoes. 31 00:03:42,655 --> 00:03:46,000 -To us, a million pounds ransom is just incredible anyway. 32 00:03:46,103 --> 00:03:48,758 My mother hasn't any enemies. 33 00:03:52,655 --> 00:03:55,482 -And I would say this to whoever has got my mother-in-law: 34 00:03:55,586 --> 00:03:57,310 he's not going to crack this family. 35 00:03:57,413 --> 00:04:02,827 We've got plenty of... reserves yet. 36 00:04:02,931 --> 00:04:04,517 -My heart went out to them. 37 00:04:04,620 --> 00:04:06,068 How can you suddenly lose 38 00:04:06,172 --> 00:04:09,310 a mother and a wife just like that? 39 00:04:20,689 --> 00:04:25,172 -We're looking back to a different time. 40 00:04:31,551 --> 00:04:34,310 -My mother, she met my father 41 00:04:34,413 --> 00:04:37,724 when she was still probably a schoolgirl. 42 00:04:37,827 --> 00:04:41,137 They were engaged at 18 and married at 21, 43 00:04:41,241 --> 00:04:44,103 which is what you did in those days, I think. 44 00:04:44,206 --> 00:04:48,620 Then I was born when she was 23. 45 00:04:48,724 --> 00:04:51,758 And my mother won an art scholarship 46 00:04:51,862 --> 00:04:54,206 and somebody must have dissuaded her from that. 47 00:04:54,310 --> 00:04:55,655 You know, "Oh, you don't want to do that. 48 00:04:55,758 --> 00:04:57,344 You're not going to be an artist. 49 00:04:57,448 --> 00:04:58,724 You're going to be a mother, you know, 50 00:04:58,827 --> 00:05:00,206 and have lots of babies." 51 00:05:03,862 --> 00:05:07,551 The Murdochs were from Adelaide, 52 00:05:07,655 --> 00:05:10,344 my father -- first job in newspapers, 53 00:05:10,448 --> 00:05:14,862 was working for Rupert Murdoch's father 54 00:05:14,965 --> 00:05:16,137 with South Australian people, 55 00:05:16,241 --> 00:05:18,172 which tend to think of themselves 56 00:05:18,275 --> 00:05:21,689 as a bit sort of special. 57 00:05:21,793 --> 00:05:25,862 Not the same as the other ones. 58 00:05:25,965 --> 00:05:28,689 Nice memories. We had some lovely times. 59 00:05:30,793 --> 00:05:35,241 -"The Daily Mirror" from London offered my father a big job, 60 00:05:35,344 --> 00:05:38,724 a directorship, and it really uprooted us. 61 00:05:38,827 --> 00:05:41,689 I mean, to take away 16 year old 62 00:05:41,793 --> 00:05:44,931 from all their friends. 63 00:05:45,034 --> 00:05:48,172 But my father just took us all away, that was it. 64 00:05:48,275 --> 00:05:52,068 We were scooped up and dumped in London. 65 00:05:52,172 --> 00:05:53,482 I would have had a very different life 66 00:05:53,586 --> 00:05:56,344 had we stayed there. 67 00:05:56,448 --> 00:06:00,448 My father then moved on to be with Rupert. 68 00:06:02,310 --> 00:06:06,103 -We moved into that house in 1958. 69 00:06:06,206 --> 00:06:10,206 It was a happy place to be. 70 00:06:10,310 --> 00:06:13,448 It was absolute heaven in the summer when the tennis was on. 71 00:06:13,551 --> 00:06:15,724 -The first day of Wimbledon fortnight. 72 00:06:15,827 --> 00:06:17,517 The favorite spot for the fashion parade 73 00:06:17,620 --> 00:06:19,137 is just outside the center court. 74 00:06:19,241 --> 00:06:22,206 -Everybody came and parked, you know, tried. 75 00:06:22,310 --> 00:06:24,689 -...celebrities too -- there's Mrs. Chris Madden, 76 00:06:24,793 --> 00:06:26,275 the wife of the number-four seed. 77 00:06:28,448 --> 00:06:32,275 -They were very Victorian parents. 78 00:06:32,379 --> 00:06:34,034 And they all got married too young 79 00:06:34,137 --> 00:06:37,379 because it was one acceptable way of leaving home. 80 00:06:37,482 --> 00:06:41,379 And that's what happened to me. 81 00:06:41,482 --> 00:06:45,620 We had a nice life, but somebody came along and jumped on that. 82 00:06:51,620 --> 00:06:56,137 -It's 1969. 83 00:06:56,241 --> 00:06:57,793 My parents have been staying with us 84 00:06:57,896 --> 00:07:01,034 for two nights over Christmas. 85 00:07:03,310 --> 00:07:07,000 -Then they'd gone back to London. 86 00:07:07,103 --> 00:07:10,275 My father had work to do. 87 00:07:15,413 --> 00:07:18,068 -...with the market report for farmers. 88 00:07:18,172 --> 00:07:19,517 So until then, 89 00:07:19,620 --> 00:07:23,758 ladies and gentlemen, goodnight to you all. 90 00:07:23,862 --> 00:07:25,275 Good night. 91 00:07:28,275 --> 00:07:29,827 -The phone rang. 92 00:07:29,931 --> 00:07:33,482 That was my father, and he said, "Your mother's gone." 93 00:07:35,482 --> 00:07:38,068 And we froze, and he said, "I don't know, 94 00:07:38,172 --> 00:07:39,827 maybe there's been another burglary." 95 00:07:39,931 --> 00:07:41,655 There had been a burglary a few months earlier 96 00:07:41,758 --> 00:07:44,310 and she was pretty freaked out by that. 97 00:07:46,379 --> 00:07:48,482 -I was the night duty CO of the area. 98 00:07:51,034 --> 00:07:55,724 And when I got there, I saw damage to the inside porch door. 99 00:07:55,827 --> 00:07:59,172 There were also senior members of the Fleet Street press 100 00:07:59,275 --> 00:08:01,103 who were friendly with Mr McKay, 101 00:08:01,206 --> 00:08:03,172 influential men -- 102 00:08:03,275 --> 00:08:05,862 fortunately, some of them who had access to 103 00:08:05,965 --> 00:08:08,310 Number 10 Downing Street. 104 00:08:10,275 --> 00:08:15,000 -The drama of the entrance hall with the phone on the floor... 105 00:08:15,103 --> 00:08:17,827 You know, the desk in the hall with the knife, 106 00:08:17,931 --> 00:08:19,275 the big bell hook, 107 00:08:19,379 --> 00:08:22,275 the string, the twine -- all that was all there. 108 00:08:23,586 --> 00:08:25,172 -The uniform chief superintendent 109 00:08:25,275 --> 00:08:28,551 was a little bit skeptical. 110 00:08:28,655 --> 00:08:33,000 He thought that this was a Fleet Street stunt. 111 00:08:33,103 --> 00:08:37,448 Either that or Mrs. McKay had gone of her own free will. 112 00:08:37,551 --> 00:08:41,206 -It was horror! It was a horror scene. 113 00:08:41,310 --> 00:08:44,172 I mean, it was so obvious that something terrible had happened, 114 00:08:44,275 --> 00:08:45,758 it was just obvious. 115 00:08:45,862 --> 00:08:47,448 And then when the police came and they started saying, 116 00:08:47,551 --> 00:08:49,413 "Oh, no, your mother, she's run away with her lover, 117 00:08:49,517 --> 00:08:51,586 she's gone to Aus--" You don't know my mother! 118 00:08:51,689 --> 00:08:53,206 I'm telling you my mother is not -- 119 00:08:53,310 --> 00:08:56,896 this is -- something violent has happened! 120 00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,448 And the door was broken -- come on, you know? 121 00:08:59,551 --> 00:09:02,206 They were -- I'm sorry, I don't have a lot of respect 122 00:09:02,310 --> 00:09:05,413 for the police. 123 00:09:05,517 --> 00:09:07,931 We expected some sort of telephone call 124 00:09:08,034 --> 00:09:11,793 because telephone disk, with the number on it, 125 00:09:11,896 --> 00:09:15,620 had been removed and was gone. 126 00:09:15,724 --> 00:09:18,103 I sat by that phone all night. 127 00:09:26,827 --> 00:09:29,931 'Course, we didn't have anything to record with. 128 00:09:30,034 --> 00:09:34,551 -We were somewhat unprofessional in those days. 129 00:09:34,655 --> 00:09:36,068 I managed to get the extension 130 00:09:36,172 --> 00:09:39,137 and overheard the initial contact. 131 00:09:39,241 --> 00:09:41,965 This is a transcript of the notes I made. 132 00:09:44,206 --> 00:09:47,206 "This is Mafia Group 3. 133 00:09:47,310 --> 00:09:50,172 We are from America. Mafia M3." 134 00:09:50,275 --> 00:09:52,758 "We tried to get Rupert Murdoch's wife. 135 00:09:52,862 --> 00:09:56,655 We couldn't get her so we took yours instead." 136 00:09:56,758 --> 00:10:00,586 "You will need a million pounds by Wednesday." 137 00:10:00,689 --> 00:10:02,827 -And it was pretty horrific. 138 00:10:02,931 --> 00:10:06,137 And I said, "That man has the accent of a foreigner. 139 00:10:06,241 --> 00:10:09,068 He has an accent of the Caribbean, I think." 140 00:10:21,482 --> 00:10:25,172 -It was really a very extraordinary case. 141 00:10:27,206 --> 00:10:30,965 Which became a major issue publicly. 142 00:10:32,586 --> 00:10:36,344 And it was a case which had an impact 143 00:10:36,448 --> 00:10:39,896 on the relationship of West Indians in London 144 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:42,034 to other people as well. 145 00:10:42,137 --> 00:10:44,689 Some people saw it as a deliberate attempt 146 00:10:44,793 --> 00:10:46,517 to frame West Indians 147 00:10:46,620 --> 00:10:49,758 for the kidnapping of an Australian white woman. 148 00:11:26,310 --> 00:11:29,206 -Already their coming has caused a national controversy. 149 00:11:29,310 --> 00:11:31,620 But one point must always be borne in mind: 150 00:11:31,724 --> 00:11:34,103 Whatever our feelings, we cannot deny them entry, 151 00:11:34,206 --> 00:11:35,620 for all our British citizens 152 00:11:35,724 --> 00:11:37,724 are entitled to the identical rights 153 00:11:37,827 --> 00:11:39,758 of any member of the Empire. 154 00:11:39,862 --> 00:11:44,034 -We will fight you back with every bone, every nerve, 155 00:11:44,137 --> 00:11:47,000 every feeling, every ounce of blood we've got! 156 00:11:47,103 --> 00:11:50,724 We will have our country back! 157 00:12:00,620 --> 00:12:03,310 -I don't think any Black person 158 00:12:03,413 --> 00:12:06,827 who was prepared for what they found in Britain. 159 00:12:08,931 --> 00:12:11,586 Many of us had been invited, 160 00:12:11,689 --> 00:12:14,965 actively recruited, to come to work here. 161 00:12:15,068 --> 00:12:16,896 -They're nothing but a scourge, 162 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:20,310 I would deport them tomorrow if I had my way. 163 00:12:22,413 --> 00:12:27,034 -I didn't expect us to be seen as an alien force 164 00:12:27,137 --> 00:12:29,413 that was unwanted in Britain. 165 00:14:11,137 --> 00:14:12,586 -I was amazed they were brothers, 166 00:14:12,689 --> 00:14:14,655 they were so different. 167 00:14:14,758 --> 00:14:17,896 Arthur did what Arthur wanted to do, 168 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:21,586 and he felt that things revolved round him. 169 00:14:21,689 --> 00:14:23,034 And I had that instinct 170 00:14:23,137 --> 00:14:26,586 that there was something peculiar going on here. 171 00:14:26,689 --> 00:14:32,310 Was a most unusual man -- black mustache, glaring eyes. 172 00:14:32,413 --> 00:14:36,344 Arthur, to my mind, was like a panther ready to pounce. 173 00:14:39,448 --> 00:14:44,517 Nizamodeen was a very retiring young man -- 174 00:14:44,620 --> 00:14:47,517 pale, not very strong. 175 00:14:47,620 --> 00:14:50,137 He'd only been in Britain for a few months. 176 00:14:50,241 --> 00:14:53,724 He was totally dependent on his brother, Arthur. 177 00:15:16,965 --> 00:15:19,827 -It was -- it was lovely on the farm. 178 00:15:19,931 --> 00:15:25,758 We had cows, things like that; chickens. 179 00:15:25,862 --> 00:15:27,137 It was nice. 180 00:15:27,241 --> 00:15:29,000 It was big. 181 00:15:29,103 --> 00:15:30,862 It's really nice. 182 00:15:34,344 --> 00:15:38,620 Nizam -- he's my Uncle Nizam -- I love him. 183 00:15:38,724 --> 00:15:44,103 I just love him, and brings back so good memories again, 184 00:15:44,206 --> 00:15:46,275 just hearing his name. 185 00:15:46,379 --> 00:15:48,482 He was lovely. 186 00:15:48,586 --> 00:15:52,206 He played with us, made me laugh. 187 00:16:15,551 --> 00:16:18,034 Nizam, he was lovely. 188 00:16:19,827 --> 00:16:23,137 He's a normal 21 year old guy. 189 00:16:23,241 --> 00:16:27,655 How can he do anything like that? 190 00:16:27,758 --> 00:16:31,413 There are questions all over this case. 191 00:17:59,655 --> 00:18:03,206 -By 1968, his newspaper empire was flourishing 192 00:18:03,310 --> 00:18:06,965 and Rupert Murdoch had emerged as a powerful press baron 193 00:18:07,068 --> 00:18:10,241 now keen to seek new titles in the old world. 194 00:18:15,344 --> 00:18:17,517 After a ferocious takeover battle, 195 00:18:17,620 --> 00:18:19,448 the News of the World was his, 196 00:18:19,551 --> 00:18:23,413 and before long, London began to notice Rupert Murdoch. 197 00:18:25,551 --> 00:18:29,482 -Rupert Murdoch on his way to his office by Rolls-Royce. 198 00:18:29,586 --> 00:18:31,379 He's chubby cheeked and open face, 199 00:18:31,482 --> 00:18:33,896 but underneath, say those who know him, 200 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,758 he's a man of steel. 201 00:18:36,862 --> 00:18:39,448 If he succeeds in gathering the News of the Worldreins 202 00:18:39,551 --> 00:18:41,655 into his hands, it's likely they'll be in 203 00:18:41,758 --> 00:18:44,275 for some pretty aggressive management. 204 00:18:47,586 --> 00:18:49,379 -Was buying into the News of the World 205 00:18:49,482 --> 00:18:51,827 your own idea, or was it suggested from someone else? 206 00:18:51,931 --> 00:18:54,241 -Entirely my own idea. -And what is your motive? 207 00:18:54,344 --> 00:18:56,172 -To expand my own newspaper chain. 208 00:19:15,034 --> 00:19:18,344 -Of course one enjoys the feeling of power, 209 00:19:18,448 --> 00:19:19,965 although... 210 00:19:48,275 --> 00:19:52,793 -Rooks Farm, it was frightening for me 211 00:19:52,896 --> 00:19:56,172 because Arthur was so vicious. 212 00:19:56,275 --> 00:20:00,172 We are to go under the table 213 00:20:00,275 --> 00:20:01,862 and, um, 214 00:20:01,965 --> 00:20:05,275 watch him -- him beat up my mother. 215 00:20:07,689 --> 00:20:09,655 Very lovable, and then, 216 00:20:09,758 --> 00:20:13,896 all of a sudden, he would change into a monster, 217 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:17,862 and she would get beaten up. 218 00:20:17,965 --> 00:20:22,344 When I was nine years old... 219 00:20:22,448 --> 00:20:25,103 Yeah, that was life at home. 220 00:20:46,862 --> 00:20:50,482 -My mum was in a hairdresser shop in Hackney, 221 00:20:50,586 --> 00:20:53,413 and they met because he was working in the basement 222 00:20:53,517 --> 00:20:55,103 as a tailor. 223 00:20:55,206 --> 00:20:58,103 So consequently, they got together 224 00:20:58,206 --> 00:21:00,344 and she left my dad, 225 00:21:00,448 --> 00:21:03,551 and went with this guy 226 00:21:03,655 --> 00:21:06,448 who we knew nothing about. 227 00:21:06,551 --> 00:21:10,241 And that was it -- didn't see mum for a long time. 228 00:21:12,172 --> 00:21:14,620 -...get your blindfolds on immediately, if you will, 229 00:21:14,724 --> 00:21:16,689 panel, because this will give you some idea... 230 00:21:19,862 --> 00:21:22,896 -As soon as we heard a car come up, 231 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:26,758 we knew he's coming back again, and we were all scared. 232 00:21:26,862 --> 00:21:29,344 Nizam, he was scared. 233 00:21:29,448 --> 00:21:31,413 He was really scared. 234 00:22:30,655 --> 00:22:33,172 -I got a phone call at 5:30 in the morning, 235 00:22:33,275 --> 00:22:34,586 and tell me to get out of bed 236 00:22:34,689 --> 00:22:37,310 and get down to Arthur Road in Wimbledon. 237 00:22:37,413 --> 00:22:41,793 And very quickly they built up a sort of Fleet Street 238 00:22:41,896 --> 00:22:43,517 sort of siege of people. 239 00:22:43,620 --> 00:22:45,827 -Should have seen the press -- we had vans, 240 00:22:45,931 --> 00:22:48,275 we had television from all over the world. 241 00:22:48,379 --> 00:22:50,586 -The first thing you do when you get involved in this is 242 00:22:50,689 --> 00:22:52,758 find out where the police drink. 243 00:22:52,862 --> 00:22:56,310 Because journalists and police lives 244 00:22:56,413 --> 00:22:58,758 revolved around the pub, largely. 245 00:22:58,862 --> 00:23:00,551 Over the months there. I mean, I really got to know 246 00:23:00,655 --> 00:23:03,000 some of them really quite well. 247 00:23:03,103 --> 00:23:07,241 And every evening I'd be in there talking to police. 248 00:23:07,344 --> 00:23:09,206 It emerged quite early on that 249 00:23:09,310 --> 00:23:10,793 when Murdoch had gone off to Australia, 250 00:23:10,896 --> 00:23:14,551 he'd left his car and his chauffeur 251 00:23:14,655 --> 00:23:17,586 for Alick McKay to use. 252 00:23:17,689 --> 00:23:23,034 So we put two and two together and got four quite quickly. 253 00:23:23,137 --> 00:23:24,586 -Well, he was using Rupert's car 254 00:23:24,689 --> 00:23:26,000 because Rupert said to him, 255 00:23:26,103 --> 00:23:28,448 "I'm going to Australia, look after the shop" -- 256 00:23:28,551 --> 00:23:30,586 that's how it was, it was that casual. 257 00:23:32,448 --> 00:23:33,758 -The police are the first to admit 258 00:23:33,862 --> 00:23:35,344 it's one of the most baffling mysteries 259 00:23:35,448 --> 00:23:36,655 they've ever experienced... 260 00:23:36,758 --> 00:23:37,931 -...disappeared early yesterday evening 261 00:23:38,034 --> 00:23:39,724 there have been a number of telephone calls 262 00:23:39,827 --> 00:23:41,482 demanding ransom money. 263 00:23:41,586 --> 00:23:44,344 -...more than 150 police are involved in the investigation. 264 00:23:44,448 --> 00:23:48,137 But their night and day efforts have produced nothing. 265 00:23:48,241 --> 00:23:49,620 -They'd never heard anything like that. 266 00:23:49,724 --> 00:23:52,068 They kept saying, "This is not an English crime." 267 00:23:52,172 --> 00:23:53,724 I mean, they suspected my father. 268 00:23:53,827 --> 00:23:55,310 It was so ridiculous. 269 00:24:00,551 --> 00:24:03,482 -There was some amazing competition in Fleet Street 270 00:24:03,586 --> 00:24:04,931 in the '60s, 271 00:24:05,034 --> 00:24:06,793 and news stories -- 272 00:24:06,896 --> 00:24:11,310 especially stories about crime, stories about sex -- 273 00:24:11,413 --> 00:24:15,551 were the great currency of the time. 274 00:24:15,655 --> 00:24:18,551 You know, you had a rampant Daily Express, 275 00:24:18,655 --> 00:24:20,862 a rampant Daily Mirror, 276 00:24:20,965 --> 00:24:24,758 the Daily Sketch -- long forgotten now; 277 00:24:24,862 --> 00:24:27,000 these popular tabloids 278 00:24:27,103 --> 00:24:28,689 were being taken on 279 00:24:28,793 --> 00:24:35,034 by the Sun --itself an aggressive news gatherer. 280 00:24:35,137 --> 00:24:41,482 So the British press galvanized by the idea that it involved 281 00:24:41,586 --> 00:24:43,551 Rupert Murdoch's deputy, 282 00:24:43,655 --> 00:24:45,413 that it was that close to home. 283 00:24:45,517 --> 00:24:47,965 -You were the intended target for the kidnapers. 284 00:24:48,068 --> 00:24:49,862 -Yes. 285 00:24:49,965 --> 00:24:51,793 -That must be a nightmare. 286 00:24:51,896 --> 00:24:55,827 -It wasn't so bad for us as it was for Alick McKay. 287 00:24:55,931 --> 00:24:57,655 But certainly one has to think about it. 288 00:24:57,758 --> 00:25:03,827 And it colored my time there in Britain after that happened. 289 00:25:03,931 --> 00:25:06,275 -At the time, the Sun was literally 290 00:25:06,379 --> 00:25:09,655 in its second month of being under Rupert Murdoch. 291 00:25:09,758 --> 00:25:13,172 So this was an amazing turn of events to happen 292 00:25:13,275 --> 00:25:15,689 within two months of the newspaper starting. 293 00:25:15,793 --> 00:25:18,344 -Mr. Murdoch, sir? 294 00:25:18,448 --> 00:25:21,517 -My father was in constant touch with Rupert. 295 00:25:21,620 --> 00:25:24,793 Rupert had evidently said, "I'll be on the next plane," 296 00:25:24,896 --> 00:25:26,275 and and my father said, 297 00:25:26,379 --> 00:25:29,241 "No, you will not, you will not, you will not." 298 00:25:29,344 --> 00:25:31,862 Obviously, Rupert Murdoch was terrified that, 299 00:25:31,965 --> 00:25:34,827 because we thought it was maybe the IRA or the Mafia, 300 00:25:34,931 --> 00:25:37,448 or that they realizing they had got the wrong person 301 00:25:37,551 --> 00:25:39,827 would start reaching out to him where he was, 302 00:25:39,931 --> 00:25:41,827 which is a long way away. 303 00:25:41,931 --> 00:25:44,689 And so he did not come back. 304 00:25:49,758 --> 00:25:52,551 -What about the ransom, the million pounds? 305 00:25:52,655 --> 00:25:55,103 -Somebody doesn't know anything about money, that's all, 306 00:25:55,206 --> 00:25:56,379 it's just -- it's just a sum, 307 00:25:56,482 --> 00:25:58,586 I would think someone had their eye on. 308 00:25:58,689 --> 00:26:00,344 -What about the thought that they might want 309 00:26:00,448 --> 00:26:02,586 to extort it from from the company, 310 00:26:02,689 --> 00:26:04,034 from the News of the World? 311 00:26:04,137 --> 00:26:05,758 -I don't know that the News of the World 312 00:26:05,862 --> 00:26:08,413 even got a million pounds -- it's a lot of money, isn't it? 313 00:26:08,517 --> 00:26:10,068 It was always a million. It was always a million. 314 00:26:10,172 --> 00:26:12,034 "We want a million pounds." 315 00:26:12,137 --> 00:26:17,310 £15-20 million in today's money. 316 00:26:17,413 --> 00:26:20,689 That's a lot of money. 317 00:26:20,793 --> 00:26:22,586 -Hello? -Hello? 318 00:26:22,689 --> 00:26:24,068 -Yeah. -Hello, I don't know who I'm speaking to. 319 00:26:24,172 --> 00:26:26,896 I don't recognize her voice. -I'm M3. 320 00:26:30,413 --> 00:26:31,689 Huh? 321 00:27:04,689 --> 00:27:07,896 -Electric, it was horrific, the stress, 322 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,034 and I think it actually -- 323 00:27:10,137 --> 00:27:12,689 it destroyed my emotions, I couldn't feel emotion. 324 00:27:12,793 --> 00:27:15,517 I could never cry. I never cried. 325 00:27:15,620 --> 00:27:17,724 It just was so awful. 326 00:27:17,827 --> 00:27:20,793 It was beyond awful. 327 00:27:20,896 --> 00:27:24,275 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five six. 328 00:27:24,379 --> 00:27:25,586 Who's calling? -Since she disappeared? 329 00:27:25,689 --> 00:27:27,413 There have been a number of telephone calls 330 00:27:27,517 --> 00:27:30,275 demanding ransom money, both to her home 331 00:27:30,379 --> 00:27:31,965 and to the News of the Worldoffices, 332 00:27:32,068 --> 00:27:33,586 where her husband, Mr, Alick McKay, 333 00:27:33,689 --> 00:27:36,000 is on the board of directors. 334 00:27:36,103 --> 00:27:40,586 -We had a whole van load, probably thousands of papers -- 335 00:27:40,689 --> 00:27:42,551 this is all News of the Worldpapers -- 336 00:27:42,655 --> 00:27:44,586 to try and find out if the press had been 337 00:27:44,689 --> 00:27:47,310 particularly hard on somebody 338 00:27:47,413 --> 00:27:49,517 who was -- who ended up being a crook 339 00:27:49,620 --> 00:27:51,896 and who might have done this to us. 340 00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:56,931 You know, who has been offended by the press? 341 00:27:57,034 --> 00:27:58,724 -I think everybody's trying to find out from nobody else 342 00:27:58,827 --> 00:28:00,551 what really was going on. 343 00:28:00,655 --> 00:28:02,241 It's a hard world to imagine, 344 00:28:02,344 --> 00:28:05,068 but you have to realize that the police had no idea, 345 00:28:05,172 --> 00:28:06,586 I think, how to deal with this crime. 346 00:28:06,689 --> 00:28:08,034 It was such an extraordinary thing. 347 00:28:08,137 --> 00:28:09,827 -We're treating this as an abduction. 348 00:28:09,931 --> 00:28:12,206 -What's the difference between that and kidnapping, in fact? 349 00:28:12,310 --> 00:28:14,413 -Well, abduction is the correct term to use. 350 00:28:14,517 --> 00:28:16,689 Kidnapping is a slang for it. 351 00:28:16,793 --> 00:28:21,413 -It remained very much a Wimbledon cop is looking into 352 00:28:21,517 --> 00:28:24,689 what was a huge story. 353 00:28:24,793 --> 00:28:28,655 At times, there was element of amateur about anything. 354 00:28:28,758 --> 00:28:31,379 The police, they decided for some reason 355 00:28:31,482 --> 00:28:34,310 that they should have an observation van in the road, 356 00:28:34,413 --> 00:28:39,344 full of policemen looking at us, looking at the house, 357 00:28:39,448 --> 00:28:41,034 which was pretty farcical, I can't imagine. 358 00:28:41,137 --> 00:28:43,344 I do remember going out and sort of banging on the door 359 00:28:43,448 --> 00:28:44,793 and laughing and thinking -- 360 00:28:44,896 --> 00:28:46,689 I mean, they didn't know who they were looking for 361 00:28:46,793 --> 00:28:49,689 and there were no hostage negotiators. 362 00:28:49,793 --> 00:28:53,965 They didn't know whether she was alive or dead for certainly. 363 00:28:55,793 --> 00:28:57,724 -I just cannot understand 364 00:28:57,827 --> 00:29:02,206 why those holding Muriel have not contacted me recently. 365 00:29:02,310 --> 00:29:05,241 I appeal to you to contact me 366 00:29:05,344 --> 00:29:08,931 by telephone, letter, or telegram. 367 00:29:09,034 --> 00:29:11,344 -Should never have gone to the press, 368 00:29:11,448 --> 00:29:12,758 is all I thought by. 369 00:29:12,862 --> 00:29:15,448 Getting the press involved and the publicity, 370 00:29:15,551 --> 00:29:17,862 it would make her too hot to handle 371 00:29:17,965 --> 00:29:19,586 to let her go. 372 00:29:19,689 --> 00:29:23,482 -Bill Smith, who was a good cop that was going places, 373 00:29:23,586 --> 00:29:25,931 but they were out of their depth. 374 00:29:26,034 --> 00:29:29,620 This is still a time of the Wild West in Fleet Street, 375 00:29:29,724 --> 00:29:34,103 and reporters trespassed, they bugged, they... 376 00:29:34,206 --> 00:29:36,310 they did all sorts of things 377 00:29:36,413 --> 00:29:38,758 that would later become to be outlawed. 378 00:29:38,862 --> 00:29:41,793 -We had the house phone, which was the original number 379 00:29:41,896 --> 00:29:45,034 which we had to keep open for the criminals, 380 00:29:45,137 --> 00:29:47,586 'cause they had that number. 381 00:29:47,689 --> 00:29:49,586 But unfortunately, everyone else in the world 382 00:29:49,689 --> 00:29:54,068 had that number, too, after about 24 hours. 383 00:29:54,172 --> 00:29:56,827 -It would not have been a strange thing to have done 384 00:29:56,931 --> 00:29:59,965 at the time, and I'm sure that the Sun 385 00:30:00,068 --> 00:30:02,241 were outraged that the Daily Mirrordid it 386 00:30:02,344 --> 00:30:05,517 for two reasons -- one, because it was an intrusion into privacy 387 00:30:05,620 --> 00:30:07,344 of their man, but secondly, 388 00:30:07,448 --> 00:30:08,931 because they hadn't done it themselves. 389 00:30:09,034 --> 00:30:11,275 That they had been beaten, as it were. 390 00:30:13,482 --> 00:30:14,896 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five six. 391 00:30:32,758 --> 00:30:35,965 -We've got one day to contact, another telephone call, 392 00:30:36,068 --> 00:30:38,793 then nothing at all for almost a fortnight -- 393 00:30:38,896 --> 00:30:41,275 no doubt due to the publicity 394 00:30:41,379 --> 00:30:44,068 that was given to the case in every paper 395 00:30:44,172 --> 00:30:46,931 and every television news broadcast. 396 00:30:47,034 --> 00:30:49,862 And I think this delayed the kidnapers from coming forward 397 00:30:49,965 --> 00:30:53,137 on probably delayed this case up to 14 days. 398 00:30:55,689 --> 00:30:58,482 -Information was coming out, it was coming from the police. 399 00:30:58,586 --> 00:31:00,103 The police leaked like a sieve. 400 00:31:00,206 --> 00:31:02,241 -Some some people would drink 401 00:31:02,344 --> 00:31:04,965 quite a lot of my father's whiskey. 402 00:31:05,068 --> 00:31:08,827 The police were very good at that. 403 00:31:08,931 --> 00:31:14,551 I can remember my father going to fetch another crate 404 00:31:14,655 --> 00:31:17,517 of Black Label -- not a bottle, but another crate, 405 00:31:17,620 --> 00:31:20,103 from where he kept them all. 406 00:31:22,034 --> 00:31:24,034 -Nine four six two six five six. 407 00:31:38,758 --> 00:31:40,068 -Yes. 408 00:31:43,724 --> 00:31:45,724 -And the family trying to trace the missing woman 409 00:31:45,827 --> 00:31:49,275 have been turning to other methods, including spiritualism. 410 00:31:49,379 --> 00:31:52,827 Mrs. McKay's son-in-law, Mr. David Dyer, explained. 411 00:31:52,931 --> 00:31:56,275 -We have a very open mind -- if we get something 412 00:31:56,379 --> 00:31:58,689 that says that it's just something that you say, 413 00:31:58,793 --> 00:32:00,310 well, maybe. 414 00:32:00,413 --> 00:32:03,793 -We were not a family of spiritualist at all, 415 00:32:03,896 --> 00:32:05,172 but suddenly we thought, 416 00:32:05,275 --> 00:32:06,758 "Well, maybe there's something in that. 417 00:32:06,862 --> 00:32:08,034 Maybe someone can help us, 418 00:32:08,137 --> 00:32:09,758 because they're not helping us -- 419 00:32:09,862 --> 00:32:12,241 the police aren't doing anything." 420 00:32:12,344 --> 00:32:14,896 I mean, I remember one man and he came 421 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:18,241 and he actually said, "I keep getting this name, 422 00:32:18,344 --> 00:32:23,344 this name," and he'd say, "Elsa, Elsa." 423 00:32:23,448 --> 00:32:25,758 This is really spine chilling stuff. 424 00:32:39,965 --> 00:32:45,620 -He first wants to see if the woman was alive or dead. 425 00:32:48,482 --> 00:32:53,103 -Uh, "through my opinion, she is still alive." 426 00:32:54,896 --> 00:32:56,413 -You'll try anything. 427 00:32:56,517 --> 00:32:59,241 And he was fascinating. 428 00:33:02,172 --> 00:33:06,103 He described the farmhouse and the pond. 429 00:33:06,206 --> 00:33:10,482 So what do you make of that? 430 00:33:45,517 --> 00:33:47,206 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five, six. 431 00:33:49,448 --> 00:33:50,689 Good morning. 432 00:33:52,724 --> 00:33:54,275 -You know who's speaking, don't ya? 433 00:34:00,413 --> 00:34:02,862 -M3, M3 434 00:34:05,344 --> 00:34:07,137 -Nine, four, six -- 435 00:34:07,241 --> 00:34:10,965 Nine, four, six, two, six, five, six. 436 00:34:11,068 --> 00:34:13,448 -Uh... 437 00:34:14,413 --> 00:34:16,482 -Just one sec. -Hello? 438 00:34:16,586 --> 00:34:19,241 -Hello? 439 00:35:02,310 --> 00:35:05,068 -My father, you know, was a complete mess. 440 00:35:05,172 --> 00:35:07,517 Um... 441 00:35:12,448 --> 00:35:15,310 -One morning, he was rather depressed, 442 00:35:15,413 --> 00:35:16,965 so low, so low, 443 00:35:17,068 --> 00:35:20,965 just very depressing, had to get this over to him. 444 00:35:21,068 --> 00:35:25,965 I said, "Now, one must expect it to be published, 445 00:35:26,068 --> 00:35:28,758 and assume it will again. 446 00:35:28,862 --> 00:35:31,241 Can you sort of accept this?" 447 00:35:31,344 --> 00:35:33,827 And he -- he cried. He did. 448 00:35:33,931 --> 00:35:35,551 Eventually cried, so, to see a man cry, 449 00:35:35,655 --> 00:35:37,034 it's a terrible thing... 450 00:35:37,137 --> 00:35:38,724 A man of his stature. 451 00:35:38,827 --> 00:35:42,000 And in order to -- 452 00:35:42,103 --> 00:35:43,517 pretty sure he said, now, 453 00:35:43,620 --> 00:35:46,310 he didn't think so, but he couldn't accept this. 454 00:35:46,413 --> 00:35:49,241 He had to keep hoping, keep his hopes raised, 455 00:35:49,344 --> 00:35:50,931 and I said, well, hope for the best, 456 00:35:51,034 --> 00:35:54,413 but one must expect the worst. 457 00:36:33,724 --> 00:36:36,241 -Okay, I will -- 458 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:55,310 -For me, as a child, Arthur was a monster, 459 00:36:55,413 --> 00:36:57,344 and I don't like calling him dad 460 00:36:57,448 --> 00:37:01,241 because he never was a dad to me in my eyes. 461 00:37:02,827 --> 00:37:05,137 I can imagine he's -- he's, uh, 462 00:37:05,241 --> 00:37:09,862 capable of doing bad things. 463 00:37:09,965 --> 00:37:14,310 Yeah. I mean, seeing the way he was treating my mum... 464 00:37:22,827 --> 00:37:25,448 -Is that the M3? -Yeah, yes. 465 00:37:25,551 --> 00:37:29,275 Well, I'm -- I'm now on my way to a meeting. 466 00:37:29,379 --> 00:37:30,551 This is being handled by -- 467 00:37:30,655 --> 00:37:34,379 -That does sound like him. 468 00:37:34,482 --> 00:37:36,931 It does sound like him, like Arthur. 469 00:37:37,034 --> 00:37:40,172 -You know this morning. 470 00:37:40,275 --> 00:37:44,206 And, uh... -Just don't know what to say. 471 00:37:44,310 --> 00:37:46,793 -My part, the instructions I gave you, 472 00:37:46,896 --> 00:37:49,034 they were all carried out fully. 473 00:37:49,137 --> 00:37:51,310 -That's Arthur. 474 00:37:51,413 --> 00:37:53,241 That's Arthur. 475 00:37:53,344 --> 00:37:56,068 'Cause he always used to -- 476 00:37:56,172 --> 00:37:59,448 to talk and catch breath -- 477 00:38:01,413 --> 00:38:04,965 Yeah. As a kid, I still remember this. 478 00:38:07,517 --> 00:38:09,413 -I went to Arthur's home, 479 00:38:09,517 --> 00:38:13,482 met his wife and met the children. 480 00:38:13,586 --> 00:38:16,931 He had done fairly well as a tailor. 481 00:38:17,034 --> 00:38:19,551 He got a decent house near Bishop's Stortford 482 00:38:19,655 --> 00:38:22,517 in south Hertfordshire, had a wife and children. 483 00:38:22,620 --> 00:38:24,827 He seemed to be managing as a tailor, 484 00:38:24,931 --> 00:38:28,517 and he felt he could now be a kind of English squire. 485 00:38:46,172 --> 00:38:48,758 -It's a very rare ambition, right? 486 00:38:48,862 --> 00:38:53,758 We don't have many Black -- Black farmers in Britain. 487 00:38:55,689 --> 00:39:00,172 The ambition that Arthur had to join the local hunt 488 00:39:00,275 --> 00:39:04,344 showed that he had the very poor understanding of Britain. 489 00:39:04,448 --> 00:39:08,448 He -- he was, you know, massively naive to think 490 00:39:08,551 --> 00:39:12,517 that he had a place amongst those people. 491 00:39:16,517 --> 00:39:20,275 -In the past six days, police have had only one positive lead: 492 00:39:20,379 --> 00:39:21,620 the letter posted from North London 493 00:39:21,724 --> 00:39:23,862 at 6:45 last Tuesday evening, 494 00:39:23,965 --> 00:39:28,862 which arrived here at the family house on Wednesday morning. 495 00:39:28,965 --> 00:39:32,827 -I remember being taken to give a television interview. 496 00:39:32,931 --> 00:39:36,137 Please just let my mother come back. 497 00:39:38,379 --> 00:39:41,310 And she heard that, because she wrote that letter 498 00:39:41,413 --> 00:39:44,482 and she said, "I heard you on the television." 499 00:39:44,586 --> 00:39:48,344 Sick, isn't it? Really sick. 500 00:39:48,448 --> 00:39:50,034 "Darling, Alick, 501 00:39:50,137 --> 00:39:52,379 I'm deteriorating in health and spirit. 502 00:39:52,482 --> 00:39:55,379 Please cooperate. 503 00:39:55,482 --> 00:39:58,034 I'm blindfolded and cold." 504 00:39:58,137 --> 00:40:02,827 The earlier you get the money, the quicker I may come home." 505 00:40:02,931 --> 00:40:05,103 It was so horrible to receive those letters, 506 00:40:05,206 --> 00:40:07,620 where your mother's saying, "It's so cold, 507 00:40:07,724 --> 00:40:09,344 please tell Daddy to cooperate, the M--" 508 00:40:09,448 --> 00:40:12,551 Oh, it's so horrible. It was so painful. 509 00:40:16,896 --> 00:40:20,310 -All the letters, I think, were written at one stage, 510 00:40:20,413 --> 00:40:21,896 and they're all written about the same time 511 00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:23,517 because one letter came telling us 512 00:40:23,620 --> 00:40:24,862 to keep the police out of this. 513 00:40:24,965 --> 00:40:26,965 And you'll know who these people are 514 00:40:27,068 --> 00:40:29,793 because they'll use the term "M3." 515 00:40:29,896 --> 00:40:33,000 Now, we'd been using the bloody term M3 for weeks! 516 00:40:33,103 --> 00:40:34,965 She wouldn't have sent that. 517 00:40:35,068 --> 00:40:37,896 I mean, that was obviously one of the first ones 518 00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:39,862 we should have said, "Well, they sent them 519 00:40:39,965 --> 00:40:42,241 out of order." 520 00:40:49,620 --> 00:40:52,551 -There is the point when something occurred, 521 00:40:52,655 --> 00:40:58,103 which seemed to be very much a milestone. 522 00:40:58,206 --> 00:41:01,206 My memory says it was around the middle of the day, 523 00:41:01,310 --> 00:41:03,965 at lunchtime, 524 00:41:04,068 --> 00:41:07,172 and a call came through, 525 00:41:07,275 --> 00:41:12,689 and it was a woman's shrieking hysterically, 526 00:41:12,793 --> 00:41:15,448 saying, "She's dead, she's dead! 527 00:41:15,551 --> 00:41:17,827 Mrs. McKay is dead." 528 00:41:17,931 --> 00:41:21,241 And there was noise in the background. 529 00:41:21,344 --> 00:41:23,551 It was as though it was Sunday lunchtime 530 00:41:23,655 --> 00:41:25,448 and there were people in the pub, you know? 531 00:41:25,551 --> 00:41:27,137 And there was a telephone on the wall, 532 00:41:27,241 --> 00:41:29,793 which is what happened in those days. 533 00:41:29,896 --> 00:41:32,551 It sounded as though somebody really had to 534 00:41:32,655 --> 00:41:34,448 say something to get it off their chest, 535 00:41:34,551 --> 00:41:36,379 and it was just terrible. 536 00:41:36,482 --> 00:41:38,241 I don't know who it was, 537 00:41:38,344 --> 00:41:42,172 but we fancied that it was perhaps the girlfriend 538 00:41:42,275 --> 00:41:45,793 and perhaps somebody who was associated. 539 00:41:45,896 --> 00:41:49,482 And we really believed that she had died at that time. 540 00:41:52,551 --> 00:41:54,379 Sorry, it's hard to talk about. 541 00:42:03,862 --> 00:42:06,379 -This M3, did you receive the letter? 542 00:42:06,482 --> 00:42:08,758 -Yes, we have. Yesterday morning, first thing, 543 00:42:08,862 --> 00:42:10,172 but there's no proof in the letter 544 00:42:10,275 --> 00:42:11,931 that she is alive and well. 545 00:42:12,034 --> 00:42:13,551 There's noth-- 546 00:42:17,724 --> 00:42:19,655 -Well, look, quite frankly, this letter could have been 547 00:42:19,758 --> 00:42:21,275 written weeks ago -- we want to know she's alive. 548 00:42:21,379 --> 00:42:22,620 We've got the money -- 549 00:42:22,724 --> 00:42:23,827 Well, why the hell should we give you money 550 00:42:23,931 --> 00:42:25,620 unless we know she's alive? 551 00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:30,137 -Yes, of course we recognized her writing, but -- 552 00:42:30,241 --> 00:42:31,379 but we don't know, she might have written that 553 00:42:31,482 --> 00:42:33,310 three weeks ago; she might be dead now. 554 00:42:33,413 --> 00:42:35,172 We don't know -- where was nothing to say that -- 555 00:42:35,275 --> 00:42:38,586 that gave us any indication that she's still alive. 556 00:42:38,689 --> 00:42:40,172 That could have been written weeks ago, 557 00:42:40,275 --> 00:42:42,448 and you may have killed her, we don't know. 558 00:42:42,551 --> 00:42:44,379 We can't part with a lot of money -- 559 00:42:58,793 --> 00:43:03,931 -There was a lot of play acting on these telephone calls, 560 00:43:04,034 --> 00:43:06,310 but this was very necessary, we were out to -- 561 00:43:06,413 --> 00:43:09,103 to catch these -- these people. 562 00:43:31,551 --> 00:43:33,931 -They're slightly weird, those calls, aren't they? 563 00:43:34,034 --> 00:43:36,655 He had been coached, if you like, 564 00:43:36,758 --> 00:43:39,103 by the police to do it in a certain way. 565 00:43:39,206 --> 00:43:42,413 And it -- and that was what he was... 566 00:43:42,517 --> 00:43:44,482 He was supposed to get angry with them, I think, 567 00:43:44,586 --> 00:43:48,448 and it -- I don't think it necessarily worked very well. 568 00:43:48,551 --> 00:43:50,827 -Well, the reason for repeating myself was that we believe 569 00:43:50,931 --> 00:43:54,551 that M3 was using a script, and we were using a script, 570 00:43:54,655 --> 00:43:57,620 and both of us were trying to keep to our script. 571 00:43:57,724 --> 00:44:01,275 And therefore, I was trying to get some points over, 572 00:44:01,379 --> 00:44:03,103 and this point I was trying to get over, 573 00:44:03,206 --> 00:44:06,586 was always this point of proof -- we wanted proof. 574 00:44:06,689 --> 00:44:08,172 Obviously, if you're going to leave a large amount 575 00:44:08,275 --> 00:44:10,413 of ransom money, you must have proof. 576 00:44:10,517 --> 00:44:12,931 And it was important that we kept up this... 577 00:44:13,034 --> 00:44:15,379 this willingness to pay, and that we shouldn't be 578 00:44:15,482 --> 00:44:19,000 too willing to pay or we might possibly lose them. 579 00:44:59,344 --> 00:45:04,344 -The kidnapers asked that Ian McKay delivered the ransom. 580 00:45:04,448 --> 00:45:06,793 But rather than put him in danger, 581 00:45:06,896 --> 00:45:08,551 senior investigating officer told me 582 00:45:08,655 --> 00:45:11,275 that I was to be Ian McKay 583 00:45:11,379 --> 00:45:14,172 and to go off in the Rolls-Royce 584 00:45:14,275 --> 00:45:17,172 with a suitcase purporting to contain 585 00:45:17,275 --> 00:45:19,896 £1 million in used £5 notes. 586 00:45:22,655 --> 00:45:26,586 -They asked for £5 and 10 notes. 587 00:45:26,689 --> 00:45:28,689 What they didn't realize was 588 00:45:28,793 --> 00:45:31,206 you couldn't have a million pounds 589 00:45:31,310 --> 00:45:34,689 in two suitcases, for instance. 590 00:45:34,793 --> 00:45:39,310 The weight was enormous. 591 00:45:39,413 --> 00:45:43,724 -They told us that we were to go to particular telephone boxes 592 00:45:43,827 --> 00:45:45,724 and wait for the phone to ring, 593 00:45:45,827 --> 00:45:48,965 and then tell us to go to another telephone box 594 00:45:49,068 --> 00:45:53,344 where there would be a message. 595 00:45:53,448 --> 00:45:56,551 A government laboratory specifically made 596 00:45:56,655 --> 00:46:00,793 a tracking device to put on the case with the money 597 00:46:00,896 --> 00:46:02,758 and on the car. 598 00:46:02,862 --> 00:46:05,275 Never worked. 599 00:46:05,379 --> 00:46:09,275 It never worked -- the thing was absolutely useless. 600 00:46:09,379 --> 00:46:12,862 -The contact I had told me that it's one of the biggest farces 601 00:46:12,965 --> 00:46:15,758 that he'd heard of -- they were being followed 602 00:46:15,862 --> 00:46:19,586 by something like 63 different cars. 603 00:46:19,689 --> 00:46:23,620 They're also being pursued by three Hells Angels on motorbikes 604 00:46:23,724 --> 00:46:26,620 who are actually policemen pretending to be Hells Angels. 605 00:46:26,724 --> 00:46:30,517 -The note that we found in one of the telephone kiosks 606 00:46:30,620 --> 00:46:33,586 told us to go to a very rural location 607 00:46:33,689 --> 00:46:36,689 where there would be some white flowers on a bank 608 00:46:36,793 --> 00:46:40,137 where we were to put the money and go. 609 00:46:44,344 --> 00:46:45,793 Which we did. 610 00:46:54,206 --> 00:46:58,275 But it wasn't sophisticated. 611 00:47:07,482 --> 00:47:12,172 The money was dropped and, um... 612 00:47:12,275 --> 00:47:13,724 nobody approached, 613 00:47:13,827 --> 00:47:18,827 nobody came across land, nobody went past in a vehicle. 614 00:47:21,034 --> 00:47:25,379 The money was there for hours. 615 00:47:25,482 --> 00:47:28,413 Well, we were all very disappointed. 616 00:47:30,689 --> 00:47:37,034 -And I can remember standing in the windows upstairs, 617 00:47:37,137 --> 00:47:41,068 waiting to see, um... 618 00:47:41,172 --> 00:47:43,620 Rupert Murdoch's car come back 619 00:47:43,724 --> 00:47:46,482 with Bill Smith in it, 620 00:47:46,586 --> 00:47:49,724 and wondering who else was in it. 621 00:47:49,827 --> 00:47:53,103 -And we'd all be hopeful, and we'd be at home thinking, 622 00:47:53,206 --> 00:47:55,206 "Oh, my God, this is the one, this is the one," you know? 623 00:47:55,310 --> 00:47:57,206 You can imagine pinning all your -- 624 00:47:57,310 --> 00:48:03,137 pin all your emotional hopes on that one evening, 625 00:48:03,241 --> 00:48:05,034 and came to nothing -- nothing. 626 00:48:19,413 --> 00:48:21,137 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five six. 627 00:49:49,896 --> 00:49:53,586 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five, six. 628 00:49:53,689 --> 00:49:55,344 -Hello. -Hello. 629 00:49:58,965 --> 00:50:00,896 -Yeah? -Yeah. 630 00:50:35,034 --> 00:50:38,551 -she wasn't allowed to go. 631 00:50:38,655 --> 00:50:42,310 And so I said, well, if you won't let her go, I'll go. 632 00:50:42,413 --> 00:50:46,827 "No, no, no, you can't go, and it's got to be a policeman." 633 00:50:51,620 --> 00:50:55,965 -The apparel included a pair of ladies boots, 634 00:50:56,068 --> 00:50:59,482 high length, knee length boots. 635 00:50:59,586 --> 00:51:03,586 I won -- won the job, 636 00:51:03,689 --> 00:51:05,586 because I was the only one who could get my feet 637 00:51:05,689 --> 00:51:07,275 into the boots. 638 00:51:12,827 --> 00:51:18,413 -And I can clearly remember my sister and I in the kitchen, 639 00:51:18,517 --> 00:51:21,310 sitting perched on stools with makeup 640 00:51:21,413 --> 00:51:24,310 and a towel around his neck trying to make him -- 641 00:51:24,413 --> 00:51:26,931 and I'm, you know, regardless of how tragic 642 00:51:27,034 --> 00:51:30,000 and how terrible the whole thing is, 643 00:51:30,103 --> 00:51:32,517 we were laughing -- it was --it was -- it was -- 644 00:51:32,620 --> 00:51:36,206 it was a moment of clowning, you know? 645 00:51:43,862 --> 00:51:45,758 -It was hilarious, I have to say. 646 00:51:45,862 --> 00:51:47,655 I mean, I feel guilty about the laughter, 647 00:51:47,758 --> 00:51:49,586 but it was hilarious. 648 00:51:49,689 --> 00:51:52,068 And of course, he didn't, in the end -- 649 00:51:52,172 --> 00:51:55,896 they sent a police woman. 650 00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:59,448 -I had a coat, because my mother would recognize that coat. 651 00:51:59,551 --> 00:52:01,758 And it was a sort of pink mohair coat. 652 00:52:01,862 --> 00:52:03,344 And I mean, I thought, 653 00:52:03,448 --> 00:52:06,206 well, she'll realize that we're trying to help her. 654 00:53:24,551 --> 00:53:26,413 -This only happens in England. 655 00:53:26,517 --> 00:53:28,448 They put the suitcases there, 656 00:53:28,551 --> 00:53:31,517 and the police all hidden round, 657 00:53:31,620 --> 00:53:36,034 and then a local well-wisher saw the two suitcases -- 658 00:53:36,137 --> 00:53:38,586 a local resident -- said, "Oh, gosh, 659 00:53:38,689 --> 00:53:41,344 this is a time when bombs go off and so forth -- 660 00:53:41,448 --> 00:53:43,517 I better get the local police in," 661 00:53:43,620 --> 00:53:46,620 and our police force hiding all round the place 662 00:53:46,724 --> 00:53:48,758 threw up their hands in despair 663 00:53:48,862 --> 00:53:51,551 that their best laid plans went awry. 664 00:53:51,655 --> 00:53:57,344 But they did capture the registration of the Volvo 665 00:53:57,448 --> 00:54:00,620 because it was going round and round, 666 00:54:00,724 --> 00:54:03,758 and that led them to Arthur and his farm. 667 00:54:03,862 --> 00:54:06,827 That's the only thing that led them to Arthur and his farm, 668 00:54:06,931 --> 00:54:11,620 despite four weeks of efforts of trying to find the truth. 669 00:54:36,241 --> 00:54:38,448 -There's now little doubt that the police, 670 00:54:38,551 --> 00:54:41,379 after weeks of frustration in their search for Mrs. McKay, 671 00:54:41,482 --> 00:54:43,724 are searching in the right place. 672 00:54:43,827 --> 00:54:48,655 Rooks End farm at . 673 00:54:48,758 --> 00:54:50,137 -Sleepy hollow was woken up 674 00:54:50,241 --> 00:54:51,965 early on this bitterly cold morning 675 00:54:52,068 --> 00:54:54,586 by a full scale police invasion. 676 00:55:37,137 --> 00:55:41,793 -I had a phone call to say, "Is that your mum's farm?" 677 00:55:44,413 --> 00:55:48,103 And, um, sure enough, I rang her and it was. 678 00:55:53,482 --> 00:55:54,931 -At first light this morning, 679 00:55:55,034 --> 00:55:57,793 120 policemen from this special mobile unit 680 00:55:57,896 --> 00:56:02,034 begin an inch by inch search of the property. 681 00:56:02,137 --> 00:56:04,586 -First of all, she thought it was all a big mistake, 682 00:56:04,689 --> 00:56:06,965 absolutely massive mistake. 683 00:56:07,068 --> 00:56:11,103 -Then firemen began draining three ponds and a well. 684 00:56:11,206 --> 00:56:13,482 -And obviously, mum was just beside herself. 685 00:56:13,586 --> 00:56:16,862 She didn't really know what was going on. 686 00:56:16,965 --> 00:56:21,517 Mum went to Germany for Christmas with the children. 687 00:56:21,620 --> 00:56:24,793 She came back in January, 688 00:56:24,896 --> 00:56:28,827 and that's when everything happened. 689 00:56:28,931 --> 00:56:31,241 -More than 100 men from the Metropolitan Police 690 00:56:31,344 --> 00:56:33,448 special squads and the Essex Constabulary 691 00:56:33,551 --> 00:56:36,379 were soon at work searching the 3.5-acre... 692 00:56:36,482 --> 00:56:40,448 -...and tomorrow, more than 100 policemen will be drafted in 693 00:56:40,551 --> 00:56:44,000 to begin an even more intense search of the farm buildings 694 00:56:44,103 --> 00:56:46,758 and surrounding fields. 695 00:56:46,862 --> 00:56:48,965 -We've had reports there are fingerprints found 696 00:56:49,068 --> 00:56:51,413 in the farmhouse, which you've connected to Mrs. McKay. 697 00:56:51,517 --> 00:56:53,206 Is there anything in this, detective? 698 00:56:53,310 --> 00:56:55,724 -No, I'm not able to comment on this. 699 00:56:55,827 --> 00:56:58,310 -There was a report too that a shallow grave had been found. 700 00:56:58,413 --> 00:56:59,655 Can you comment on that? 701 00:56:59,758 --> 00:57:01,379 -No shallow grave has been found. 702 00:57:01,482 --> 00:57:04,758 -Do the police still feel that Mrs. McKay is still alive? 703 00:57:04,862 --> 00:57:06,586 -Well, we're hoping so, yeah. 704 00:57:06,689 --> 00:57:08,172 -Have you any evidence that suggests she -- 705 00:57:08,275 --> 00:57:11,827 -We have no evidence otherwise, no evidence at all. 706 00:57:16,241 --> 00:57:18,862 -I was in my room and I stayed upstairs 707 00:57:18,965 --> 00:57:20,655 because I was a bit frightened. 708 00:57:20,758 --> 00:57:22,241 There were so many. 709 00:57:22,344 --> 00:57:25,413 Taking fingerprints everywhere. 710 00:57:30,896 --> 00:57:33,517 All I remember is mum running around, 711 00:57:33,620 --> 00:57:36,620 hosting all the people. 712 00:57:36,724 --> 00:57:40,482 But I cannot remember seeing Arthur or Nizam. 713 00:57:44,724 --> 00:57:48,241 -They arrived here about a quarter to seven this evening. 714 00:57:48,344 --> 00:57:51,482 In the first car, the elder brother was 715 00:57:51,586 --> 00:57:55,758 crouched on the floor of the back seat. 716 00:57:55,862 --> 00:57:59,103 And in the second car, the younger Hosein was sitting 717 00:57:59,206 --> 00:58:01,206 between two detectives in the back seat 718 00:58:01,310 --> 00:58:03,172 with a coat over his head. 719 00:58:06,655 --> 00:58:08,620 -I think what surprised us 720 00:58:08,724 --> 00:58:12,000 when we saw the brothers and spoke to them, 721 00:58:12,103 --> 00:58:14,344 they were unusual. 722 00:58:16,206 --> 00:58:19,275 It became evident that they were not -- 723 00:58:19,379 --> 00:58:23,448 certainly not -- professional criminals. 724 00:58:23,551 --> 00:58:25,241 -The two men have stayed here 725 00:58:25,344 --> 00:58:28,379 at Kingston police headquarters since 6:30 yesterday evening, 726 00:58:28,482 --> 00:58:30,241 according to the police, 727 00:58:30,344 --> 00:58:31,586 and their questioning has been surrounded 728 00:58:31,689 --> 00:58:34,068 by an aura of unusual secrecy. 729 00:58:34,172 --> 00:58:36,551 So far, I understand those inquiries have not been 730 00:58:36,655 --> 00:58:38,724 very productive, and apart from giving their names 731 00:58:38,827 --> 00:58:41,172 and some personal background details, 732 00:58:41,275 --> 00:58:44,689 the two men have not been able to help very much. 733 00:59:00,793 --> 00:59:03,517 -Well, Bill Smith did the interrogation himself 734 00:59:03,620 --> 00:59:06,344 with Joe Minus. 735 00:59:06,448 --> 00:59:12,000 It's totally... 736 00:59:12,103 --> 00:59:14,551 Unimaginable. 737 00:59:15,379 --> 00:59:18,310 I wouldn't give it any credence whatsoever. 738 00:59:20,931 --> 00:59:24,241 -I used to say, "Let me get to them," when they had them. 739 00:59:24,344 --> 00:59:26,206 "I'll make them tell where my mother is." 740 00:59:26,310 --> 00:59:28,206 "Oh, we do everything," they'd say, "we do everything, 741 00:59:28,310 --> 00:59:33,034 but nothing that shows." 742 00:59:33,137 --> 00:59:35,931 That's what the police would say, Smith and Minus. 743 00:59:36,034 --> 00:59:38,724 -What did they say? 744 00:59:38,827 --> 00:59:41,931 -"We do," otherwise they were saying, "Yes, we torture them, 745 00:59:42,034 --> 00:59:45,793 but mustn't show." 746 00:59:45,896 --> 00:59:47,482 "Get them by the balls," I said, 747 00:59:47,586 --> 00:59:49,137 "You let -- I'll do it." 748 00:59:49,241 --> 00:59:50,965 I mean, I really said that to them! 749 00:59:51,068 --> 00:59:54,655 And they would say, "We do; we we've done everything, 750 00:59:54,758 --> 00:59:56,758 but they won't speak." 751 01:00:33,586 --> 01:00:35,965 -I spent a lot of time with the brothers. 752 01:00:36,068 --> 01:00:40,413 I took them back and forth to court from Brixton Prison, 753 01:00:40,517 --> 01:00:42,896 more than probably anybody else. 754 01:00:46,310 --> 01:00:49,275 The van stopped in -- in the yard 755 01:00:49,379 --> 01:00:50,724 at Brixton Prison. 756 01:00:54,620 --> 01:00:58,586 The only time I'd seen any of them snap. 757 01:00:58,689 --> 01:01:02,862 And Nizam went for me and Arthur. 758 01:01:05,931 --> 01:01:11,758 I think Nizamodeen was against Arthur as much as anything else. 759 01:01:43,310 --> 01:01:45,068 -The two men were charged after being in company 760 01:01:45,172 --> 01:01:46,827 with the police and Kingston police headquarters 761 01:01:46,931 --> 01:01:48,724 for about 72 hours. 762 01:01:48,827 --> 01:01:51,862 Charge was that, between the 29th of December 763 01:01:51,965 --> 01:01:53,310 and the 6th of January, 764 01:01:53,413 --> 01:01:55,689 they murdered Mrs. Muriel McKay, 765 01:01:55,793 --> 01:01:57,551 and further charged 766 01:01:57,655 --> 01:02:02,758 that they demanded by menaces £1 million from Mr. Alick McKay 767 01:02:02,862 --> 01:02:06,586 for the return of his wife. 768 01:02:06,689 --> 01:02:08,172 -The common view in the community, 769 01:02:08,275 --> 01:02:10,241 as I knew it, was, 770 01:02:10,344 --> 01:02:13,206 people thought it was -- it was utterly incredible, 771 01:02:13,310 --> 01:02:17,482 and that it was more than likely that other people, 772 01:02:17,586 --> 01:02:20,862 white seasoned criminals, might have been involved, 773 01:02:20,965 --> 01:02:23,862 and those two were taking the rap for that. 774 01:02:23,965 --> 01:02:27,655 So it seemed to me such a kamikaze thing. 775 01:02:27,758 --> 01:02:30,758 And the idea that you could pull off something -- 776 01:02:30,862 --> 01:02:33,724 a heist as massive as that -- 777 01:02:33,827 --> 01:02:37,275 seemed to us to be totally airy-fairy, really. 778 01:02:37,379 --> 01:02:39,689 -When the brothers were arrested, 779 01:02:39,793 --> 01:02:42,310 a lot of thinking was, 780 01:02:42,413 --> 01:02:44,620 "Well, they must be more than them." 781 01:02:44,724 --> 01:02:48,517 And they were members of the family living in London -- 782 01:02:48,620 --> 01:02:50,862 of the Hosein brothers. 783 01:02:50,965 --> 01:02:52,827 One of them was a brother 784 01:02:52,931 --> 01:02:56,655 who was really investigated 785 01:02:56,758 --> 01:02:59,448 for some time. 786 01:02:59,551 --> 01:03:03,000 Adam Hosein. 787 01:03:03,103 --> 01:03:06,724 But, um, his alibi stood up. 788 01:03:10,931 --> 01:03:13,551 -I went down there, 789 01:03:13,655 --> 01:03:16,413 it was really a very extraordinary meeting, 790 01:03:16,517 --> 01:03:18,551 extraordinary situation, 791 01:03:18,655 --> 01:03:22,689 because the police could get nothing out of the two men, 792 01:03:22,793 --> 01:03:24,379 and Smith said to me, 793 01:03:24,482 --> 01:03:28,862 it's as if they pulled shutters down on their mind. 794 01:03:28,965 --> 01:03:33,103 And I decided to act for the younger brother, Nizamodeen. 795 01:03:37,586 --> 01:03:43,344 -Mum said that she looked even where police hadn't looked. 796 01:03:43,448 --> 01:03:45,551 She was looking. 797 01:03:45,655 --> 01:03:48,758 Hollow tree underneath the dog's bed, 798 01:03:48,862 --> 01:03:52,758 but there was nothing, nothing at all that gave her any inkling 799 01:03:52,862 --> 01:03:55,655 that they had actually killed her. 800 01:03:58,172 --> 01:04:03,034 -100 police officers searched and searched and found nothing. 801 01:04:03,137 --> 01:04:06,137 Mrs. McKay could not be found. 802 01:04:08,586 --> 01:04:13,413 -I had just read a trashy American whodunit 803 01:04:13,517 --> 01:04:20,310 in which the murder victim was fed to the pigs. 804 01:04:20,413 --> 01:04:22,551 So I said to one of the policemen there 805 01:04:22,655 --> 01:04:24,655 about this story, et cetera. 806 01:04:24,758 --> 01:04:28,482 So the next day and there were people sifting with sticks, 807 01:04:28,586 --> 01:04:31,586 whatever, through the pile of slurry. 808 01:04:31,689 --> 01:04:34,275 And, "Had she been fed to the pigs?" started. 809 01:04:34,379 --> 01:04:37,689 And just a throwaway remark for me 810 01:04:37,793 --> 01:04:40,137 has sort of went down in history. 811 01:04:46,068 --> 01:04:49,275 -What happened with the body, we don't know. 812 01:04:51,379 --> 01:04:54,103 -M3... M3. 813 01:04:54,206 --> 01:04:55,931 -This is M3 speaking again. 814 01:04:56,034 --> 01:04:59,896 -This is the M3, we've contacted you last week. 815 01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:01,689 -Hey, who am I talking to? 816 01:05:01,793 --> 01:05:05,620 -I wanted to get to the truth; I wanted to hear the tapes, 817 01:05:05,724 --> 01:05:09,586 and they were happy to play the tapes to me. 818 01:05:09,689 --> 01:05:12,103 I'm just trying to find the truth. 819 01:05:12,206 --> 01:05:13,931 -Nine, four, six, two, six, five, six? 820 01:05:46,793 --> 01:05:51,448 -You are aware, as a popular newspaper editor and journalist, 821 01:05:51,551 --> 01:05:56,793 of what the audience thinks and wants, and its prejudices. 822 01:05:56,896 --> 01:06:00,379 You play to them, but not always consciously, 823 01:06:00,482 --> 01:06:02,965 very often unconsciously. 824 01:06:03,068 --> 01:06:07,172 Their views are your views. 825 01:06:10,793 --> 01:06:14,896 You would know that the fact that two Caribbean men 826 01:06:15,000 --> 01:06:17,172 have been responsible for kidnapping and murdering 827 01:06:17,275 --> 01:06:18,758 a white woman -- 828 01:06:18,862 --> 01:06:21,310 you'd know exactly 829 01:06:21,413 --> 01:06:26,068 the likely response from your audience. 830 01:06:26,172 --> 01:06:29,379 -It was so un-British. 831 01:06:29,482 --> 01:06:32,310 Did they come into the country to do this? 832 01:06:34,482 --> 01:06:36,172 -The judiciary also thought it was 833 01:06:36,275 --> 01:06:37,862 an un-British kind of crime, 834 01:06:37,965 --> 01:06:41,793 and certainly the prosecution made a lot of that too. 835 01:06:41,896 --> 01:06:46,206 The great deal was going to depend really on 836 01:06:46,310 --> 01:06:49,517 the extent to which matters were put to the jury 837 01:06:49,620 --> 01:06:52,137 that it was an unusual crime, 838 01:06:52,241 --> 01:06:56,310 as foreign as the people who committed the crime. 839 01:07:10,034 --> 01:07:14,068 -I've never been in a court before in my life. 840 01:07:14,172 --> 01:07:18,344 Nobody said, "This is what it's going to be like." 841 01:07:18,448 --> 01:07:23,827 So you're suddenly standing in this daunting place. 842 01:07:27,068 --> 01:07:28,206 You feel quite overwhelmed. 843 01:07:28,310 --> 01:07:29,931 I just burst into tears. 844 01:07:30,034 --> 01:07:35,137 And I could see the two Hosein brothers there. 845 01:07:35,241 --> 01:07:36,206 They were there. 846 01:07:40,655 --> 01:07:44,724 And that is really horrific moment, really horrific. 847 01:07:47,068 --> 01:07:49,310 The elder brother, Arthur Hosein, 848 01:07:49,413 --> 01:07:52,965 he had specially tailored a suit to wear 849 01:07:53,068 --> 01:07:55,413 to conduct his own defense, 850 01:07:55,517 --> 01:07:57,137 and the young one, 851 01:07:57,241 --> 01:07:58,758 all I could do was look at the young one, 852 01:07:58,862 --> 01:08:01,034 and just think, "You are the evil." 853 01:08:01,137 --> 01:08:02,620 He, to me, he was the evil. 854 01:08:02,724 --> 01:08:05,310 The other one was mad, 855 01:08:05,413 --> 01:08:08,068 but he was evil. 856 01:08:08,172 --> 01:08:10,620 And I'd always felt that he was the one that killed my mother 857 01:08:10,724 --> 01:08:14,620 and dispose of her body, however -- however, he did that. 858 01:08:19,689 --> 01:08:22,000 -They plead not guilty. 859 01:08:22,103 --> 01:08:25,000 And so you have to respect that. 860 01:08:25,103 --> 01:08:27,551 Let the prosecution prove they're guilty. 861 01:08:27,655 --> 01:08:31,310 That's the pattern of our law: it's the prosecution's job. 862 01:08:33,655 --> 01:08:37,379 But he was very, very difficult to see, 863 01:08:37,482 --> 01:08:41,103 100 percent evidence as to guilt or not guilt. 864 01:08:46,275 --> 01:08:50,275 -Arthur's fingerprints was found at the House. 865 01:08:52,379 --> 01:08:56,241 The bill hook, his neighbor found it missing from his farm 866 01:08:56,344 --> 01:08:59,448 and then identified it. 867 01:08:59,551 --> 01:09:03,103 The twine that every farmer uses -- 868 01:09:03,206 --> 01:09:06,827 there it was at the farm. 869 01:09:06,931 --> 01:09:12,620 But of course, search went on for weeks at the farm. 870 01:09:12,724 --> 01:09:16,034 We didn't have the benefit of what we've got now. 871 01:09:16,137 --> 01:09:19,827 No DNA; purely on fingerprints. 872 01:09:21,620 --> 01:09:26,103 There was no sign of her at the farm, never has been. 873 01:09:26,206 --> 01:09:29,931 It was a case of, "prove your case." 874 01:09:30,034 --> 01:09:33,896 There was nothing other than the forensic 875 01:09:34,000 --> 01:09:36,172 to prove it. 876 01:09:36,275 --> 01:09:39,310 -The body of evidence that went to the court 877 01:09:39,413 --> 01:09:42,413 and that the prosecution put to the jury 878 01:09:42,517 --> 01:09:46,379 was substantial but inconclusive. 879 01:09:46,482 --> 01:09:50,379 My recollection within the Black community 880 01:09:50,482 --> 01:09:56,379 was that they were unable to say categorically 881 01:09:56,482 --> 01:09:58,068 that those two men 882 01:09:58,172 --> 01:10:02,206 had actually murdered Muriel McKay, 883 01:10:02,310 --> 01:10:04,068 because they had no evidence. 884 01:10:07,344 --> 01:10:12,620 -And then... 885 01:10:12,724 --> 01:10:17,068 Nizamodeen, at the Old Bailey, 886 01:10:17,172 --> 01:10:19,241 made certain admissions. 887 01:10:21,655 --> 01:10:27,310 Nizamodeen admitted getting the details of the Rolls-Royce 888 01:10:27,413 --> 01:10:31,172 that belonged to Rupert Murdoch. 889 01:10:31,275 --> 01:10:33,758 By admitting that, 890 01:10:33,862 --> 01:10:38,620 he'd then involved Arthur. 891 01:10:58,413 --> 01:11:00,517 -He then admitted 892 01:11:00,620 --> 01:11:05,758 his fingerprints were on the paper flowers 893 01:11:05,862 --> 01:11:09,586 put down for the drop; 894 01:11:09,689 --> 01:11:13,758 said that he'd done that because Arthur had told him to do that. 895 01:11:13,862 --> 01:11:16,344 So Nizam turned on Arthur. 896 01:11:18,896 --> 01:11:21,758 It was devastating for both of them. 897 01:11:24,862 --> 01:11:27,586 -Nizam was probably so frightened, 898 01:11:27,689 --> 01:11:30,793 he was so frightened that he probably admitted, 899 01:11:30,896 --> 01:11:33,586 when we spoke to him, and we all spoke to him, 900 01:11:33,689 --> 01:11:37,586 that he was prepared to admit certain things. 901 01:11:37,689 --> 01:11:40,172 He was aware of what he was doing. 902 01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:44,931 We wanted to show that he was pushed into something, 903 01:11:45,034 --> 01:11:47,206 dominated by somebody else. 904 01:11:47,310 --> 01:11:49,413 And so Nizam made some admissions -- 905 01:11:49,517 --> 01:11:52,724 when his brother couldn't reach him or get in touch with him. 906 01:11:55,137 --> 01:11:57,482 -It's a good defense, isn't it? 907 01:11:57,586 --> 01:11:59,206 He was a weak character, 908 01:11:59,310 --> 01:12:01,379 you could see that by looking at him. 909 01:12:01,482 --> 01:12:03,551 He was a weak character who would do anything 910 01:12:03,655 --> 01:12:06,275 the elder brother said -- that's what I felt. 911 01:12:35,586 --> 01:12:40,275 -I don't think even mum believed what was going on at the time. 912 01:12:40,379 --> 01:12:43,344 I don't think she believed that it was possible 913 01:12:43,448 --> 01:12:45,137 that he would do such a thing; 914 01:12:45,241 --> 01:12:47,344 if he'd done it, she didn't know, 915 01:12:47,448 --> 01:12:49,344 and she was backwards and forwards 916 01:12:49,448 --> 01:12:51,689 to London going into court. 917 01:12:51,793 --> 01:12:56,793 And she came back one day and she said to me, 918 01:12:56,896 --> 01:13:00,793 "What would you do if you found something?" 919 01:13:00,896 --> 01:13:03,586 And I said, "I don't know, Mum, what -- 920 01:13:03,689 --> 01:13:05,137 what have you found," you know, 921 01:13:05,241 --> 01:13:07,206 "Have you found something of any importance?" 922 01:13:07,310 --> 01:13:09,724 Said, "No, I just wondered what you would do?" 923 01:13:15,862 --> 01:13:18,965 There was a place where Arthur used to hide his money 924 01:13:19,068 --> 01:13:22,275 behind the bar, 925 01:13:22,379 --> 01:13:24,793 and there was an inset in the wall. 926 01:13:24,896 --> 01:13:29,137 -There must have been a box or something like that. 927 01:13:30,862 --> 01:13:33,551 And she looked in -- she looked in there... 928 01:13:33,655 --> 01:13:37,241 -And she thought, "Mm, has he left me any money?" 929 01:13:37,344 --> 01:13:40,896 And she had a look, and she pulled out some jewelry. 930 01:13:41,000 --> 01:13:44,172 -The police want anyone who's been offered for sale jewelry 931 01:13:44,275 --> 01:13:47,310 by men of Indian descent to come forward immediately 932 01:13:47,413 --> 01:13:50,379 and help them with the further inquiries in this case. 933 01:13:52,517 --> 01:13:57,137 -She said, "And I took her in to visit Arthur, 934 01:13:57,241 --> 01:14:00,620 and I said to him, 'You are guilty, 935 01:14:00,724 --> 01:14:04,000 because I've got something in my bag, 936 01:14:04,103 --> 01:14:07,689 and you know what it is, I found it behind the bar'," 937 01:14:07,793 --> 01:14:09,689 and she said to me, 938 01:14:09,793 --> 01:14:13,689 "That's the first time I've ever seen a Black person go white." 939 01:14:13,793 --> 01:14:18,551 And she said, "Arthur, you did do it. 940 01:14:18,655 --> 01:14:20,586 You were involved." 941 01:14:20,689 --> 01:14:24,448 -When mum found the jewels, 942 01:14:24,551 --> 01:14:26,379 she was scared because I did ask her, 943 01:14:26,482 --> 01:14:28,413 why didn't you give it to the police? 944 01:14:28,517 --> 01:14:30,241 'Cause she was scared. 945 01:14:30,344 --> 01:14:33,034 I don't know why. 946 01:14:33,137 --> 01:14:36,724 She phoned then Adam, my other uncle, 947 01:14:36,827 --> 01:14:40,068 and Adam said, 948 01:14:40,172 --> 01:14:43,724 "Right, we're going to the Thames and throw in the Thames." 949 01:14:43,827 --> 01:14:45,655 That's what mum told me. 950 01:14:51,689 --> 01:14:53,793 -Right, so your dad is terribly ill. 951 01:14:53,896 --> 01:14:56,517 He would not be able to comply with the instructions 952 01:14:56,620 --> 01:14:58,655 as so you'll do it in stride. 953 01:14:58,758 --> 01:15:01,241 -Instruction is for one person to be alone, 954 01:15:01,344 --> 01:15:02,793 one person to be alone now. 955 01:15:02,896 --> 01:15:04,862 All right? Now, uh... 956 01:15:04,965 --> 01:15:07,275 Your mum wrote a letter last night, 957 01:15:07,379 --> 01:15:09,103 posted it a few minutes ago. 958 01:15:09,206 --> 01:15:11,620 One is to your dad. 959 01:15:11,724 --> 01:15:13,482 Well, it's one of both. 960 01:15:13,586 --> 01:15:16,482 Other is to... 961 01:15:26,275 --> 01:15:29,379 -It was very sad that the judge 962 01:15:29,482 --> 01:15:33,000 wouldn't allow voice prints to be heard. 963 01:15:33,103 --> 01:15:35,655 I think that was a mistake. 964 01:15:35,758 --> 01:15:37,931 It may be law, but it's not justice. 965 01:15:38,034 --> 01:15:40,482 It's not getting to the bottom of what has happened 966 01:15:40,586 --> 01:15:42,137 and why it's happened. 967 01:15:42,241 --> 01:15:45,586 All of the evidence, all the relevant evidence, 968 01:15:45,689 --> 01:15:47,310 should be given, 969 01:15:47,413 --> 01:15:51,965 and the relevant evidence was not given here. 970 01:15:52,068 --> 01:15:54,137 -So we're having all the evidence -- 971 01:15:54,241 --> 01:15:55,724 handwriting, fingerprints -- 972 01:15:55,827 --> 01:15:57,931 reassessed by modern forensic experts. 973 01:15:58,034 --> 01:15:59,724 If we get you to repeat these recordings -- 974 01:15:59,827 --> 01:16:01,655 -Yeah. -Do you think that 975 01:16:01,758 --> 01:16:04,172 might help to clear your name? 976 01:16:34,758 --> 01:16:36,827 -"I am on my way to a meeting." 977 01:16:36,931 --> 01:16:40,068 -I am now on my way to a meeting. 978 01:16:45,344 --> 01:16:50,793 -Our business handled by intellectuals, the heads. 979 01:16:55,344 --> 01:16:59,103 Now is a meeting of the semi-intellectuals. 980 01:16:59,206 --> 01:17:02,172 -To be passed on to the third party, the ru-- 981 01:17:02,275 --> 01:17:05,551 the ruffians, we call them. 982 01:17:05,655 --> 01:17:08,413 -To be passed on to ruffians, we call them. 983 01:17:08,517 --> 01:17:10,586 -The mark on the cigarette packet 984 01:17:10,689 --> 01:17:12,137 is the same as a left thumb. 985 01:17:16,310 --> 01:17:19,068 The mark on the newspaper is the same as the left palm. 986 01:17:19,172 --> 01:17:23,689 -Whether she should be executed or at what time? 987 01:17:23,793 --> 01:17:27,896 -And the mark on the letter is the same as the left palm. 988 01:17:28,000 --> 01:17:30,517 The ridge detail on both the mark and the prints 989 01:17:30,620 --> 01:17:32,931 have been made by the same donor, 990 01:17:33,034 --> 01:17:36,965 namely Mr. Arthur Hosein, and by nobody else. 991 01:17:37,068 --> 01:17:40,551 -I'm reasonably sure that the GLC application, 992 01:17:40,655 --> 01:17:42,758 that Nizam wrote this. 993 01:17:42,862 --> 01:17:45,793 And he admitted writing it. 994 01:17:45,896 --> 01:17:47,413 But in general terms, 995 01:17:47,517 --> 01:17:50,586 the handwriting wasn't conclusive in either way. 996 01:17:50,689 --> 01:17:55,862 So this is the cigarette packet note. 997 01:17:55,965 --> 01:17:59,344 And I -- I've said that it's inconclusive, 998 01:17:59,448 --> 01:18:01,517 I can't tell one way or the other 999 01:18:01,620 --> 01:18:04,103 whether it was written by Arthur or not. 1000 01:18:04,206 --> 01:18:07,793 Equally, it could have been written by another person. 1001 01:18:07,896 --> 01:18:10,620 With the examples that I've seen, 1002 01:18:10,724 --> 01:18:13,896 I'm more inclined to agree with the defense's case. 1003 01:18:16,827 --> 01:18:20,000 -The data that we have indicate that we're dealing 1004 01:18:20,103 --> 01:18:22,103 with an older individual, 1005 01:18:22,206 --> 01:18:23,724 older than Nizam would have been 1006 01:18:23,827 --> 01:18:26,827 at the time that the ransom calls were made. 1007 01:18:26,931 --> 01:18:31,137 My strong feeling is that where we're dealing with 1008 01:18:31,241 --> 01:18:34,000 more than one speaker in the calls. 1009 01:18:34,103 --> 01:18:36,482 That means there are three individuals involved. 1010 01:18:36,586 --> 01:18:41,586 So there is, uh, one or more unknown individuals in the mix, 1011 01:18:41,689 --> 01:18:44,517 and therefore it's quite possible the outcome 1012 01:18:44,620 --> 01:18:46,965 of the trial of Nizam Hosein would have been different 1013 01:18:47,068 --> 01:18:50,448 if the jury had been able to listen to those recordings. 1014 01:18:50,551 --> 01:18:55,413 We'll never know. 1015 01:18:55,517 --> 01:18:58,172 -Found guilty on all charges, 1016 01:18:58,275 --> 01:19:00,620 Arthur was sentenced to life imprisonment 1017 01:19:00,724 --> 01:19:05,206 plus 25 years, plus 14 years for blackmail, 1018 01:19:05,310 --> 01:19:08,448 plus 10 years for sending threatening letters. 1019 01:19:08,551 --> 01:19:10,965 Nizam got the same, except for 10 years less 1020 01:19:11,068 --> 01:19:12,758 on the kidnapping charge. 1021 01:19:12,862 --> 01:19:14,586 Inspector Smith and his team 1022 01:19:14,689 --> 01:19:18,068 were delighted at their success in this extraordinary case. 1023 01:19:29,793 --> 01:19:33,310 -It's not a triumph, it's a relief. 1024 01:19:33,413 --> 01:19:35,896 But it's not... 1025 01:19:36,000 --> 01:19:37,517 It's not success, 1026 01:19:37,620 --> 01:19:41,620 because you haven't brought my mother back alive. 1027 01:19:44,482 --> 01:19:50,551 -Alick made a comment at the Old Bailey after the trial 1028 01:19:50,655 --> 01:19:52,620 that, "I just want to know where she is 1029 01:19:52,724 --> 01:19:55,344 so I can put flowers where she is." 1030 01:19:58,172 --> 01:20:00,379 If they did kill her, 1031 01:20:00,482 --> 01:20:03,551 then of course, they were -- they were evil. 1032 01:20:03,655 --> 01:20:06,758 But... 1033 01:20:06,862 --> 01:20:08,517 I don't know. 1034 01:20:12,448 --> 01:20:16,310 I don't know if Nizamodeen knows where the body is. 1035 01:20:19,724 --> 01:20:21,931 Did Arthur do it on his own? 1036 01:20:22,034 --> 01:20:24,379 Nobody knows. 1037 01:20:32,655 --> 01:20:36,827 -I've never bought the theory that it was the two of them. 1038 01:20:36,931 --> 01:20:42,482 They were probably involved in the plot. 1039 01:20:42,586 --> 01:20:45,275 Were the real killers ever caught? 1040 01:20:45,379 --> 01:20:47,448 I don't think so. 1041 01:20:47,551 --> 01:20:49,206 I think they were either commissioned to do it 1042 01:20:49,310 --> 01:20:50,517 or they were the middlemen 1043 01:20:50,620 --> 01:20:53,275 who then commissioned someone to do it. 1044 01:20:53,379 --> 01:20:54,931 They could have come clean, 1045 01:20:55,034 --> 01:20:56,689 they could have told what they knew. 1046 01:20:56,793 --> 01:20:59,379 Why didn't they try and do that? 1047 01:20:59,482 --> 01:21:01,724 And the answer for me has to be that 1048 01:21:01,827 --> 01:21:03,827 there were other people involved. 1049 01:21:03,931 --> 01:21:07,000 Far as Bill Smith and John Minus cared, 1050 01:21:07,103 --> 01:21:08,379 that was the end of the case, 1051 01:21:08,482 --> 01:21:10,310 they'd successfully got arrests 1052 01:21:10,413 --> 01:21:14,379 that led to successful convictions. 1053 01:21:14,482 --> 01:21:17,068 But a lot of the younger police were very unconvinced 1054 01:21:17,172 --> 01:21:19,000 by the whole thing. 1055 01:21:24,620 --> 01:21:26,241 -The man with the loneliest job in the world 1056 01:21:26,344 --> 01:21:28,379 works only a step off the streets of London. 1057 01:21:28,482 --> 01:21:31,689 He's the night watchman at Madame Tussaud's Waxwork. 1058 01:21:31,793 --> 01:21:34,275 Night plays tricks on the eyes, 1059 01:21:34,379 --> 01:21:39,758 concerning this gallery of the world's greatest criminals. 1060 01:21:39,862 --> 01:21:43,758 -We went to Madame Tussaud's afterwards. 1061 01:21:43,862 --> 01:21:47,551 Arthur and Nizam were there in Madame Tussaud's, 1062 01:21:47,655 --> 01:21:53,206 standing in front of the pretend prison cells. 1063 01:21:53,310 --> 01:21:56,896 That was quite a shock, actually. 1064 01:21:57,000 --> 01:21:58,482 -Looking back on it, 1065 01:21:58,586 --> 01:22:01,827 I suppose there was a certain demonization. 1066 01:22:01,931 --> 01:22:07,655 I mean, there was unquestioned sort of prejudice in Britain, 1067 01:22:07,758 --> 01:22:10,241 and we lived in a very different world. 1068 01:22:10,344 --> 01:22:12,344 And the fact that they had -- 1069 01:22:12,448 --> 01:22:16,103 that the people who've been accused of this crime 1070 01:22:16,206 --> 01:22:20,655 were not white 1071 01:22:20,758 --> 01:22:23,827 probably played an element in the public's view 1072 01:22:23,931 --> 01:22:26,448 that they got the right people, 1073 01:22:26,551 --> 01:22:30,482 and probably the police view they got the right people. 1074 01:22:30,586 --> 01:22:34,103 But it never occurred to me that they got the right people. 1075 01:22:40,448 --> 01:22:43,448 -I had to go down to Trinidad for a double murder 1076 01:22:43,551 --> 01:22:46,551 that I was investigating for a British man on death row, 1077 01:22:46,655 --> 01:22:50,344 and I wanted to investigate Adam Hosein, 1078 01:22:50,448 --> 01:22:53,793 because he was obviously deeply involved in 1079 01:22:53,896 --> 01:22:58,482 the cartel money laundering that was behind that double murder. 1080 01:22:58,586 --> 01:23:02,620 I wanted to talk to Adam, and I went to his house 1081 01:23:02,724 --> 01:23:05,896 and I met this older woman at the door 1082 01:23:06,000 --> 01:23:08,034 who I took to be his mother, 1083 01:23:08,137 --> 01:23:11,551 and she said Adam wasn't around, but we got into conversation 1084 01:23:11,655 --> 01:23:17,551 and somehow we got to talk about the Muriel McKay murder. 1085 01:23:17,655 --> 01:23:20,793 She said that he was the smart one, 1086 01:23:20,896 --> 01:23:25,103 and he was the one who got his brothers into trouble, 1087 01:23:25,206 --> 01:23:27,689 that it was Adam who was the one behind that 1088 01:23:27,793 --> 01:23:30,000 and not the other two boys. 1089 01:23:30,103 --> 01:23:31,827 She said Adam did it. 1090 01:23:35,655 --> 01:23:37,724 I've been involved in representing people 1091 01:23:37,827 --> 01:23:39,931 in over 400 murder cases over the years, 1092 01:23:40,034 --> 01:23:42,344 so I've got to know people's MO fairly well, 1093 01:23:42,448 --> 01:23:46,137 and one of the things that clever people do 1094 01:23:46,241 --> 01:23:48,344 when they're involved in a murder 1095 01:23:48,448 --> 01:23:51,034 is they set themselves up with an alibi, 1096 01:23:51,137 --> 01:23:53,206 a free-willed alibi, if you will. 1097 01:23:53,310 --> 01:23:56,896 And then the other person goes down for it. 1098 01:23:57,000 --> 01:24:01,241 It then becomes way more difficult for the police to say, 1099 01:24:01,344 --> 01:24:03,172 "Oh, but you were still the mastermind behind it," 1100 01:24:03,275 --> 01:24:05,517 because then they've got to get someone to snitch on you, 1101 01:24:05,620 --> 01:24:08,137 and that's always harder. 1102 01:24:08,241 --> 01:24:12,068 I got the impression that there were a number of people 1103 01:24:12,172 --> 01:24:14,379 involved in the Muriel McKay case, 1104 01:24:14,482 --> 01:24:18,000 and that there were some really bad guys involved 1105 01:24:18,103 --> 01:24:21,206 who could have been involved in London gangs, 1106 01:24:21,310 --> 01:24:23,034 who you wouldn't want to cross. 1107 01:24:30,862 --> 01:24:33,758 -My father, he did deserve it. 1108 01:24:33,862 --> 01:24:35,724 Definitely. 1109 01:24:38,206 --> 01:24:39,896 Not Nizam. 1110 01:24:43,275 --> 01:24:47,620 He didn't do anything, he had to do these things 1111 01:24:47,724 --> 01:24:51,551 for Arthur, 1112 01:24:51,655 --> 01:24:55,551 because I know how he treated him at home. 1113 01:24:55,655 --> 01:24:59,000 I know exactly how, so I can imagine how that went. 1114 01:25:00,689 --> 01:25:03,413 We all cried... 1115 01:25:03,517 --> 01:25:07,137 Because of Nizam going in prison for so long -- 1116 01:25:07,241 --> 01:25:09,137 20 years, I think. 1117 01:25:09,241 --> 01:25:11,034 That's -- no. 1118 01:27:09,413 --> 01:27:11,517 -I do wake up and think about her. 1119 01:27:13,896 --> 01:27:15,413 You know, she is always there. 1120 01:27:18,137 --> 01:27:20,620 -Such a lovely mother to us all. 1121 01:27:27,103 --> 01:27:32,586 -And one of the kindest people that I've ever known. 1122 01:27:32,689 --> 01:27:35,620 And she was just delightful. 1123 01:27:40,241 --> 01:27:43,034 -I looked for my mother. 1124 01:27:43,137 --> 01:27:45,379 You know, you sort of catch sight of someone flashing by, 1125 01:27:45,482 --> 01:27:46,931 and say, "Oh, my God, it's her!" 1126 01:27:47,034 --> 01:27:49,310 You know, you just could not have that -- 1127 01:27:49,413 --> 01:27:50,724 you could not close the door, 1128 01:27:50,827 --> 01:27:53,103 you just could not close up on it. 1129 01:27:53,206 --> 01:27:57,137 Whatever you knew or suspected, you never knew. 1130 01:27:57,241 --> 01:27:59,655 And it's always that element of hope. 1131 01:28:05,517 --> 01:28:07,413 -I drove with my sister. 1132 01:28:10,862 --> 01:28:13,137 I said, "My mother could be on the Thames, 1133 01:28:13,241 --> 01:28:14,586 she could be quite close." 1134 01:28:19,172 --> 01:28:21,586 And we drove all along the river. 1135 01:28:21,689 --> 01:28:23,103 And I said, 1136 01:28:23,206 --> 01:28:25,482 "This is so hopeless." 1137 01:28:25,586 --> 01:28:28,862 That -- the feeling of hopelessness. 1138 01:28:28,965 --> 01:28:30,724 Someone taken from you. 1139 01:28:33,034 --> 01:28:34,862 Well, I suppose you always hope 1140 01:28:34,965 --> 01:28:38,379 that somebody might have some information somewhere. 1141 01:28:38,482 --> 01:28:42,620 Maybe something comes out of somebody's watching this. 1142 01:28:45,965 --> 01:28:48,758 And maybe they -- they do know what happened. 1143 01:28:48,862 --> 01:28:52,172 Maybe. 1144 01:28:52,275 --> 01:28:53,965 You know, where is she?