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[electricity buzzing]
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Downloaded from
YTS.MX
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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX
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INTERVIEWER:
Are we doing a disservice
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to the individuality of you
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and the rest
of the young group that,
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by calling you the Brat Pack
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00:00:24,048 --> 00:00:28,098
and by sort of
putting in one group
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00:00:28,098 --> 00:00:31,020
and stereotyping
all of you as young actors
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who've made it
and who now sort of control
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a lot of Hollywood?
- [laughs]
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Oh, I wouldn't say control,
but--
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INTERVIEWER: But are part
of the sort of--
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Well, I think it's easy
to just group people
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together in any level.
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So it's just an easier way
to get a handle on people,
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00:00:48,597 --> 00:00:50,810
but I think all of us
are very different.
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[keyboard clacking]
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INTERVIEWER:
Does it offend you
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when they talk about
the Brat Pack?
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ANDREW: I kind of let it--
try and let it,
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like, slide off your back.
I mean, it happens.
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And that stuff will sift
itself out, I think.
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INTERVIEWER:
Now, you've met early success.
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Lots of people struggle
for a long time.
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Is this an uncertain period
for you?
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ANDREW: [laughs]
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If you were coming
of age in the 1980s,
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then the Brat Pack was at
or near the center
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of your cultural awareness.
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I mean, we were who you wanted
to hang with, who you emulated
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or envied,
who you wanted to party with.
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But for those of us
experiencing the Brat Pack
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from the inside, it was
something very different.
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INTERVIEWER:
Is it overwhelming?
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Is it ever overwhelming, the--
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what you have in front of you
and what all you can do?
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Right, um...
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And perhaps the pressure,
too, there?
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- You're 22 now?
- 22.
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[interviewer whistles]
INTERVIEWER: Wow.
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I thought
I was gonna get used to it,
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and I don't think I ever quite
got used to it.
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And we fit a niche
that needed to be filled
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in pop culture
at that moment, you know?
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00:02:01,577 --> 00:02:05,459
And what was that?
What was the need to create us?
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We were a group
of young actors
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who were trying
to have careers,
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and we were suddenly
bonded together indelibly
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forever as this unit.
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However much sort of truth or
not truth is involved in it,
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it doesn't really matter.
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And I think that's
what some of us
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resented so much
at the beginning is that,
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this isn't the right perception
of who we are.
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This isn't the reality
of our experience.
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[dramatic music]
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[Joy Division's
"Love Will Tear Us Apart"]
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♪ ♪
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IAN:
♪ When routine bites hard ♪
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♪ And ambitions are low ♪
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ANDREW: When I was 17,
I moved into New York City,
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and I lived on the
fourth floor of this building
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right off
Washington Square Park.
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In 1980, New York City
was a completely
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different place than it is now.
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♪ ♪
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[police sirens wailing]
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People always say that
about the past, don't they?
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[laughing]
But it was.
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It was scary.
It was thrilling.
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It was dirty.
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And I spent most of my time
right here
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in Washington Square Park
because I was at NYU.
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And when I was
cutting my classes,
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I used to play frisbee
in the park every day
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and buy two joints every day
from the same Rastafarian
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playing soccer right here.
I'd smoke them.
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I'd go home and watch
The Rockford Files.
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[laughs]
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I was not exactly
the guy most likely to be
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in the movies two years later.
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ROSCOE: Oh, whoa!
Jeez, oh, God!
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Great, douche bag.
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ANDREW: And then suddenly
the fortunes
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of a group of young actors,
including me, soared.
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[Bob Seger's
"Old Time Rock and Roll"]
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Hollywood discovered
the box office
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potential of a young audience.
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BOB: ♪ Just take those old
records off the shelf ♪
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ANDREW: They aimed
their moneymaking
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tractor beam directly at it.
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BOB: ♪ Today's music
ain't got the same soul ♪
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♪ I like that old-time
rock and roll ♪
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It's the Hollywood
class of 1985.
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A crop of young movie actors
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that's giving young audiences
a whole new generation
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of heroes to root for.
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It's an incredible time
to be 22, 23 right now
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and to be a young actor because
the films are catering to us.
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But right now, it's great.
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The movies are being made
about my age of people.
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That's the audience
that's going.
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ANDREW: Audiences, they--
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they couldn't get
enough of us.
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It seemed that every weekend,
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there was another movie,
and another movie,
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and another movie about
and starring young people.
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In the history of Hollywood,
it had never been like this.
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This sounds like
a dream come true.
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You are all in your early 20s,
and you're stars.
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[applause]
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Welcome, if you will,
Molly Ringwald.
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[cheering]
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And then on June 10, 1985,
New York Magazine
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published a story called
"Hollywood's Brat Pack."
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It was originally intended
to be this small feature
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on Emilio Estevez.
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It took off and became
this whole other thing.
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The hottest stars
in the movies today
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are officially known
as the Brat Pack.
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[The Cure's
"Just Like Heaven"]
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♪ ♪
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REPORTER: And so we return
to the week's new releases
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and St. Elmo's Fire, which
stars a group of young actors
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who are fast becoming
known as the Brat Pack.
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A card-carrying member
of the Brat Pack.
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A cover titled the Brat Pack.
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They're the Brat Pack.
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What is the Brat Pack?
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REPORTER:
Everyone in this group
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is a most-likely-to-succeed.
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They are ambitious, committed,
and many of them
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have real talent.
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♪ ♪
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ANDREW:
Within days, news outlets
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around the country were using
the term "Brat Pack."
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There's a big article
in New York Magazine...
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Yes.
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About something
called the Brat Pack.
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Right, right, and I heard
that you wanted to join.
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- I'd like to be in this group.
- Yeah, right.
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ROBERT:
♪ Show me, show me, show me ♪
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♪ How you do that trick ♪
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♪ The one that makes
me scream, she said ♪
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♪ The one that makes
me laugh, she said ♪
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Is this the future--
what is--
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are these the Brandos?
- Well, talk to Brando.
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You would replace
Katharine Hepburn tomorrow.
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♪ I promise that
I'll run away with you ♪
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♪ I'll run away with you ♪
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♪ ♪
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I just remember seeing
that cover and thinking,
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"oh, fuck."
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I just thought
that was terrible instantly.
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And it turns out,
uh, I was right.
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[laughs]
It was--
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00:07:01,968 --> 00:07:05,224
the article was scathing
about all these young actors.
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00:07:05,224 --> 00:07:07,813
And the phrase,
being such a clever,
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00:07:07,813 --> 00:07:10,694
witty phrase, you know,
it caught the zeitgeist
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instantly and burned deep,
and that was it.
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From then on, my career
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and the career
of several other people
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was branded without
any wiggle room
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as the Brat Pack.
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I'm really sorry
that article had to come out.
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You know, it was just when,
you know,
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kids, young, you know, adults
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00:07:27,812 --> 00:07:29,314
were beginning
to find their place,
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you know, in this business.
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INTERVIEWER:
It's a clever line,
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"Brat Pack."
- Yeah.
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INTERVIEWER:
But what does it mean, really?
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00:07:34,784 --> 00:07:35,994
You know what?
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00:07:35,994 --> 00:07:38,374
It-- it was a term
created by the media.
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It was a nice, generic term.
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00:07:39,585 --> 00:07:41,004
You know, you don't say
a "Tylenol."
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00:07:41,004 --> 00:07:42,340
You say an "aspirin."
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00:07:42,340 --> 00:07:44,136
You don't say a "Rob Lowe."
You say a "Brat".
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00:07:44,136 --> 00:07:46,306
Do you know what I mean?
That's how it was created.
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INTERVIEWER:
Are you offended by it?
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00:07:47,518 --> 00:07:48,854
Very much so.
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00:07:48,854 --> 00:07:50,439
ANDREW: I don't really think
it's a valid thing.
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00:07:50,439 --> 00:07:52,443
I mean, we all don't go
to the same bar every night,
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00:07:52,443 --> 00:07:54,866
and talk about chicks
and, you know,
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00:07:54,866 --> 00:07:56,493
throw back a few brews.
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00:07:56,493 --> 00:08:00,711
I mean, I don't think
it exists per se.
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They thought
I was their friend.
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00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:03,842
Well, you know,
the honest truth is,
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00:08:03,842 --> 00:08:06,388
you know, we're not friends,
and I never said that we were.
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00:08:06,388 --> 00:08:08,727
I'm sorry he didn't realize
that or that he was operating
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00:08:08,727 --> 00:08:10,438
under a different set
of ideas about
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00:08:10,438 --> 00:08:12,693
what the relationship between
a journalist and a subject is.
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00:08:12,693 --> 00:08:14,070
It doesn't apply.
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00:08:14,070 --> 00:08:15,532
It never did.
INTERVIEWER: Yeah?
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00:08:15,532 --> 00:08:17,160
And it was just
some writer's
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00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:19,247
silly imagination or label
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00:08:19,247 --> 00:08:22,128
that he could sort of stamp
on this young group of actors
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00:08:22,128 --> 00:08:24,634
that he didn't have
any other explanation for.
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00:08:24,634 --> 00:08:26,094
The name alone--
201
00:08:26,094 --> 00:08:28,683
the term alone always brings up
this defensive quality.
202
00:08:28,683 --> 00:08:30,353
And so--
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00:08:30,353 --> 00:08:32,273
INTERVIEWER: Did you ever feel
a part of the Brat Pack
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00:08:32,273 --> 00:08:33,860
that you're
so closely associated--
205
00:08:33,860 --> 00:08:35,196
No, I felt a part
of a group of young actors
206
00:08:35,196 --> 00:08:37,116
that worked continually
with each other.
207
00:08:37,116 --> 00:08:39,246
The Brat Pack is an image
that somebody thought up
208
00:08:39,246 --> 00:08:41,083
who doesn't know
anything about us.
209
00:08:41,083 --> 00:08:42,920
That I can't
trust anyone now.
210
00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:45,258
That's what I learned.
That's what I learned.
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00:08:45,258 --> 00:08:46,511
[soft dramatic music]
212
00:08:46,511 --> 00:08:48,055
ANDREW: That changed my life.
213
00:08:48,055 --> 00:08:51,311
And that changed everyone
who was involved's life.
214
00:08:51,311 --> 00:08:53,148
Once the Brat Pack thing
happened,
215
00:08:53,148 --> 00:08:55,444
everyone just sort of,
poof, scattered.
216
00:08:55,444 --> 00:08:58,785
Because it was--
it was such a stigma
217
00:08:58,785 --> 00:09:01,666
early on that we didn't want
to be associated with it.
218
00:09:01,666 --> 00:09:05,590
I've never talked to anybody
about what that was like.
219
00:09:05,590 --> 00:09:09,264
It certainly was
a defining thing in my life,
220
00:09:09,264 --> 00:09:13,355
and I imagine
it was in theirs as well.
221
00:09:13,355 --> 00:09:16,445
So I thought it might be
interesting to try and contact
222
00:09:16,445 --> 00:09:18,950
everyone who was in
the Brat Pack
223
00:09:18,950 --> 00:09:20,537
or who might have been
associated with the Brat--
224
00:09:20,537 --> 00:09:22,875
and sort of see what their
experience was at that time
225
00:09:22,875 --> 00:09:27,383
and what it's come to mean
all these years, decades later.
226
00:09:27,383 --> 00:09:30,389
[bright orchestral music]
227
00:09:30,389 --> 00:09:37,236
♪ ♪
228
00:09:37,236 --> 00:09:39,157
I think the first thing
we need to establish
229
00:09:39,157 --> 00:09:41,370
is, like, who is in
the Brat Pack, right?
230
00:09:41,370 --> 00:09:42,998
[laughs]
There's me.
231
00:09:42,998 --> 00:09:48,092
There's Rob Lowe, Judd Nelson,
Emilio Estevez, Ally Sheedy.
232
00:09:48,092 --> 00:09:51,139
Demi Moore, Molly Ringwald.
233
00:09:51,139 --> 00:09:52,685
It's a moveable feast, I think.
234
00:09:52,685 --> 00:09:57,110
Anyway, so I know
it started with Emilio
235
00:09:57,110 --> 00:09:59,239
because it was
the article about him
236
00:09:59,239 --> 00:10:00,701
that created the whole thing.
237
00:10:00,701 --> 00:10:02,996
So I'm calling Emilio.
238
00:10:02,996 --> 00:10:05,251
[line trilling]
239
00:10:05,251 --> 00:10:07,004
Hey, Emilio Estevez.
240
00:10:07,004 --> 00:10:08,550
This is Andrew McCarthy
calling you.
241
00:10:08,550 --> 00:10:10,887
That was nice,
to just hear your voice there.
242
00:10:10,887 --> 00:10:14,102
I hope you're well.
Long time.
243
00:10:14,102 --> 00:10:15,647
Give me a call
if you get a chance.
244
00:10:15,647 --> 00:10:17,943
I'd love to talk to you
about something.
245
00:10:17,943 --> 00:10:19,655
I think I'll call Ally,
246
00:10:19,655 --> 00:10:22,326
but it could be 30 years
since I've seen Ally.
247
00:10:22,326 --> 00:10:24,999
I got her number
from a friend of mine.
248
00:10:24,999 --> 00:10:26,251
Let's call her up.
249
00:10:26,251 --> 00:10:27,378
[line trilling]
250
00:10:27,378 --> 00:10:28,673
Hey, Ally.
251
00:10:28,673 --> 00:10:30,301
This is Andrew McCarthy
calling you.
252
00:10:30,301 --> 00:10:32,346
Hey, Molly.
Nice to hear your voice.
253
00:10:32,346 --> 00:10:33,725
Andrew McCarthy calling you up.
254
00:10:33,725 --> 00:10:35,102
How are you?
255
00:10:35,102 --> 00:10:37,273
It's so strange to hear
people's voices again.
256
00:10:37,273 --> 00:10:39,695
I haven't been able to find
Judd Nelson's phone number.
257
00:10:39,695 --> 00:10:41,323
I don't know anybody
who knows his phone number.
258
00:10:41,323 --> 00:10:43,786
I asked his manager about it.
259
00:10:43,786 --> 00:10:45,957
But we are
Brat Pack brethren and--
260
00:10:45,957 --> 00:10:47,168
[laughs]
261
00:10:47,168 --> 00:10:50,174
[upbeat jazzy music]
262
00:10:50,174 --> 00:10:51,384
♪ ♪
263
00:10:51,384 --> 00:10:52,470
Hey, Demi.
264
00:10:52,470 --> 00:10:53,472
This is Andrew McCarthy
calling.
265
00:10:53,472 --> 00:10:54,934
How are you?
266
00:10:54,934 --> 00:10:56,269
Listen, I'd love to chat
with you about something.
267
00:10:56,269 --> 00:10:57,396
If you get a chance,
give me a call back.
268
00:10:57,396 --> 00:10:59,693
That was Demi.
I left her a message.
269
00:10:59,693 --> 00:11:02,741
Let's call Rob.
270
00:11:02,741 --> 00:11:06,122
[line trilling]
Ugh.
271
00:11:06,122 --> 00:11:07,543
VOICEMAIL: Automated
voice message system.
272
00:11:07,543 --> 00:11:09,713
Hey, Rob.
Andrew McCarthy calling you.
273
00:11:09,713 --> 00:11:11,299
I'd love to chat with you
if you have a chance.
274
00:11:11,299 --> 00:11:12,678
Give me a call.
917--
275
00:11:12,678 --> 00:11:13,763
[phone ringing]
276
00:11:13,763 --> 00:11:14,974
Are you ready to go
on the camera?
277
00:11:14,974 --> 00:11:18,063
CAMERAPERSON:
Uh, yeah, rolling.
278
00:11:18,063 --> 00:11:19,315
Hello.
279
00:11:19,315 --> 00:11:21,319
SPEAKER: Andrew?
- Yep.
280
00:11:21,319 --> 00:11:22,573
SPEAKER: Hi.
- Hey, man.
281
00:11:22,573 --> 00:11:24,242
How are you?
[laughs]
282
00:11:24,242 --> 00:11:26,329
How has your life been
the last 30 years?
283
00:11:26,329 --> 00:11:28,166
[laughs]
[phone ringing]
284
00:11:28,166 --> 00:11:30,462
How are you?
285
00:11:30,462 --> 00:11:32,968
[laughs]
[phone ringing]
286
00:11:32,968 --> 00:11:34,638
So where are you now, Demi?
287
00:11:34,638 --> 00:11:36,893
DEMI: In LA right now,
but I've been going
288
00:11:36,893 --> 00:11:38,897
back and forth between here--
289
00:11:38,897 --> 00:11:41,234
ANDREW: We were such
a select kind of group of--
290
00:11:41,234 --> 00:11:43,363
you know,
this happened to all of us.
291
00:11:43,363 --> 00:11:45,535
And it fell down
on all of us in such a way,
292
00:11:45,535 --> 00:11:47,455
and I've never talked
to anybody about it,
293
00:11:47,455 --> 00:11:50,294
and it affected my life
so massively and--
294
00:11:50,294 --> 00:11:51,881
right?
And so I would just love
295
00:11:51,881 --> 00:11:55,095
to get your perspective.
[phone ringing]
296
00:11:55,095 --> 00:11:56,473
Judd Nelson.
297
00:11:56,473 --> 00:11:58,770
So Rob just
called me back here.
298
00:11:58,770 --> 00:12:00,732
I'm in a hotel in Chicago.
299
00:12:00,732 --> 00:12:02,026
I've just landed here.
SPEAKER: Hey.
300
00:12:02,026 --> 00:12:03,028
Hey, man.
301
00:12:03,028 --> 00:12:04,657
How are you?
[chuckles]
302
00:12:04,657 --> 00:12:07,286
Well, you know, you, Rob,
me, you know, Ally--
303
00:12:07,286 --> 00:12:09,207
whoever is actually in
the Brat Pack.
304
00:12:09,207 --> 00:12:12,673
And I wanted to sort of make
a documentary about it.
305
00:12:12,673 --> 00:12:14,510
Well, that's the whole point
of talking about it,
306
00:12:14,510 --> 00:12:16,597
so we don't get triggered
by these things anymore,
307
00:12:16,597 --> 00:12:17,974
you know?
308
00:12:17,974 --> 00:12:20,354
Oh, my gosh, there's my dog,
who weighs 75 pounds.
309
00:12:20,354 --> 00:12:22,400
[laughter]
310
00:12:22,400 --> 00:12:24,613
Do you think Willow
weighs 75 pounds?
311
00:12:24,613 --> 00:12:27,577
No, the dog, not Willow.
Anyway.
312
00:12:27,577 --> 00:12:30,416
When would you
want to do it?
313
00:12:30,416 --> 00:12:33,506
When would you want to do it?
314
00:12:33,506 --> 00:12:35,342
Oh, don't tell me
any of this now.
315
00:12:35,342 --> 00:12:37,471
Don't tell me now.
I want to get it all on film.
316
00:12:37,471 --> 00:12:39,601
[laughs]
So could I come out to Malibu,
317
00:12:39,601 --> 00:12:40,729
and sit down with you
with a camera
318
00:12:40,729 --> 00:12:42,148
and chat about it?
319
00:12:42,148 --> 00:12:45,404
[Steve Winwood's
"Back in the High Life Again"]
320
00:12:45,404 --> 00:12:48,285
♪ ♪
321
00:12:48,285 --> 00:12:52,001
When I was 22 years old,
I bought my first toy.
322
00:12:52,001 --> 00:12:55,257
I bought a 1967
red Camaro convertible.
323
00:12:55,257 --> 00:12:57,929
Now, here I am, 59 years old.
324
00:12:57,929 --> 00:13:00,476
I'm driving a red
rental Camaro convertible.
325
00:13:00,476 --> 00:13:05,277
What makes you a cool kid at 22
makes you a fool at 59.
326
00:13:05,277 --> 00:13:06,906
[laughs]
327
00:13:06,906 --> 00:13:12,082
STEVE: ♪ I'll be back
in the high life again ♪
328
00:13:12,082 --> 00:13:18,470
♪ All the doors I closed
one time will open up again ♪
329
00:13:18,470 --> 00:13:19,973
♪ I'll be back in the ♪
330
00:13:19,973 --> 00:13:22,854
ANDREW: Heading up to see
Emilio here in Malibu.
331
00:13:22,854 --> 00:13:26,319
I haven't seen Emilio
since maybe the premiere night
332
00:13:26,319 --> 00:13:27,614
of St. Elmo's Fire.
333
00:13:27,614 --> 00:13:29,075
So what's that,
30-odd years ago?
334
00:13:29,075 --> 00:13:30,410
I am Bob, yeah.
335
00:13:30,410 --> 00:13:31,454
ANDREW: Yeah,
I haven't seen him since.
336
00:13:31,454 --> 00:13:32,958
Then you know good.
337
00:13:32,958 --> 00:13:34,085
- I love your stuff, Bob.
- Hey, thank you.
338
00:13:34,085 --> 00:13:35,420
- Take care.
- Hey.
339
00:13:35,420 --> 00:13:36,549
ANDREW: I always felt like
he was sort of
340
00:13:36,549 --> 00:13:37,968
an insider in some club.
341
00:13:37,968 --> 00:13:40,640
And I always felt like
the guy on the outside.
342
00:13:40,640 --> 00:13:42,602
You know?
I lived in New York.
343
00:13:42,602 --> 00:13:44,063
All the other guys lived here.
344
00:13:44,063 --> 00:13:45,190
And Emilio seemed
to know more than anybody,
345
00:13:45,190 --> 00:13:46,777
like, what the deal was.
346
00:13:46,777 --> 00:13:49,365
So it'll be great to see him
and get his take on all this.
347
00:13:49,365 --> 00:13:50,869
Because I know
Emilio hasn't talked much
348
00:13:50,869 --> 00:13:53,958
about the Brat Pack
in all these years.
349
00:13:55,085 --> 00:13:56,462
Hold on, dude.
350
00:13:56,462 --> 00:13:57,632
Take your time.
351
00:13:57,632 --> 00:14:00,304
I missed the grid.
I missed the grid.
352
00:14:00,304 --> 00:14:02,141
What number is that?
I don't know.
353
00:14:02,141 --> 00:14:03,268
Yo!
354
00:14:03,268 --> 00:14:05,439
[laughs]
There's Emilio.
355
00:14:05,439 --> 00:14:07,318
[laughs]
EMILIO: How are you?
356
00:14:07,318 --> 00:14:08,696
I'm so glad to see you.
357
00:14:08,696 --> 00:14:09,948
This is Ed.
This is Emilio.
358
00:14:09,948 --> 00:14:11,159
Emilio.
Nice to see you.
359
00:14:11,159 --> 00:14:12,411
Good morning.
Nice to see you.
360
00:14:12,411 --> 00:14:13,413
Are you good?
Are you rolling?
361
00:14:13,413 --> 00:14:14,498
Yeah.
362
00:14:14,498 --> 00:14:16,503
Have you seen this
in 30-odd years?
363
00:14:16,503 --> 00:14:18,507
I probably have online.
364
00:14:18,507 --> 00:14:20,344
Well, I had seen it online
when I did--
365
00:14:20,344 --> 00:14:22,014
but there's all the artwork
366
00:14:22,014 --> 00:14:23,935
and everything to it,
you know?
367
00:14:23,935 --> 00:14:25,479
And it's interesting.
368
00:14:25,479 --> 00:14:27,776
Have you read it
in the past ever years?
369
00:14:27,776 --> 00:14:29,278
EMILIO: No.
ANDREW: I mean, it's--
370
00:14:29,278 --> 00:14:30,573
EMILIO: Massive feature.
371
00:14:30,573 --> 00:14:31,575
ANDREW: Massive story,
isn't it?
372
00:14:31,575 --> 00:14:32,953
Yep.
373
00:14:32,953 --> 00:14:34,080
ANDREW:
Well, the first question I--
374
00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:35,541
[laughs]
375
00:14:35,541 --> 00:14:36,877
This might end
our conversation right now.
376
00:14:36,877 --> 00:14:38,213
There's just-- no,
there's just so much, Andrew.
377
00:14:38,213 --> 00:14:39,508
First of all--
378
00:14:39,508 --> 00:14:41,052
It's like, what the fuck
were you thinking?
379
00:14:41,052 --> 00:14:42,096
[laughs]
380
00:14:42,096 --> 00:14:43,975
Well, I wasn't.
381
00:14:43,975 --> 00:14:47,857
And I had had some experience
and had done some press
382
00:14:47,857 --> 00:14:52,701
but nothing to the extent of,
like, a real sort of profile,
383
00:14:52,701 --> 00:14:54,453
which made me uncomfortable.
384
00:14:54,453 --> 00:14:57,669
It was naive of me
to think that this journalist
385
00:14:57,669 --> 00:15:00,340
would, in fact, be my friend.
386
00:15:00,340 --> 00:15:02,094
I think the most upsetting
about it--
387
00:15:02,094 --> 00:15:05,727
because I had already seen
a different path for myself,
388
00:15:05,727 --> 00:15:07,564
and I felt derailed.
389
00:15:07,564 --> 00:15:09,693
Emilio Estevez is the son
of actor Martin Sheen,
390
00:15:09,693 --> 00:15:12,949
but he has made a name
for himself on his own.
391
00:15:12,949 --> 00:15:14,619
Do you have any feeling
as to which direction
392
00:15:14,619 --> 00:15:15,913
your career will take?
393
00:15:15,913 --> 00:15:17,458
EMILIO: The opportunities
are just--
394
00:15:17,458 --> 00:15:19,128
are endless.
Very exciting.
395
00:15:19,128 --> 00:15:20,380
REPORTER: At 23 years old.
396
00:15:20,380 --> 00:15:21,550
EMILIO: Yes.
397
00:15:21,550 --> 00:15:24,221
Ah, thank you very much.
Appreciate it.
398
00:15:24,221 --> 00:15:25,933
ASSISTANT: There's also juice
if you need it.
399
00:15:25,933 --> 00:15:27,352
OK, thanks.
400
00:15:27,352 --> 00:15:28,856
ANDREW: I mean, the fallout
in my recollection is
401
00:15:28,856 --> 00:15:30,943
it was immediate and big.
402
00:15:30,943 --> 00:15:32,321
You and I didn't do a movie
because of it.
403
00:15:32,321 --> 00:15:33,448
ANDREW: This is what I thought.
404
00:15:33,448 --> 00:15:34,868
And I thought
we were going to--
405
00:15:34,868 --> 00:15:36,287
And this was Young Men
with Unlimited Capital...
406
00:15:36,287 --> 00:15:37,456
ANDREW: Yes.
407
00:15:37,456 --> 00:15:38,834
Which was one
of the best scripts
408
00:15:38,834 --> 00:15:40,337
I had read in a long time.
- You were gonna do it.
409
00:15:40,337 --> 00:15:41,840
And they wanted me
to do it too,
410
00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:44,178
and then they told me that
you didn't want me to do it,
411
00:15:44,178 --> 00:15:45,388
and I just assumed
at the time--
412
00:15:45,388 --> 00:15:46,809
it hurt my feelings a lot,
but I assumed
413
00:15:46,809 --> 00:15:48,394
it was simply
the Brat Pack fallout.
414
00:15:48,394 --> 00:15:50,691
I didn't want to have
anything to do with any of us.
415
00:15:50,691 --> 00:15:52,027
Do you know what I mean?
- Yeah, yeah.
416
00:15:52,027 --> 00:15:53,781
I just--
I didn't want to do any--
417
00:15:53,781 --> 00:15:55,200
I wouldn't-- if it were Judd,
I would have said
418
00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:56,202
the same thing.
419
00:15:56,202 --> 00:15:57,831
To be seen again
in another film
420
00:15:57,831 --> 00:15:59,918
would ultimately
and could potentially
421
00:15:59,918 --> 00:16:01,839
have a negative impact.
422
00:16:01,839 --> 00:16:04,135
Working together just almost
felt like we were--
423
00:16:04,135 --> 00:16:05,972
we were kryptonite
to each other.
424
00:16:05,972 --> 00:16:07,725
ANDREW: My understanding--
you were not interested
425
00:16:07,725 --> 00:16:10,397
in talking about the Brat Pack
for years and years.
426
00:16:10,397 --> 00:16:12,234
I'm asked to do
retrospectives all the time,
427
00:16:12,234 --> 00:16:13,821
whether it's Repo Man,
or The Outsiders,
428
00:16:13,821 --> 00:16:15,741
or Young Guns,
or Breakfast Club.
429
00:16:15,741 --> 00:16:17,244
I turn everything down.
There was an opportunity--
430
00:16:17,244 --> 00:16:18,873
ANDREW: How come
you're talking to me?
431
00:16:18,873 --> 00:16:20,960
Because you called me.
432
00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:22,797
Because you asked.
You called me.
433
00:16:22,797 --> 00:16:28,601
And I also thought it was time
that we sort of clear the air
434
00:16:28,601 --> 00:16:30,103
on a couple of things.
435
00:16:30,103 --> 00:16:31,773
And that Young Men
with Unlimited Capital
436
00:16:31,773 --> 00:16:33,777
was something that
I'm glad we were...
437
00:16:33,777 --> 00:16:35,197
ANDREW: Oh, me, too.
- Able to talk through it.
438
00:16:35,197 --> 00:16:36,575
ANDREW: Because I feel chills
right now.
439
00:16:36,575 --> 00:16:37,869
It's like--
you know, it's nice.
440
00:16:37,869 --> 00:16:39,079
You know, one of the reasons
441
00:16:39,079 --> 00:16:42,169
I started to want
to make this movie--
442
00:16:42,169 --> 00:16:44,423
wow, I really--
it's very touching.
443
00:16:44,423 --> 00:16:47,931
You know, it only happened
to a handful of us,
444
00:16:47,931 --> 00:16:50,018
and it really affected my life.
445
00:16:50,018 --> 00:16:51,479
Which is probably why
I don't--
446
00:16:51,479 --> 00:16:53,399
I'm not interested
in revisiting,
447
00:16:53,399 --> 00:16:55,905
which is why I'm not interested
in, you know,
448
00:16:55,905 --> 00:16:57,449
dredging up the past
449
00:16:57,449 --> 00:16:59,955
because I think
if you're too busy looking
450
00:16:59,955 --> 00:17:02,167
in your rearview mirror and
looking at what's behind you,
451
00:17:02,167 --> 00:17:03,796
you're going to stumble
trying to move forward.
452
00:17:03,796 --> 00:17:05,423
ANDREW: But it's
an interesting thing.
453
00:17:05,423 --> 00:17:07,887
Because if you're confronted
on a however often basis
454
00:17:07,887 --> 00:17:09,599
by people going,
"Oh, the Brat Pack movies,
455
00:17:09,599 --> 00:17:11,227
I love St. Elmo's,
I love Breakfast Club,
456
00:17:11,227 --> 00:17:12,981
you're gonna be--
it's not like you can
457
00:17:12,981 --> 00:17:14,567
just sort of put it in the past
and leave it there.
458
00:17:14,567 --> 00:17:16,237
You're gonna be reminded
of it on a weekly,
459
00:17:16,237 --> 00:17:17,406
almost daily basis.
460
00:17:17,406 --> 00:17:18,742
- Daily basis, yeah.
- Right?
461
00:17:18,742 --> 00:17:20,871
We learned to be gracious
and put on a thing.
462
00:17:20,871 --> 00:17:22,457
Of course.
463
00:17:22,457 --> 00:17:24,504
ANDREW: But it's still picking
at whatever it's picking at.
464
00:17:24,504 --> 00:17:25,631
And do people say to you,
465
00:17:25,631 --> 00:17:27,175
"Do you ever see
the old gang anymore?"
466
00:17:27,175 --> 00:17:29,889
Well, the assumption is
that we're all still friends.
467
00:17:29,889 --> 00:17:31,309
That's all you would read
about is,
468
00:17:31,309 --> 00:17:32,812
the Brat Pack went here
and did this.
469
00:17:32,812 --> 00:17:33,939
Yeah.
470
00:17:33,939 --> 00:17:35,442
The Brat Pack
ate a sandwich together.
471
00:17:35,442 --> 00:17:37,780
The Brat Pack
went swimming somewhere.
472
00:17:37,780 --> 00:17:39,158
Yeah.
473
00:17:39,158 --> 00:17:41,162
Are you tight with Molly
and the rest of the guys?
474
00:17:41,162 --> 00:17:43,124
Well, you know
what's really strange
475
00:17:43,124 --> 00:17:45,713
is they sort of assumed
that because we work together,
476
00:17:45,713 --> 00:17:47,215
we would hang out together.
477
00:17:47,215 --> 00:17:49,094
I haven't attended
the latest Brat Pack meeting.
478
00:17:49,094 --> 00:17:50,931
So, I mean, I don't know.
You know?
479
00:17:50,931 --> 00:17:52,142
You guys don't get together
all the time
480
00:17:52,142 --> 00:17:53,687
and make fudge and--
- Make fudge?
481
00:17:53,687 --> 00:17:54,856
Sleepover.
482
00:17:54,856 --> 00:17:56,735
Well, we make cookies
and stuff, yeah.
483
00:17:56,735 --> 00:17:58,112
And do you think there will
ever be a big reunion where
484
00:17:58,112 --> 00:17:59,658
they get-- you guys are all
in your 80s or something,
485
00:17:59,658 --> 00:18:01,243
and they get you guys together,
and you--
486
00:18:01,243 --> 00:18:02,663
It could happen.
You never know.
487
00:18:02,663 --> 00:18:03,957
[laughter]
488
00:18:03,957 --> 00:18:05,377
Well, we'll wait.
489
00:18:05,377 --> 00:18:06,838
We'll look forward to that
60 years from now.
490
00:18:06,838 --> 00:18:08,257
That's gonna be good.
491
00:18:08,257 --> 00:18:09,928
ANDREW:
I find it important somehow
492
00:18:09,928 --> 00:18:13,101
to go and try and connect
with people in the now
493
00:18:13,101 --> 00:18:14,979
seems of value,
and I'm not sure why.
494
00:18:14,979 --> 00:18:16,525
Hmm.
495
00:18:16,525 --> 00:18:19,781
If you could have
the Brat Pack name not exist,
496
00:18:19,781 --> 00:18:23,371
would you?
- Hmm.
497
00:18:26,043 --> 00:18:29,133
That's a different--
I think a difficult question
498
00:18:29,133 --> 00:18:31,805
to answer because it's--
499
00:18:31,805 --> 00:18:34,561
you can only know the known.
500
00:18:34,561 --> 00:18:39,403
And was it something
that we benefited from?
501
00:18:39,403 --> 00:18:40,990
Maybe.
502
00:18:40,990 --> 00:18:44,747
But in the long run,
I think we did not.
503
00:18:44,747 --> 00:18:46,500
I think there was--
504
00:18:46,500 --> 00:18:51,260
I think there was more damage
done by it than good.
505
00:18:51,260 --> 00:18:53,222
I perceived it to be
very harmful career-wise.
506
00:18:53,222 --> 00:18:54,308
Because I didn't think--
507
00:18:54,308 --> 00:18:55,644
Martin Scorsese,
Steven Spielberg
508
00:18:55,644 --> 00:18:56,730
is not gonna call up somebody
509
00:18:56,730 --> 00:18:58,441
who is in the Brat Pack,
you know?
510
00:18:58,441 --> 00:18:59,778
[laughs]
- You're not wrong.
511
00:18:59,778 --> 00:19:01,615
No, you're not wrong.
512
00:19:01,615 --> 00:19:05,246
And it-- I think
it created a perception
513
00:19:05,246 --> 00:19:06,666
that we were lightweights,
514
00:19:06,666 --> 00:19:08,252
that we didn't
take it seriously.
515
00:19:08,252 --> 00:19:09,338
Well, that's what
that article was about.
516
00:19:09,338 --> 00:19:10,591
Yeah.
517
00:19:10,591 --> 00:19:11,968
And what's--
it's just a name. Who cares?
518
00:19:11,968 --> 00:19:13,471
It's just-- what's it matter?
519
00:19:13,471 --> 00:19:14,891
But it did matter,
520
00:19:14,891 --> 00:19:17,772
and it did affect how
I was perceived in the business
521
00:19:17,772 --> 00:19:20,068
certainly, how I was perceived
in the world when people would
522
00:19:20,068 --> 00:19:21,530
stop me on the street,
and how I perceived
523
00:19:21,530 --> 00:19:23,617
myself for many years.
- Oh, yeah.
524
00:19:23,617 --> 00:19:27,875
ANDREW: And to reposition that
or rewrite that history
525
00:19:27,875 --> 00:19:30,839
in some way to turn it
into an asset as opposed
526
00:19:30,839 --> 00:19:33,720
to something that's just
still dragging around, to me,
527
00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,308
is a-- you know,
before my dad died,
528
00:19:36,308 --> 00:19:37,477
I went to him.
529
00:19:37,477 --> 00:19:39,106
We did not get along
for my adult life.
530
00:19:39,106 --> 00:19:40,609
Right.
531
00:19:40,609 --> 00:19:42,404
ANDREW: And I went to him
as he was dying.
532
00:19:42,404 --> 00:19:43,949
And I can't say
we cleaned up our past,
533
00:19:43,949 --> 00:19:45,536
but we just put it down,
534
00:19:45,536 --> 00:19:49,126
and there was something
that was so meaningful to me
535
00:19:49,126 --> 00:19:50,420
about just--
536
00:19:50,420 --> 00:19:51,506
I'm here with you,
you're dying.
537
00:19:51,506 --> 00:19:53,259
He's my dad, and I loved him.
538
00:19:53,259 --> 00:19:55,890
So to get back to that
was a beautiful thing,
539
00:19:55,890 --> 00:19:57,685
and I'm not saying
this is on that scale at all,
540
00:19:57,685 --> 00:19:59,564
but it still-- it is something.
541
00:19:59,564 --> 00:20:02,737
It doesn't have any power
anymore except what we give it.
542
00:20:02,737 --> 00:20:04,574
What we give it, yeah.
ANDREW: You know?
543
00:20:04,574 --> 00:20:06,911
Yeah. Yeah,
like any of our demons, right?
544
00:20:06,911 --> 00:20:08,414
ANDREW: Like anything, right?
545
00:20:08,414 --> 00:20:10,251
And so-- and why
should that be a demon?
546
00:20:10,251 --> 00:20:12,339
And I know anything else
about emotional things,
547
00:20:12,339 --> 00:20:14,051
the more we just sort of
push them aside,
548
00:20:14,051 --> 00:20:15,554
they're not going any--
they're still there.
549
00:20:15,554 --> 00:20:17,140
They're still-- you're
still gonna react to them.
550
00:20:17,140 --> 00:20:19,102
I don't want to be
reacting to it anymore.
551
00:20:19,102 --> 00:20:21,023
You know what I mean?
- Right.
552
00:20:21,023 --> 00:20:23,235
And so to see you,
for me, is a beautiful thing.
553
00:20:23,235 --> 00:20:24,864
I just want to go, "Ah."
You know?
554
00:20:24,864 --> 00:20:28,538
I always thought
we'd be friends forever.
555
00:20:28,538 --> 00:20:33,047
Yeah, well, forever got a lot
shorter suddenly, didn't it?
556
00:20:37,472 --> 00:20:40,646
[bright orchestral music]
557
00:20:40,646 --> 00:20:46,783
♪ ♪
558
00:20:46,783 --> 00:20:48,202
ANDREW: Will you look
through that camera
559
00:20:48,202 --> 00:20:49,246
and see if my head's
chopped off
560
00:20:49,246 --> 00:20:50,666
between those two lines?
561
00:20:50,666 --> 00:20:52,460
ALLY: It's a little--
the white line is going right
562
00:20:52,460 --> 00:20:54,214
across the top of your hair.
- OK, all right.
563
00:20:54,214 --> 00:20:55,759
I got it.
Have a seat back down.
564
00:20:55,759 --> 00:20:57,596
ALLY: You need to just--
it's, like, a smidgen.
565
00:20:57,596 --> 00:20:59,099
ANDREW: I got it.
ALLY: What is that?
566
00:20:59,099 --> 00:21:00,476
Oh, that's a two shot?
What is that?
567
00:21:00,476 --> 00:21:01,938
ANDREW: That's my iPhone.
- I know.
568
00:21:01,938 --> 00:21:04,736
But what are you filming on it?
- You and your couch.
569
00:21:04,736 --> 00:21:06,363
- Oh, it's another angle.
- It's another angle.
570
00:21:06,363 --> 00:21:09,411
Oh, OK.
ANDREW: I have a memory.
571
00:21:09,411 --> 00:21:11,833
You drove me home
from I don't know where.
572
00:21:11,833 --> 00:21:14,296
I seem to think it was
a rehearsal of the movie
573
00:21:14,296 --> 00:21:15,758
when we were doing
St. Elmo's Fire,
574
00:21:15,758 --> 00:21:17,553
when we rehearsed for those
few days on that soundstage.
575
00:21:17,553 --> 00:21:20,684
But you were just driving me
home to my hotel,
576
00:21:20,684 --> 00:21:22,980
and I was staying at, like,
the Sunset Marquis, I think.
577
00:21:22,980 --> 00:21:24,399
ALLY: Yes, yes.
578
00:21:24,399 --> 00:21:26,529
And it's one of the happiest
memories of my life.
579
00:21:26,529 --> 00:21:28,533
- Really?
- There was something about it.
580
00:21:28,533 --> 00:21:31,079
We were-- there was no reason.
Nothing happened.
581
00:21:31,079 --> 00:21:33,502
We were just being friendly,
and laughing, and just driving,
582
00:21:33,502 --> 00:21:35,881
and you were driving me home.
583
00:21:35,881 --> 00:21:38,010
And-- but there was something
about being young
584
00:21:38,010 --> 00:21:40,933
and life was just happening.
ALLY: Yeah.
585
00:21:40,933 --> 00:21:42,227
It was thrilling.
586
00:21:42,227 --> 00:21:44,147
And the top was down
on your Jeep.
587
00:21:44,147 --> 00:21:46,861
And it was like a scene out
of St. Elmo's Fire, frankly.
588
00:21:46,861 --> 00:21:48,824
And it was just so--
589
00:21:48,824 --> 00:21:50,243
all these years,
it's stayed with me.
590
00:21:50,243 --> 00:21:53,290
It's this wondrous experience
of youth and the moment.
591
00:21:53,290 --> 00:21:56,631
And I was aware in the moment
of how happy I was,
592
00:21:56,631 --> 00:21:58,510
and that hasn't always been
my experience with life.
593
00:21:58,510 --> 00:22:00,179
Yeah, that was when
I had that thought,
594
00:22:00,179 --> 00:22:01,599
wow, I really actually--
595
00:22:01,599 --> 00:22:03,310
I finally belong somewhere,
596
00:22:03,310 --> 00:22:05,189
and I have friends.
597
00:22:05,189 --> 00:22:08,738
What do you think about our
relationship as an outsider?
598
00:22:08,738 --> 00:22:11,578
I want you to be honest.
Really.
599
00:22:11,578 --> 00:22:13,665
KEVIN:
You want me to be honest?
600
00:22:13,665 --> 00:22:15,544
I think I hang around
you guys so much
601
00:22:15,544 --> 00:22:19,802
personally because, well,
602
00:22:19,802 --> 00:22:22,766
you're all I think about.
603
00:22:24,352 --> 00:22:25,981
Me?
604
00:22:25,981 --> 00:22:31,116
And I am desperately,
completely in love with you.
605
00:22:31,116 --> 00:22:33,078
[laughs]
606
00:22:33,078 --> 00:22:35,207
[soft dramatic music]
607
00:22:35,207 --> 00:22:37,462
Ooh.
608
00:22:37,462 --> 00:22:39,675
I had a crush on you
back in the day.
609
00:22:39,675 --> 00:22:42,973
You did not, Andrew.
No, you did not. No.
610
00:22:42,973 --> 00:22:44,977
I was so scared that
I was busy being so aloof.
611
00:22:44,977 --> 00:22:46,396
- Yes, you were aloof.
- Yeah.
612
00:22:46,396 --> 00:22:47,942
You were aloof.
613
00:22:47,942 --> 00:22:49,528
ANDREW: You said something
to me on the phone,
614
00:22:49,528 --> 00:22:52,242
that The Breakfast Club was
a gift that keeps on giving.
615
00:22:52,242 --> 00:22:53,870
Can you talk about that?
616
00:22:53,870 --> 00:22:55,414
The Breakfast Club is
the gift that keeps on giving.
617
00:22:55,414 --> 00:22:57,795
ANDREW: What does that mean?
- It's just--
618
00:22:57,795 --> 00:23:02,387
I was really, really happy
that entire experience.
619
00:23:02,387 --> 00:23:04,057
I can write with my toes.
620
00:23:05,059 --> 00:23:08,525
I can also eat,
brush my teeth--
621
00:23:08,525 --> 00:23:10,529
With your feet?
622
00:23:10,529 --> 00:23:12,574
There's a lot of me
in Allison.
623
00:23:12,574 --> 00:23:14,578
The feelings,
and the fears and things
624
00:23:14,578 --> 00:23:17,000
that she's going through, I--
625
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:21,258
I know that they were coming
right straight from me.
626
00:23:21,258 --> 00:23:24,472
So in high school,
I did not have
627
00:23:24,472 --> 00:23:27,938
many close friends.
I didn't fit in.
628
00:23:27,938 --> 00:23:29,567
I was really lonely.
629
00:23:29,567 --> 00:23:31,278
I couldn't wait
to get out of New York,
630
00:23:31,278 --> 00:23:33,783
and just go to California,
and get my acting career
631
00:23:33,783 --> 00:23:35,244
happening.
That was the plan.
632
00:23:35,244 --> 00:23:38,000
So when Allison came along
in The Breakfast Club,
633
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,922
I felt like, ah, that's it.
634
00:23:40,922 --> 00:23:43,511
This-- and I wanted to--
and John Hughes
635
00:23:43,511 --> 00:23:44,889
was great about this.
636
00:23:44,889 --> 00:23:46,768
I wanted her to look
on the outside the way
637
00:23:46,768 --> 00:23:49,355
I always felt on the inside
during high school.
638
00:23:49,355 --> 00:23:50,901
So he let me do that.
639
00:23:50,901 --> 00:23:52,195
Go away.
640
00:23:53,615 --> 00:23:56,161
- Where do you want me to go?
- Go away.
641
00:23:59,375 --> 00:24:04,010
It still astonishes me
how many people
642
00:24:04,010 --> 00:24:06,431
found themselves in that film,
643
00:24:06,431 --> 00:24:09,270
are moved by that film,
enjoyed the film,
644
00:24:09,270 --> 00:24:10,774
remember that film fondly.
645
00:24:10,774 --> 00:24:12,861
And yes, it is really tied up
646
00:24:12,861 --> 00:24:17,328
in their
high school experience.
647
00:24:17,328 --> 00:24:19,207
It's become a rite
of passage for teenagers
648
00:24:19,207 --> 00:24:21,461
to see these movies.
It's become an adolescent rite.
649
00:24:21,461 --> 00:24:23,048
You read Catcher in the Rye.
650
00:24:23,048 --> 00:24:24,092
You watch The Breakfast Club.
ALLY: Right.
651
00:24:24,092 --> 00:24:25,302
You know what I mean?
652
00:24:25,302 --> 00:24:26,931
And that's just
kind of amazing.
653
00:24:26,931 --> 00:24:28,350
I mean, that was before--
right before,
654
00:24:28,350 --> 00:24:30,605
I think, the article came out.
655
00:24:30,605 --> 00:24:32,191
And then, of course,
the article just changes...
656
00:24:32,191 --> 00:24:33,570
ALLY: Right.
657
00:24:33,570 --> 00:24:35,030
Everything.
ALLY: Right.
658
00:24:35,030 --> 00:24:36,491
Yeah.
659
00:24:36,491 --> 00:24:38,287
And then all that stopped
in a sense, in a very real way.
660
00:24:38,287 --> 00:24:40,207
Right?
- Yeah. It all stopped.
661
00:24:40,207 --> 00:24:42,378
And it-- we kept working.
662
00:24:42,378 --> 00:24:43,463
Everybody kept working,
663
00:24:43,463 --> 00:24:45,719
but there was this feeling of--
664
00:24:45,719 --> 00:24:49,643
it was just sort of like
being shell-shocked.
665
00:24:49,643 --> 00:24:51,271
These young people were
all doing the same thing
666
00:24:51,271 --> 00:24:52,691
at the same time,
and it's thrilling,
667
00:24:52,691 --> 00:24:54,612
and it's exciting,
and wow.
668
00:24:54,612 --> 00:24:56,114
And then--
669
00:24:56,114 --> 00:24:59,204
What do we do now, you know?
Now what?
670
00:24:59,204 --> 00:25:02,878
I started feeling the kind of
weird vibe in the room
671
00:25:02,878 --> 00:25:06,802
if I went in to meet somebody
or audition for something--
672
00:25:06,802 --> 00:25:08,347
just a weirdness.
673
00:25:08,347 --> 00:25:10,602
Oh, yeah.
I felt that.
674
00:25:10,602 --> 00:25:12,856
We worry that
you're gonna be spoiled.
675
00:25:12,856 --> 00:25:15,402
We worry that you're
getting too much too soon.
676
00:25:15,402 --> 00:25:18,743
And now, you know,
the circle turned around.
677
00:25:18,743 --> 00:25:21,999
And now, everybody has to--
678
00:25:21,999 --> 00:25:24,838
I don't know-- pay the price,
pay the piper or something.
679
00:25:24,838 --> 00:25:27,134
You know?
- I do.
680
00:25:27,134 --> 00:25:29,013
I very much felt like that.
681
00:25:29,013 --> 00:25:30,809
And I felt there was a certain
glee in that the wheel turned,
682
00:25:30,809 --> 00:25:33,063
and you're now under.
- OK, glee.
683
00:25:33,063 --> 00:25:34,232
There was a glee feeling.
Yeah.
684
00:25:34,232 --> 00:25:35,568
There was--
685
00:25:35,568 --> 00:25:36,862
I mean, that's not
the word I would have used,
686
00:25:36,862 --> 00:25:38,658
but that that strikes me--
yeah, schadenfreude.
687
00:25:38,658 --> 00:25:40,494
Schadenfreude.
688
00:25:40,494 --> 00:25:43,125
Yeah, I'd say that too.
- It was trite--
689
00:25:43,125 --> 00:25:45,755
something very trite
about the Brat Pack.
690
00:25:45,755 --> 00:25:47,049
It felt like
it was just like,
691
00:25:47,049 --> 00:25:49,178
let's just write off
everybody's lives
692
00:25:49,178 --> 00:25:52,018
and their experiences
and their work.
693
00:25:52,018 --> 00:25:53,730
Let's just-- you know,
it's just getting
694
00:25:53,730 --> 00:25:55,065
all sort of written off.
695
00:25:55,065 --> 00:25:57,696
It felt 100% like that.
696
00:25:57,696 --> 00:25:59,867
I, in 35 years,
697
00:25:59,867 --> 00:26:01,286
have never talked
to anybody about it.
698
00:26:01,286 --> 00:26:04,543
So to hear you articulate
exactly what my experience was,
699
00:26:04,543 --> 00:26:06,672
exactly what I know
Emilio was experiencing,
700
00:26:06,672 --> 00:26:09,636
you know--
exactly the same.
701
00:26:09,636 --> 00:26:11,348
And so to like--
ALLY: Yeah.
702
00:26:11,348 --> 00:26:14,980
Yeah.
ALLY: Yeah.
703
00:26:17,151 --> 00:26:20,992
When you grow up,
your heart dies.
704
00:26:20,992 --> 00:26:22,370
Who cares?
705
00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:25,960
I care.
706
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,549
When that article came out,
I recall being
707
00:26:28,549 --> 00:26:30,010
really taken aback by it.
708
00:26:30,010 --> 00:26:31,972
Because there had been
so much excitement
709
00:26:31,972 --> 00:26:35,563
about all of the young actors
that were showing up.
710
00:26:35,563 --> 00:26:37,483
Because there was
this startling group of
711
00:26:37,483 --> 00:26:39,153
really talented young people,
712
00:26:39,153 --> 00:26:40,782
and that was the first time
that it felt like
713
00:26:40,782 --> 00:26:42,911
that had curdled,
that people were going,
714
00:26:42,911 --> 00:26:45,332
"You know what? They need
to be knocked down a peg."
715
00:26:45,332 --> 00:26:48,088
And I also felt a little weird
because there was
716
00:26:48,088 --> 00:26:52,179
some sort of effort because
Pretty in Pink came out to--
717
00:26:52,179 --> 00:26:53,850
it was like,
you have to decide.
718
00:26:53,850 --> 00:26:55,269
Are you part of that or not?
719
00:26:55,269 --> 00:26:57,649
Blane?
His name is Blane?
720
00:26:57,649 --> 00:27:01,114
Oh, that's a major appliance.
That's not a name.
721
00:27:01,114 --> 00:27:02,576
Just because
I'm going out with Blane
722
00:27:02,576 --> 00:27:04,705
doesn't mean I can't
be friends with you.
723
00:27:04,705 --> 00:27:06,499
Writers are addicted
to narrative.
724
00:27:06,499 --> 00:27:09,882
Brat Pack allowed a new
narrative to take shape.
725
00:27:09,882 --> 00:27:11,594
You know, these kids have
the world on a string
726
00:27:11,594 --> 00:27:14,015
because they've got this
enormous amount of talent
727
00:27:14,015 --> 00:27:15,894
at a time when the industry
is really ready
728
00:27:15,894 --> 00:27:17,438
to tell great stories
about teenagers,
729
00:27:17,438 --> 00:27:19,484
and let's fuck
with that a little.
730
00:27:19,484 --> 00:27:21,404
It felt like water
had been thrown on all of you,
731
00:27:21,404 --> 00:27:24,410
and you had to walk into a room
more apologetically
732
00:27:24,410 --> 00:27:28,043
for having been part
of that dynamic.
733
00:27:28,043 --> 00:27:29,420
You guys were it.
734
00:27:29,420 --> 00:27:31,634
You would have walked in
with a different swagger
735
00:27:31,634 --> 00:27:33,220
before that article.
736
00:27:33,220 --> 00:27:37,687
And then they were free
to have their kind of judgment.
737
00:27:37,687 --> 00:27:40,317
The resentment could then morph
into, see, we knew.
738
00:27:40,317 --> 00:27:41,737
We know what you guys are.
739
00:27:41,737 --> 00:27:42,906
Which you guys
weren't at all.
740
00:27:42,906 --> 00:27:46,287
You were young,
vulnerable, excited,
741
00:27:46,287 --> 00:27:50,713
proud-of-your-work actors
who literally got the rug
742
00:27:50,713 --> 00:27:52,132
taken out from underneath them.
743
00:27:52,132 --> 00:27:53,636
It was condescending.
744
00:27:53,636 --> 00:27:55,723
And I don't think
anybody had thought
745
00:27:55,723 --> 00:27:58,854
of all you wonderful actors
in that way
746
00:27:58,854 --> 00:28:01,025
until he coined that phrase.
747
00:28:01,025 --> 00:28:03,864
And I could see you
walking around with a lot of--
748
00:28:03,864 --> 00:28:05,994
not specifically you,
but I can see a person
749
00:28:05,994 --> 00:28:08,541
walking around with a lot
of resentment from that.
750
00:28:08,541 --> 00:28:15,012
I was, you know, mad for you
about that reductive wording.
751
00:28:15,012 --> 00:28:17,350
I thought it was rude.
I was very protective.
752
00:28:19,396 --> 00:28:23,069
[bright orchestral music]
753
00:28:23,069 --> 00:28:27,621
All right,
we are Upstate New York here,
754
00:28:27,621 --> 00:28:30,918
far from the madding crowd.
[laughs]
755
00:28:30,918 --> 00:28:33,883
And we're hunting down
Malcolm Gladwell,
756
00:28:33,883 --> 00:28:36,680
who I am hoping can give me
757
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:42,232
some insight into
how the Brat Pack label
758
00:28:42,232 --> 00:28:44,780
caught fire like it did,
and caught the zeitgeist,
759
00:28:44,780 --> 00:28:46,282
and took hold.
760
00:28:46,282 --> 00:28:49,288
I mean, this is right up
his area of expertise,
761
00:28:49,288 --> 00:28:51,543
this kind of social science,
762
00:28:51,543 --> 00:28:56,219
and I'm hoping he can
illuminate this for me.
763
00:28:57,555 --> 00:28:59,851
MALCOLM: But the Brat Pack
is signifying
764
00:28:59,851 --> 00:29:03,943
that a generational transition
is happening in Hollywood,
765
00:29:03,943 --> 00:29:05,530
and we're gonna call it this.
766
00:29:05,530 --> 00:29:09,746
The explicit reference to the--
the pun on the Rat Pack
767
00:29:09,746 --> 00:29:11,625
is obviously huge.
768
00:29:11,625 --> 00:29:12,919
So it's no longer a term.
769
00:29:12,919 --> 00:29:14,463
It's a metaphor, right?
770
00:29:14,463 --> 00:29:18,012
Whenever a term makes that
journey to metaphor status,
771
00:29:18,012 --> 00:29:19,766
it has a chance
to kind of endure.
772
00:29:19,766 --> 00:29:23,022
And, you know, it's also funny.
773
00:29:23,022 --> 00:29:25,611
The Rat Pack and the
Brat Pack in sensibility
774
00:29:25,611 --> 00:29:27,281
are polar opposites, right?
775
00:29:27,281 --> 00:29:31,205
One is anxious,
and immature, and trying
776
00:29:31,205 --> 00:29:32,458
really, really, really hard
to figure out
777
00:29:32,458 --> 00:29:33,794
their place in the world,
778
00:29:33,794 --> 00:29:35,213
and the other group
doesn't give a fuck,
779
00:29:35,213 --> 00:29:37,134
But that's sort of part
of why it's funny, right?
780
00:29:37,134 --> 00:29:38,596
It's--
- We didn't find it funny.
781
00:29:38,596 --> 00:29:40,265
No, I can imagine.
It was funny for--
782
00:29:40,265 --> 00:29:41,434
not funny.
783
00:29:41,434 --> 00:29:43,229
Not "ha ha" funny,
but funny in the way
784
00:29:43,229 --> 00:29:45,192
that sticks in your mind.
785
00:29:45,192 --> 00:29:47,781
Phrases endure when
they have a kind of cleverness,
786
00:29:47,781 --> 00:29:49,659
like it's quoting
"Rat Pack," and when
787
00:29:49,659 --> 00:29:53,082
they have some truth to them.
This has truth.
788
00:29:53,082 --> 00:29:55,003
It is.
If it was just--
789
00:29:55,003 --> 00:29:56,799
if you were doing it about,
like,
790
00:29:56,799 --> 00:30:00,598
three rando actors today
who were in some indie movie,
791
00:30:00,598 --> 00:30:02,351
it wouldn't work
because it's not true
792
00:30:02,351 --> 00:30:04,104
that there's
a generational transition
793
00:30:04,104 --> 00:30:06,150
going on in Hollywood,
but there was then, right?
794
00:30:06,150 --> 00:30:07,987
There was a big
transition happening.
795
00:30:07,987 --> 00:30:09,490
ANDREW: Yeah.
796
00:30:09,490 --> 00:30:11,578
I mean, it is when
youth movies took over.
797
00:30:11,578 --> 00:30:14,668
At the time,
I was tremendously invested
798
00:30:14,668 --> 00:30:17,339
in the pop culture
that was aimed at me.
799
00:30:17,339 --> 00:30:18,551
ANDREW:
That's how we communicate,
800
00:30:18,551 --> 00:30:19,761
and how we identify,
and how people talk
801
00:30:19,761 --> 00:30:21,723
to each other
when we're in our 20s
802
00:30:21,723 --> 00:30:23,309
is through that, really.
803
00:30:23,309 --> 00:30:25,146
It's the easiest, quickest
shorthand to communication,
804
00:30:25,146 --> 00:30:26,357
isn't it?
- Yeah.
805
00:30:26,357 --> 00:30:27,819
Oh, did you see that, dude?
You know.
806
00:30:27,819 --> 00:30:30,867
Well, and possible then
in a way it's not possible now.
807
00:30:30,867 --> 00:30:32,704
So nothing like that
can happen anymore.
808
00:30:32,704 --> 00:30:34,498
You can't have a cultural
touchstone that everyone
809
00:30:34,498 --> 00:30:36,002
in their 20s can refer to.
810
00:30:36,002 --> 00:30:39,759
If you gathered
100 17-year-olds at random
811
00:30:39,759 --> 00:30:43,559
in America in 1986,
90 would have seen
812
00:30:43,559 --> 00:30:46,272
or at least be conversant
about Pretty in Pink.
813
00:30:46,272 --> 00:30:47,734
No question.
814
00:30:47,734 --> 00:30:49,069
They wouldn't even have had
to see it to be able
815
00:30:49,069 --> 00:30:50,322
to hold a conversation
about it.
816
00:30:50,322 --> 00:30:51,575
Right.
817
00:30:51,575 --> 00:30:54,496
There is absolutely
no cultural phenomenon
818
00:30:54,496 --> 00:30:56,710
at the present time
of which that can be said--
819
00:30:56,710 --> 00:30:58,881
impossible.
- Why?
820
00:30:58,881 --> 00:31:00,843
Well, because things
have been fractured.
821
00:31:00,843 --> 00:31:04,350
We've gone from a relatively
unified youth culture
822
00:31:04,350 --> 00:31:08,024
to a youth culture that
looks like every other aspect
823
00:31:08,024 --> 00:31:10,738
of American society,
which is everything's
824
00:31:10,738 --> 00:31:14,078
all over the place.
There's no common denominator.
825
00:31:14,078 --> 00:31:17,417
I was 13 the first time
I saw Breakfast Club on VHS,
826
00:31:17,417 --> 00:31:18,712
and I remember watching it.
827
00:31:18,712 --> 00:31:20,633
It was this--
around eighth grade--
828
00:31:20,633 --> 00:31:22,177
and thinking
I had never seen anything
829
00:31:22,177 --> 00:31:24,891
that was so like my life.
830
00:31:24,891 --> 00:31:27,772
You know, movies were
about grown-up things,
831
00:31:27,772 --> 00:31:29,274
either serious
grown-up things
832
00:31:29,274 --> 00:31:30,820
or silly, funny
grown-up things.
833
00:31:30,820 --> 00:31:32,824
I couldn't believe that
here was The Breakfast Club.
834
00:31:32,824 --> 00:31:35,161
Here was a movie
about the exact things
835
00:31:35,161 --> 00:31:37,834
that I was concerned with
at that moment in my life.
836
00:31:37,834 --> 00:31:40,923
This was pre-Facebook,
pre having a sense
837
00:31:40,923 --> 00:31:42,552
of kind of what
everyone around the country
838
00:31:42,552 --> 00:31:45,265
was feeling until
I literally got to college
839
00:31:45,265 --> 00:31:47,729
and met kids my age from
all over the place
840
00:31:47,729 --> 00:31:50,651
who knew and loved
all of these movies.
841
00:31:50,651 --> 00:31:52,739
IRA:
That was before social media.
842
00:31:52,739 --> 00:31:56,162
If you were a teenager
living anywhere in the world,
843
00:31:56,162 --> 00:31:57,874
and you're watching
The Breakfast Club,
844
00:31:57,874 --> 00:32:02,382
you're watching Pretty in Pink,
you are imagining a world
845
00:32:02,382 --> 00:32:04,011
that you're not a part of.
846
00:32:04,011 --> 00:32:07,643
For a teenager now,
they can see that world
847
00:32:07,643 --> 00:32:09,188
by opening up their phone.
848
00:32:09,188 --> 00:32:12,737
This was this moment where
it seemed so surprising
849
00:32:12,737 --> 00:32:14,908
to have a movie
like The Breakfast Club,
850
00:32:14,908 --> 00:32:17,622
which is really just
basically a therapy jam
851
00:32:17,622 --> 00:32:19,166
for about
an hour and a half,
852
00:32:19,166 --> 00:32:20,669
if you really want
to break it down.
853
00:32:20,669 --> 00:32:22,507
It was just so powerful.
854
00:32:22,507 --> 00:32:25,220
I mean,
we're all pretty bizarre.
855
00:32:25,220 --> 00:32:26,640
Some of us are just better
at hiding it.
856
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:28,017
That's all.
857
00:32:28,017 --> 00:32:30,188
BRET: I think ensembles
had something to do with it.
858
00:32:30,188 --> 00:32:35,156
A group study is always
very enticing to audiences.
859
00:32:35,156 --> 00:32:37,160
And a group study
of these people
860
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,373
in this particular moment
in 1985
861
00:32:39,373 --> 00:32:41,335
was kind of like catnip.
862
00:32:41,335 --> 00:32:43,966
These are considered
the golden age
863
00:32:43,966 --> 00:32:46,053
of youth cinema, these movies.
864
00:32:46,053 --> 00:32:48,976
I mean, The Breakfast Club is
in the Criterion Collection.
865
00:32:48,976 --> 00:32:50,311
BRET: I remember seeing it
the first weekend
866
00:32:50,311 --> 00:32:52,692
it came out, really not
knowing what to expect,
867
00:32:52,692 --> 00:32:54,111
and I was very affected by it.
868
00:32:54,111 --> 00:32:55,446
I was very affected
by how seriously
869
00:32:55,446 --> 00:32:56,825
they took these kids.
870
00:32:56,825 --> 00:32:59,288
I was very moved
by their ultimate plights.
871
00:32:59,288 --> 00:33:03,797
Growing up in the '80s,
it felt very aspirational.
872
00:33:03,797 --> 00:33:06,218
And yet,
most of those movies also
873
00:33:06,218 --> 00:33:09,851
felt very realistic
in that they took
874
00:33:09,851 --> 00:33:12,899
young people's
lives seriously.
875
00:33:12,899 --> 00:33:16,113
SUSANNAH: We used these films
as kind of a prism
876
00:33:16,113 --> 00:33:18,451
through which
to look at our lives.
877
00:33:18,451 --> 00:33:21,583
We would talk about
people in our lives
878
00:33:21,583 --> 00:33:23,085
in terms of the characters
from the movies.
879
00:33:23,085 --> 00:33:24,547
You know, he's such a Blane,
he's such a Duckie,
880
00:33:24,547 --> 00:33:26,509
he's such a Bender,
whatever it was.
881
00:33:26,509 --> 00:33:27,845
Still to this day,
people would come up to me
882
00:33:27,845 --> 00:33:29,974
and go, "I was team Duckie."
- I was team Duckie.
883
00:33:29,974 --> 00:33:31,895
- You were, really?
- Of course.
884
00:33:31,895 --> 00:33:33,565
What do you mean "of course"?
885
00:33:33,565 --> 00:33:36,738
My idealized sense
of what my role was
886
00:33:36,738 --> 00:33:38,700
in my high school was Duckie.
887
00:33:38,700 --> 00:33:39,911
I wasn't actually that,
but that's
888
00:33:39,911 --> 00:33:41,748
what I would have liked to be.
889
00:33:41,748 --> 00:33:45,171
And I'm gonna use that
to build my own identity.
890
00:33:45,171 --> 00:33:47,969
So when I'm watching
the Duck Man,
891
00:33:47,969 --> 00:33:51,016
there are things in him
that I would like to acquire.
892
00:33:51,016 --> 00:33:53,437
So when you look back
20 years later,
893
00:33:53,437 --> 00:33:55,275
you do see yourself
in the movie.
894
00:33:55,275 --> 00:33:56,653
Yeah.
895
00:33:56,653 --> 00:33:58,114
But you've forgotten
that you acquired--
896
00:33:58,114 --> 00:34:00,619
- You took it from there.
- You took it from the movie.
897
00:34:00,619 --> 00:34:02,540
IRA: I connected
to Molly Ringwald a lot.
898
00:34:02,540 --> 00:34:05,086
I connected to characters
like her's that sort of felt
899
00:34:05,086 --> 00:34:08,635
like they weren't being
listened to by adults,
900
00:34:08,635 --> 00:34:11,766
didn't feel like they fit in.
901
00:34:11,766 --> 00:34:15,691
INTERVIEWER: Have you ever had
any of those insecure feelings?
902
00:34:15,691 --> 00:34:17,737
All the time.
All the time.
903
00:34:17,737 --> 00:34:20,534
I'm always doubting myself,
which is OK.
904
00:34:20,534 --> 00:34:21,953
I mean, I have a certain amount
of confidence,
905
00:34:21,953 --> 00:34:24,041
but I also have--
it kind of balances out
906
00:34:24,041 --> 00:34:25,711
with all my insecurities.
907
00:34:25,711 --> 00:34:28,424
There was this feeling that
there were these young people
908
00:34:28,424 --> 00:34:33,142
who were in different kinds
of movies exploring
909
00:34:33,142 --> 00:34:34,604
what it means to be young.
910
00:34:34,604 --> 00:34:39,029
And it's just so powerful
to see my own feelings,
911
00:34:39,029 --> 00:34:42,578
my inchoate feelings about
what it means to be young
912
00:34:42,578 --> 00:34:44,665
and a teenager
and having my own troubles
913
00:34:44,665 --> 00:34:47,128
and seeing it reflected
in the screen.
914
00:34:47,128 --> 00:34:48,757
That was extremely powerful.
915
00:34:48,757 --> 00:34:51,178
When these movies came out,
the parents were
916
00:34:51,178 --> 00:34:53,809
really pushed to the back.
917
00:34:53,809 --> 00:34:56,564
We were seeing friendship
being treated in the same
918
00:34:56,564 --> 00:35:00,488
kind of heady, exciting,
sweeping, cinematic way
919
00:35:00,488 --> 00:35:04,705
that normally had just been
reserved for romantic love.
920
00:35:04,705 --> 00:35:06,835
Everybody,
but especially young people,
921
00:35:06,835 --> 00:35:08,421
so want to connect
922
00:35:08,421 --> 00:35:11,427
and so want that group
of close, tight-knit friends.
923
00:35:11,427 --> 00:35:14,934
And to see on screen something
that represents that dream,
924
00:35:14,934 --> 00:35:17,313
it's such a powerful feeling.
925
00:35:17,313 --> 00:35:19,234
This was when malls
were becoming huge.
926
00:35:19,234 --> 00:35:22,825
Malls are a very natural place
for teenagers to go.
927
00:35:22,825 --> 00:35:23,994
And they'd see movies
with their friends
928
00:35:23,994 --> 00:35:26,081
over, and over,
and over again.
929
00:35:26,081 --> 00:35:28,670
BRET: The effort that we put
getting a ticket for a show
930
00:35:28,670 --> 00:35:30,131
that starts two hours later,
and you got to get
931
00:35:30,131 --> 00:35:32,260
into the line because
there's no advanced seating.
932
00:35:32,260 --> 00:35:34,014
You were investing
in something.
933
00:35:34,014 --> 00:35:36,101
It wasn't just
flipping on Spotify
934
00:35:36,101 --> 00:35:39,357
or watching a movie
over four nights on Netflix.
935
00:35:39,357 --> 00:35:41,696
That moment--
as a young person,
936
00:35:41,696 --> 00:35:44,201
you're like this sponge
taking in everything
937
00:35:44,201 --> 00:35:45,746
and reacting to everything.
938
00:35:45,746 --> 00:35:48,627
And you're so much
more interested
939
00:35:48,627 --> 00:35:51,841
and invested in a way
that you're not at 42.
940
00:35:51,841 --> 00:35:54,639
LEA: I think we were in a very
unique period in history.
941
00:35:54,639 --> 00:35:56,266
And I boil it down to this.
942
00:35:56,266 --> 00:35:58,813
It was the first time
you could hold a movie,
943
00:35:58,813 --> 00:36:00,901
and you could buy it,
944
00:36:00,901 --> 00:36:02,696
and you could put it
in your thing
945
00:36:02,696 --> 00:36:04,575
and play it
over and over again,
946
00:36:04,575 --> 00:36:08,374
and it was
a very small part of time.
947
00:36:08,374 --> 00:36:12,550
Our first television set.
Dad just picked it up today.
948
00:36:12,550 --> 00:36:14,720
Do you have a television?
949
00:36:14,720 --> 00:36:17,852
Well, yeah.
You know, we have two of them.
950
00:36:17,852 --> 00:36:20,607
Wow.
You must be rich.
951
00:36:20,607 --> 00:36:22,318
Oh, honey, he's teasing you.
952
00:36:22,318 --> 00:36:24,782
Nobody has two television sets.
953
00:36:24,782 --> 00:36:26,118
[laughs]
954
00:36:26,118 --> 00:36:27,538
ANDREW: Yeah, we were
the first generation
955
00:36:27,538 --> 00:36:28,873
where that was happening.
- Yeah.
956
00:36:28,873 --> 00:36:30,711
ANDREW: And who was renting
movies but young people?
957
00:36:30,711 --> 00:36:32,631
And what movies were they
watching but those movies?
958
00:36:32,631 --> 00:36:34,342
And they could watch us
in their basement.
959
00:36:34,342 --> 00:36:36,806
Over and over.
And it's not like that now.
960
00:36:36,806 --> 00:36:38,560
Nobody owns movies.
No--
961
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,064
you know, it was the same thing
with albums and album covers.
962
00:36:41,064 --> 00:36:42,610
You could look at the album,
and you could look
963
00:36:42,610 --> 00:36:43,987
at the cover,
and you could put it in,
964
00:36:43,987 --> 00:36:46,074
and you could play it.
It meant something more.
965
00:36:46,074 --> 00:36:47,452
It was physical.
966
00:36:47,452 --> 00:36:48,872
[static hums]
967
00:36:48,872 --> 00:36:50,876
[John Parr's "St. Elmo's
Fire (Man In Motion)"
968
00:36:50,876 --> 00:36:52,921
[cheers and applause]
969
00:36:52,921 --> 00:36:54,090
Do you guys know this song?
970
00:36:54,090 --> 00:36:55,761
Or you're all too young
for this song?
971
00:36:55,761 --> 00:36:57,890
JOHN: ♪ Growin' up ♪
972
00:36:57,890 --> 00:37:02,106
♪ You don't see
the writing on the wall ♪
973
00:37:02,106 --> 00:37:03,359
ANDREW:
The music video,
974
00:37:03,359 --> 00:37:04,570
we had to all
go be a part of it.
975
00:37:04,570 --> 00:37:06,406
It was like, oh, my God,
this is so
976
00:37:06,406 --> 00:37:08,620
of that instant in time.
977
00:37:08,620 --> 00:37:10,247
And so it really does
bring back
978
00:37:10,247 --> 00:37:14,297
such specific memories
to me of, like--
979
00:37:14,297 --> 00:37:16,009
♪ I can hear
the music playing ♪
980
00:37:16,009 --> 00:37:18,180
♪ I can see the banners fly ♪
981
00:37:18,180 --> 00:37:20,309
♪ Feel like you're back again ♪
982
00:37:20,309 --> 00:37:22,438
♪ And hope riding high ♪
983
00:37:22,438 --> 00:37:24,860
♪ Gonna be your man in motion ♪
984
00:37:24,860 --> 00:37:26,948
♪ All I need is
these pair of wheels ♪
985
00:37:26,948 --> 00:37:28,868
♪ Take me where
my future's lying ♪
986
00:37:28,868 --> 00:37:31,373
♪ St. Elmo's fire ♪
987
00:37:31,373 --> 00:37:33,085
♪ I can see a new horizon ♪
988
00:37:33,085 --> 00:37:34,672
MICHAEL: Something that unites
a lot of those movies
989
00:37:34,672 --> 00:37:36,425
that people
don't always talk about
990
00:37:36,425 --> 00:37:38,137
is how much
the soundtrack mattered.
991
00:37:38,137 --> 00:37:39,557
Yeah.
992
00:37:39,557 --> 00:37:41,769
And you think about
St. Elmo's Fire.
993
00:37:41,769 --> 00:37:44,107
And it wasn't just
the John Parr song.
994
00:37:44,107 --> 00:37:46,571
It was also, like,
the "Love Theme" instrumental
995
00:37:46,571 --> 00:37:48,240
was a hit song.
996
00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:51,246
[David Foster's "Love Theme
from St. Elmo's Fire "]
997
00:37:51,246 --> 00:37:58,260
♪ ♪
998
00:37:59,429 --> 00:38:01,726
Like, that literally charted.
999
00:38:01,726 --> 00:38:04,147
And with Pretty in Pink,
you're always going to think--
1000
00:38:04,147 --> 00:38:06,819
if you think of Pretty in Pink,
the song playing is going
1001
00:38:06,819 --> 00:38:08,782
to be OMD, "If You Leave".
1002
00:38:08,782 --> 00:38:10,619
[Orchestral Manoeuvres in
the Dark's "If You Leave"]
1003
00:38:10,619 --> 00:38:13,415
SINGER: ♪ Oh, if you leave ♪
1004
00:38:13,415 --> 00:38:16,046
SUSANNAH: These movies changed
the kind of music
1005
00:38:16,046 --> 00:38:18,217
that American teenagers
were listening to.
1006
00:38:18,217 --> 00:38:20,972
The idea of, you know,
random Midwestern teenagers
1007
00:38:20,972 --> 00:38:23,227
knowing every word
and loving, you know,
1008
00:38:23,227 --> 00:38:25,899
new wave British synth pop,
1009
00:38:25,899 --> 00:38:28,780
that's because of these movies.
- Hmm.
1010
00:38:28,780 --> 00:38:30,282
SUSANNAH: It's true.
1011
00:38:30,282 --> 00:38:33,247
That's because, basically,
John Hughes loved these artists
1012
00:38:33,247 --> 00:38:35,459
and put those--
those songs in his films.
1013
00:38:35,459 --> 00:38:36,587
I like doing it.
1014
00:38:36,587 --> 00:38:38,675
I like working
with young actors.
1015
00:38:38,675 --> 00:38:40,427
I like to use music a lot.
1016
00:38:40,427 --> 00:38:42,724
And it's
a very receptive audience.
1017
00:38:42,724 --> 00:38:47,985
Hughes just allows himself
to remember,
1018
00:38:47,985 --> 00:38:52,034
and to think,
and to feel about those times.
1019
00:38:52,034 --> 00:38:54,832
EMILIO: I liked the fact that
he was very collaborative.
1020
00:38:54,832 --> 00:38:56,586
It was like he's-- he
invited you into the process.
1021
00:38:56,586 --> 00:38:58,005
"What do you think?"
1022
00:38:58,005 --> 00:38:59,758
I've never had a director
say "what do you think?"
1023
00:38:59,758 --> 00:39:01,261
ALLY: I mean,
to have a director there
1024
00:39:01,261 --> 00:39:03,808
who just trusts you--
go ahead, improv till the--
1025
00:39:03,808 --> 00:39:05,937
till you hear the sound
of the film, like,
1026
00:39:05,937 --> 00:39:07,774
slapping around
in the canister.
1027
00:39:07,774 --> 00:39:11,072
And it's just sort of--
we ran out of film, reel film.
1028
00:39:11,072 --> 00:39:12,826
He's got a lot of different
levels to him and things.
1029
00:39:12,826 --> 00:39:15,122
He's very enthusiastic
about the work,
1030
00:39:15,122 --> 00:39:16,333
and he's got
a really creative,
1031
00:39:16,333 --> 00:39:18,086
quick mind,
which I really like.
1032
00:39:18,086 --> 00:39:20,424
MOLLY: I admire John
because he is a writer,
1033
00:39:20,424 --> 00:39:23,430
and yet, he's not really
overprotective about his work,
1034
00:39:23,430 --> 00:39:24,975
you know?
He's real good
1035
00:39:24,975 --> 00:39:26,854
about letting people
come in and kind of
1036
00:39:26,854 --> 00:39:28,482
form their own character.
1037
00:39:28,482 --> 00:39:30,612
JOHN: I think one of the
mistakes that's commonly made
1038
00:39:30,612 --> 00:39:34,369
in Hollywood teenage pictures
is that it's just--
1039
00:39:34,369 --> 00:39:35,956
they're going for the bucks,
1040
00:39:35,956 --> 00:39:37,751
and they're not going
for the heart.
1041
00:39:37,751 --> 00:39:41,717
And, you know, I try to make
a movie that's gonna last.
1042
00:39:41,717 --> 00:39:43,261
KATE: I mean,
I still think that John
1043
00:39:43,261 --> 00:39:46,769
is the ultimate
teenage drama filmmaker.
1044
00:39:46,769 --> 00:39:48,355
When he was making
these films,
1045
00:39:48,355 --> 00:39:52,154
he was tapping into his own
adolescent emotions and angst.
1046
00:39:52,154 --> 00:39:54,367
And John, I think,
remembered what it felt like,
1047
00:39:54,367 --> 00:39:55,704
for better and for worse.
1048
00:39:55,704 --> 00:39:57,541
The glaring thing when
we look back
1049
00:39:57,541 --> 00:39:59,545
on Brat Pack movies now--
1050
00:39:59,545 --> 00:40:01,256
with our perspective now--
1051
00:40:01,256 --> 00:40:05,264
is that John Hughes
doesn't deal at all with race.
1052
00:40:05,264 --> 00:40:07,769
I mean, the history of media,
and Hollywood,
1053
00:40:07,769 --> 00:40:11,276
and films has been
white characters for...
1054
00:40:11,276 --> 00:40:13,488
- Ever.
- Forever, you know?
1055
00:40:13,488 --> 00:40:17,873
And so when you aren't white,
and you're consuming media,
1056
00:40:17,873 --> 00:40:22,716
you are sort of used
to the media being white.
1057
00:40:22,716 --> 00:40:25,680
You know, and you sort of
build up the ability
1058
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,688
to, you know, empathize
with and connect with--
1059
00:40:29,688 --> 00:40:31,066
you know, I think
it's never really
1060
00:40:31,066 --> 00:40:32,944
been a problem
for non-white people
1061
00:40:32,944 --> 00:40:34,948
to watch, like,
a Pretty in Pink
1062
00:40:34,948 --> 00:40:36,368
or a Breakfast Club
and sort of connect
1063
00:40:36,368 --> 00:40:39,792
with those characters
because we are--
1064
00:40:39,792 --> 00:40:41,419
you're used to consuming it.
1065
00:40:41,419 --> 00:40:44,510
Even now, when there's
a lot of diverse options,
1066
00:40:44,510 --> 00:40:48,684
the majority of the media
is still sort of white-leaning,
1067
00:40:48,684 --> 00:40:52,609
you know, despite people
protesting that it's not.
1068
00:40:52,609 --> 00:40:54,613
Ferris Bueller's Day Off,
he's a kid from
1069
00:40:54,613 --> 00:40:56,032
the northern suburbs
of Chicago.
1070
00:40:56,032 --> 00:40:57,702
If you watch it
and you're like,
1071
00:40:57,702 --> 00:41:00,917
oh, he's reflecting the way
the world was in the '80s--
1072
00:41:00,917 --> 00:41:03,130
you know,
the Brown decision is '54,
1073
00:41:03,130 --> 00:41:05,050
which is the legal end
of educational segregation
1074
00:41:05,050 --> 00:41:06,637
in this country,
1075
00:41:06,637 --> 00:41:09,308
but the country
just resegregated after that
1076
00:41:09,308 --> 00:41:11,229
just along kind of
residential lines.
1077
00:41:11,229 --> 00:41:13,651
So it's like, the reality
of being a suburban,
1078
00:41:13,651 --> 00:41:16,114
upper-middle-class suburban kid
from outside Chicago
1079
00:41:16,114 --> 00:41:17,659
in the 1980s
is that there were--
1080
00:41:17,659 --> 00:41:19,495
there was, like,
one Black kid in your class.
1081
00:41:19,495 --> 00:41:21,332
That's the reality
of it in that era.
1082
00:41:21,332 --> 00:41:22,878
So, like, I don't know.
1083
00:41:22,878 --> 00:41:26,134
We can watch those movies and
just be reminded that's what--
1084
00:41:26,134 --> 00:41:27,971
that's what America was.
1085
00:41:27,971 --> 00:41:30,309
MICHAEL: But I think
that what John Hughes
1086
00:41:30,309 --> 00:41:34,108
was interested in
in a real way was class.
1087
00:41:34,108 --> 00:41:37,782
I want to show this girl that
I'm as good as anybody else.
1088
00:41:37,782 --> 00:41:40,037
CLIFF: So what, are you gonna
impress her with money?
1089
00:41:40,037 --> 00:41:41,665
You think
that's the solution, Keith?
1090
00:41:41,665 --> 00:41:43,920
Dad, didn't you ever
have guys at your school
1091
00:41:43,920 --> 00:41:45,882
that didn't fit in?
1092
00:41:45,882 --> 00:41:48,721
CLIFF: Yeah, of course.
- Yeah?
1093
00:41:48,721 --> 00:41:52,646
[chuckles]
Well, I'm one of those guys.
1094
00:41:52,646 --> 00:41:55,652
[orchestral music]
1095
00:41:55,652 --> 00:42:00,327
♪ ♪
1096
00:42:00,327 --> 00:42:02,414
ANDREW: When I first heard
the term "Brat Pack,"
1097
00:42:02,414 --> 00:42:04,377
my memory is being
in your office, which was--
1098
00:42:04,377 --> 00:42:05,922
my memory is also,
you were just across the hall
1099
00:42:05,922 --> 00:42:08,051
from John Hughes there.
- Yeah.
1100
00:42:08,051 --> 00:42:09,513
ANDREW: And you're
the first person I remember
1101
00:42:09,513 --> 00:42:12,226
saying, "They're calling
you guys the Brat Pack."
1102
00:42:12,226 --> 00:42:14,815
And you seemed to think that,
like, that's cool.
1103
00:42:14,815 --> 00:42:18,280
Yeah, it was a good thing.
It distinguished us.
1104
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:20,868
It took us out
of a whole year of movies.
1105
00:42:20,868 --> 00:42:22,831
It put us in the forefront.
1106
00:42:22,831 --> 00:42:24,918
I mean, you have to realize
when people saw
1107
00:42:24,918 --> 00:42:27,047
St. Elmo's--
young people--
1108
00:42:27,047 --> 00:42:30,763
they wanted to be part
of the St. Elmo's Brat Pack.
1109
00:42:30,763 --> 00:42:32,266
[both grunting]
1110
00:42:32,266 --> 00:42:33,602
[together]
Boogah, boogah, boogah.
1111
00:42:33,602 --> 00:42:36,107
Ah, ah, ah!
[laughter]
1112
00:42:36,107 --> 00:42:37,777
LAUREN:
Here's what I understood.
1113
00:42:37,777 --> 00:42:40,407
I understood that the guy
who wrote it, in all deference,
1114
00:42:40,407 --> 00:42:43,622
was jealous of Emilio
and all of you guys.
1115
00:42:43,622 --> 00:42:46,377
He termed "Brat Pack"
as a bad term,
1116
00:42:46,377 --> 00:42:48,716
and I thought it was fabulous.
1117
00:42:48,716 --> 00:42:50,970
I thought it was--
aren't these guys lucky,
1118
00:42:50,970 --> 00:42:52,431
and aren't they talented?
1119
00:42:52,431 --> 00:42:54,185
They made their luck.
1120
00:42:54,185 --> 00:42:56,272
If we had perceived
it that way,
1121
00:42:56,272 --> 00:42:58,276
all our careers and lives
would have been different.
1122
00:42:58,276 --> 00:42:59,780
[laughter]
1123
00:42:59,780 --> 00:43:02,117
I think we perceived it as
you're spoiled fucking brats.
1124
00:43:02,117 --> 00:43:03,704
Yeah, I know.
I know.
1125
00:43:03,704 --> 00:43:06,334
- Are you in the Brat Pack?
- I'm Brat Pack-adjacent.
1126
00:43:06,334 --> 00:43:07,712
- That's what I would say.
- [laughs]
1127
00:43:07,712 --> 00:43:09,758
I'd say you're
Brat Pack-adjacent. Exactly.
1128
00:43:09,758 --> 00:43:11,637
And did you want
to be in the Brat Pack?
1129
00:43:11,637 --> 00:43:13,599
LEA: I did.
I did.
1130
00:43:13,599 --> 00:43:15,978
And I was like, "Aw,
I would have liked to have
1131
00:43:15,978 --> 00:43:17,314
hung out with you guys."
1132
00:43:17,314 --> 00:43:19,569
- But we never hung out.
- I know.
1133
00:43:19,569 --> 00:43:21,657
It was an illusion,
like all of Hollywood.
1134
00:43:21,657 --> 00:43:22,951
Well, they're the cool kids.
1135
00:43:22,951 --> 00:43:24,453
They're the people
you want to hang out with.
1136
00:43:24,453 --> 00:43:26,332
And I think it just, like,
continues the fantasy.
1137
00:43:26,332 --> 00:43:28,879
You wouldn't want that
to end when the movie is over.
1138
00:43:28,879 --> 00:43:30,717
You don't want everyone to,
like, go back to their trailer
1139
00:43:30,717 --> 00:43:32,010
and not talk to each other.
1140
00:43:32,010 --> 00:43:34,599
You want them all to be young,
and cool, and fun
1141
00:43:34,599 --> 00:43:36,603
on screen and off screen.
1142
00:43:36,603 --> 00:43:37,605
JON: You know,
everybody always wants
1143
00:43:37,605 --> 00:43:39,024
to be part of the cool group.
1144
00:43:39,024 --> 00:43:40,737
You know, there was always
a part of me
1145
00:43:40,737 --> 00:43:42,448
like, "Yeah, whatever."
1146
00:43:42,448 --> 00:43:45,997
They're-- you know,
"They're not so great anyway."
1147
00:43:45,997 --> 00:43:47,667
Oh, the Brat Pack.
1148
00:43:47,667 --> 00:43:50,798
I-- I think people just
want to put people in groups.
1149
00:43:50,798 --> 00:43:52,426
I don't-- the only--
I don't--
1150
00:43:52,426 --> 00:43:54,931
I mean, of the Brat Pack,
I don't really--
1151
00:43:54,931 --> 00:43:57,186
I certainly don't think
I'm a part of it.
1152
00:43:57,186 --> 00:43:58,564
I mean--
[laughs].
1153
00:43:58,564 --> 00:44:00,108
I hope not.
1154
00:44:00,108 --> 00:44:01,945
So have you spoken to Molly?
1155
00:44:01,945 --> 00:44:03,406
ANDREW: I, of course,
asked Molly
1156
00:44:03,406 --> 00:44:04,868
if she'd like to speak,
and she said
1157
00:44:04,868 --> 00:44:06,412
she'd think about it
1158
00:44:06,412 --> 00:44:08,166
but that she would probably
just like
1159
00:44:08,166 --> 00:44:10,630
to just keep looking forward.
And so--
1160
00:44:10,630 --> 00:44:12,216
Interesting.
1161
00:44:12,216 --> 00:44:15,932
I think Molly, you know,
wants to move on, wants--
1162
00:44:15,932 --> 00:44:19,188
we all want to be taken
without the baggage
1163
00:44:19,188 --> 00:44:23,154
of our pop cultural
references as an actor.
1164
00:44:23,154 --> 00:44:24,783
We want to just act.
1165
00:44:24,783 --> 00:44:26,369
Does it make it
difficult for you
1166
00:44:26,369 --> 00:44:27,914
to work with that group
of actors because
1167
00:44:27,914 --> 00:44:29,333
of the publicity attendant?
1168
00:44:29,333 --> 00:44:31,170
I think that the most
reprehensible thing
1169
00:44:31,170 --> 00:44:33,466
about it all is that
it portrays us
1170
00:44:33,466 --> 00:44:35,095
as not being serious
about our work.
1171
00:44:35,095 --> 00:44:37,600
Regardless of how our
personal life may be portrayed
1172
00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:40,898
by those people who aren't
in our personal lives,
1173
00:44:40,898 --> 00:44:44,113
our professional life should
be painted in the true picture.
1174
00:44:44,113 --> 00:44:46,577
It should not
cost us professionally
1175
00:44:46,577 --> 00:44:49,791
because of a point of view
that's outside of it.
1176
00:44:49,791 --> 00:44:52,797
[Lou Reed's
"Ride Into the Sun"]
1177
00:44:52,797 --> 00:44:55,427
♪ ♪
1178
00:44:55,427 --> 00:45:01,773
LOU: ♪ Looking for
another chance ♪
1179
00:45:01,773 --> 00:45:05,488
♪ For someone else to be ♪
1180
00:45:05,488 --> 00:45:07,409
♪ ♪
1181
00:45:07,409 --> 00:45:12,461
♪ Looking for another place ♪
1182
00:45:12,461 --> 00:45:16,511
♪ To ride into the sun ♪
1183
00:45:16,511 --> 00:45:17,889
ANDREW: When we first
started this,
1184
00:45:17,889 --> 00:45:19,391
I thought, you know,
the biggest problem
1185
00:45:19,391 --> 00:45:21,938
with this is going to be
getting everyone to say yes
1186
00:45:21,938 --> 00:45:26,030
because I know there's still
such post-traumatic stress
1187
00:45:26,030 --> 00:45:30,455
associated with it for
some of the gang, you know?
1188
00:45:30,455 --> 00:45:32,919
And our past lives on in us.
1189
00:45:32,919 --> 00:45:34,798
As much as we try
and leave things in the past,
1190
00:45:34,798 --> 00:45:37,260
they don't get left there,
you know?
1191
00:45:37,260 --> 00:45:38,806
It's like that
Eugene O'Neill line.
1192
00:45:38,806 --> 00:45:40,183
"The past is the present.
1193
00:45:40,183 --> 00:45:42,396
It's the future too"
1194
00:45:42,396 --> 00:45:46,863
LOU: ♪ Ride into the sun ♪
1195
00:45:46,863 --> 00:45:52,709
♪ Where everything
seems so pretty ♪
1196
00:45:52,709 --> 00:45:54,504
♪ But if you're tired
and you're ♪
1197
00:45:54,504 --> 00:45:57,510
ANDREW: So we're out here
in the sticks
1198
00:45:57,510 --> 00:46:00,223
to track down Tim Hutton.
1199
00:46:00,223 --> 00:46:04,189
I met Tim in the early '80s
1200
00:46:04,189 --> 00:46:07,697
before the Brat Pack of it all.
1201
00:46:07,697 --> 00:46:10,410
He was in
Ordinary People in 1980,
1202
00:46:10,410 --> 00:46:12,749
won the Academy Award--
deservedly so.
1203
00:46:12,749 --> 00:46:14,334
He was spectacular
in that movie.
1204
00:46:14,334 --> 00:46:16,965
And you could argue that
the origins of the youth film
1205
00:46:16,965 --> 00:46:18,510
started right there.
1206
00:46:18,510 --> 00:46:19,846
Obviously, Ordinary People
was not a youth--
1207
00:46:19,846 --> 00:46:22,643
or a teen movie in any way,
but he was a teen.
1208
00:46:22,643 --> 00:46:26,943
And it took young people,
1209
00:46:26,943 --> 00:46:30,241
his character in that movie,
very seriously.
1210
00:46:30,241 --> 00:46:32,037
Oh, I think that was it.
1211
00:46:32,037 --> 00:46:34,584
I think I just passed it.
1212
00:46:34,584 --> 00:46:36,045
So, yeah,
it'll be great to see Tim.
1213
00:46:36,045 --> 00:46:37,673
I haven't seen him in forever.
1214
00:46:37,673 --> 00:46:40,094
And I'll get
his take on all this.
1215
00:46:40,094 --> 00:46:41,723
Because he was certainly
in the heart of it,
1216
00:46:41,723 --> 00:46:45,021
in the center of it back then,
yet somehow evaded
1217
00:46:45,021 --> 00:46:49,404
the Brat Pack label.
1218
00:46:49,404 --> 00:46:51,367
Hey.
[laughs]
1219
00:46:51,367 --> 00:46:53,454
I'm wandering up
to some random house
1220
00:46:53,454 --> 00:46:54,666
hoping not to get shot.
1221
00:46:54,666 --> 00:46:56,168
[laughs]
TIM: Welcome.
1222
00:46:56,168 --> 00:46:58,214
ANDREW: Hello, Tim.
TIM: How are you, man?
1223
00:46:58,214 --> 00:46:59,299
Good to see you.
1224
00:46:59,299 --> 00:47:00,678
ANDREW: Nice to see you.
TIM: Yeah.
1225
00:47:00,678 --> 00:47:02,515
ANDREW: Hi.
Thanks.
1226
00:47:02,515 --> 00:47:03,851
TIM: Yeah, absolutely.
1227
00:47:03,851 --> 00:47:05,478
ANDREW: You look great.
TIM: I got bees.
1228
00:47:05,478 --> 00:47:07,190
Those are-- that's--
ANDREW: Are you beekeeper?
1229
00:47:07,190 --> 00:47:08,610
Yeah, 60,000 bees.
1230
00:47:08,610 --> 00:47:10,029
ANDREW: Jesus, dude.
TIM: Yeah.
1231
00:47:10,029 --> 00:47:11,240
ANDREW: Look at you.
1232
00:47:11,240 --> 00:47:12,952
I see you now.
1233
00:47:12,952 --> 00:47:14,789
I still feel like, in a way,
your showbiz younger brother.
1234
00:47:14,789 --> 00:47:16,835
Because you were one
of the first people I met.
1235
00:47:16,835 --> 00:47:18,922
You seemed to take me
under your wing.
1236
00:47:18,922 --> 00:47:21,260
And like, you were living
in upper west--
1237
00:47:21,260 --> 00:47:22,304
what street?
Do you remember what street
1238
00:47:22,304 --> 00:47:23,974
you lived on in that--
- 82nd.
1239
00:47:23,974 --> 00:47:25,561
OK, you were living
in that place,
1240
00:47:25,561 --> 00:47:27,230
and we used to go down
to Arthur's restaurant,
1241
00:47:27,230 --> 00:47:28,525
the pizza place--
- Arturo's.
1242
00:47:28,525 --> 00:47:29,861
- Arturo's.
- Yeah.
1243
00:47:29,861 --> 00:47:32,073
Yeah. And anyway,
and then we did that show,
1244
00:47:32,073 --> 00:47:33,744
the Steven Spielberg--
1245
00:47:33,744 --> 00:47:35,371
TIM: Amazing Stories.
ANDREW: Amazing Stories.
1246
00:47:35,371 --> 00:47:36,750
TIM: Yeah.
1247
00:47:36,750 --> 00:47:38,419
ANDREW: I so looked up to you
and admired you
1248
00:47:38,419 --> 00:47:40,465
because, you know, if Lou Reed
was the godfather of punk,
1249
00:47:40,465 --> 00:47:42,218
you're like the godfather
of the Brat Pack...
1250
00:47:42,218 --> 00:47:43,639
[laughs]
ANDDREW: In a certain way.
1251
00:47:43,639 --> 00:47:44,933
You know what I mean?
1252
00:47:44,933 --> 00:47:46,477
Because we did--
we all stood on your shoulders.
1253
00:47:46,477 --> 00:47:47,939
During that time,
there was a lot
1254
00:47:47,939 --> 00:47:51,571
of really interesting scripts
by interesting filmmakers.
1255
00:47:51,571 --> 00:47:54,326
It mostly featured
young people
1256
00:47:54,326 --> 00:47:55,955
in their 20s during that time.
1257
00:47:55,955 --> 00:47:58,167
ANDREW: Yeah, it was an
amazing time to be that age,
1258
00:47:58,167 --> 00:48:00,714
and we were there, you know,
at the center of it.
1259
00:48:00,714 --> 00:48:02,677
Do you remember where you were
the first time
1260
00:48:02,677 --> 00:48:04,096
you heard the term "Brat Pack?"
1261
00:48:04,096 --> 00:48:05,724
What do you remember
of that time?
1262
00:48:05,724 --> 00:48:09,439
I just thought, you know,
that it was honestly
1263
00:48:09,439 --> 00:48:11,736
kind of a cheap--
both of those words,
1264
00:48:11,736 --> 00:48:14,909
"brat" and "pack"--
1265
00:48:14,909 --> 00:48:18,290
I felt like I was just
starting my life and my career.
1266
00:48:18,290 --> 00:48:22,215
Are you getting offered
the kind of parts you want?
1267
00:48:22,215 --> 00:48:25,054
Or do the people
who make these things up
1268
00:48:25,054 --> 00:48:27,183
view you in a certain way
that's limiting?
1269
00:48:27,183 --> 00:48:28,979
ANDREW: [laughs]
I think you get in a rut--
1270
00:48:28,979 --> 00:48:30,733
not a rut necessarily,
1271
00:48:30,733 --> 00:48:31,985
but people see you in one way,
and they like to keep
1272
00:48:31,985 --> 00:48:33,572
seeing you that way
because it's--
1273
00:48:33,572 --> 00:48:35,074
you know, people like
to use as little imagination,
1274
00:48:35,074 --> 00:48:36,452
really, as possible
all the time.
1275
00:48:36,452 --> 00:48:37,830
I guess I asked
that because I--
1276
00:48:37,830 --> 00:48:39,291
ANDREW: All we ever want
in life is to be seen, right?
1277
00:48:39,291 --> 00:48:40,711
See me.
- Right.
1278
00:48:40,711 --> 00:48:42,673
ANDREW: Hear what I have to say
and see me.
1279
00:48:42,673 --> 00:48:44,259
And I felt suddenly--
[claps]
1280
00:48:44,259 --> 00:48:46,013
like that happened,
where it felt like--
1281
00:48:46,013 --> 00:48:47,933
experienced like a slap
and then a redirection
1282
00:48:47,933 --> 00:48:49,478
that I didn't turn.
1283
00:48:49,478 --> 00:48:51,900
I suddenly felt like
I wasn't being seen.
1284
00:48:51,900 --> 00:48:55,031
It was making a comment on,
you know,
1285
00:48:55,031 --> 00:48:59,206
in a really cynical way,
young actors and young people
1286
00:48:59,206 --> 00:49:02,003
with tremendous success...
- Yeah.
1287
00:49:02,003 --> 00:49:03,924
Based on nothing.
1288
00:49:03,924 --> 00:49:06,930
It was just sort of like,
I've decided this.
1289
00:49:06,930 --> 00:49:08,307
[chuckles]
1290
00:49:08,307 --> 00:49:09,936
And then so suddenly,
one learns protectiveness.
1291
00:49:09,936 --> 00:49:12,023
And that's--
if you're an actor,
1292
00:49:12,023 --> 00:49:14,319
being protective and shut off
and closed in
1293
00:49:14,319 --> 00:49:15,781
is the last thing
one can afford to be
1294
00:49:15,781 --> 00:49:17,450
if you're gonna work properly.
TIM: Yeah.
1295
00:49:17,450 --> 00:49:19,956
Have you talked to the others
about that?
1296
00:49:19,956 --> 00:49:21,458
"The others."
1297
00:49:21,458 --> 00:49:23,295
Like, again, it feels like
a cult or something.
1298
00:49:23,295 --> 00:49:24,674
ANDREW: Well, that's
interesting, right?
1299
00:49:24,674 --> 00:49:25,968
I don't know them, and yet,
1300
00:49:25,968 --> 00:49:27,805
I know them because
they experienced this thing
1301
00:49:27,805 --> 00:49:29,057
and it has been
dragging around with them
1302
00:49:29,057 --> 00:49:30,351
for 30-odd years.
- Branded.
1303
00:49:30,351 --> 00:49:32,438
ANDREW: Branded.
We share a brand.
1304
00:49:32,438 --> 00:49:34,359
Well, I just didn't know how
to address it or deal with it,
1305
00:49:34,359 --> 00:49:36,071
you know?
TIM: Yeah.
1306
00:49:36,071 --> 00:49:37,700
So I just tried to run
and whatever.
1307
00:49:37,700 --> 00:49:40,037
And then 35 years later,
I guess I sort of
1308
00:49:40,037 --> 00:49:41,206
stopped running,
and turned around,
1309
00:49:41,206 --> 00:49:43,252
and go, "Oh,
so you're still there? OK.
1310
00:49:43,252 --> 00:49:45,006
Let's-- let's look at you."
[laughs]
1311
00:49:45,006 --> 00:49:46,801
You know what I mean?
- Yeah, yeah.
1312
00:49:46,801 --> 00:49:48,597
I'm surprised because
I'm not a sentimental person.
1313
00:49:48,597 --> 00:49:49,932
I'm not a nostalgic person.
1314
00:49:49,932 --> 00:49:52,813
And yet,
I'm finding it deeply moving.
1315
00:49:52,813 --> 00:49:55,527
Like, I see you, and I'm like,
"Wow, there's Tim."
1316
00:49:55,527 --> 00:49:58,533
[Alphaville's "Forever Young"]
1317
00:49:58,533 --> 00:50:01,998
♪ ♪
1318
00:50:01,998 --> 00:50:04,545
I came out here to LA
this weekend
1319
00:50:04,545 --> 00:50:06,465
to try and talk
to some of the gang,
1320
00:50:06,465 --> 00:50:08,427
and they've proven
to be a bit elusive.
1321
00:50:08,427 --> 00:50:11,726
Judd is at some undisclosed
location and not available.
1322
00:50:11,726 --> 00:50:14,607
And Rob, suddenly,
was in Orlando.
1323
00:50:14,607 --> 00:50:17,655
When I told my wife
I was gonna make a movie about
1324
00:50:17,655 --> 00:50:22,706
talking to the Brat Pack,
she said that it would probably
1325
00:50:22,706 --> 00:50:25,169
be very good for my humility.
1326
00:50:25,169 --> 00:50:27,465
And now, I understand
what she's talking about.
1327
00:50:27,465 --> 00:50:29,762
♪ ♪
1328
00:50:29,762 --> 00:50:31,724
I'm not sure I like it.
1329
00:50:31,724 --> 00:50:33,477
MARIAN:
♪ Sitting in a sandpit ♪
1330
00:50:33,477 --> 00:50:34,981
♪ Life is a short trip ♪
1331
00:50:34,981 --> 00:50:36,441
♪ The music's
for the sad men ♪
1332
00:50:36,441 --> 00:50:38,112
ANDREW: Ah, good.
We're late.
1333
00:50:38,112 --> 00:50:42,955
[laughs]
What a shit show, huh?
1334
00:50:42,955 --> 00:50:45,334
There you are.
1335
00:50:45,334 --> 00:50:47,297
I hope the vicious dogs
don't attack us.
1336
00:50:47,297 --> 00:50:48,465
MARIAN:
♪ Getting in tune ♪
1337
00:50:48,465 --> 00:50:50,011
♪ The music's played by the ♪
1338
00:50:50,011 --> 00:50:51,806
♪ The madman ♪
1339
00:50:51,806 --> 00:50:54,311
♪ Forever young ♪
1340
00:50:54,311 --> 00:50:58,611
♪ I want to be forever young ♪
1341
00:50:58,611 --> 00:51:02,368
♪ Do you really want
to live forever? ♪
1342
00:51:02,368 --> 00:51:05,584
♪ Forever and ever ♪
1343
00:51:05,584 --> 00:51:06,961
DEMI: Good to see you.
1344
00:51:06,961 --> 00:51:09,174
ANDREW: Yeah, how are you?
DEMI: Good. Welcome.
1345
00:51:09,174 --> 00:51:10,802
MARIAN: ♪ I want to be
forever young ♪
1346
00:51:10,802 --> 00:51:13,015
DEMI: Do you want to sit here?
ANDREW: Maybe so.
1347
00:51:13,015 --> 00:51:15,269
Are you guys good?
- I'm playing with my hair.
1348
00:51:15,269 --> 00:51:16,939
I don't want my ears
sticking out like an elf.
1349
00:51:16,939 --> 00:51:18,400
Slippers good?
[laughs]
1350
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:19,654
ANDREW: The slippers are good.
1351
00:51:19,654 --> 00:51:21,156
I remember the first time
I saw you.
1352
00:51:21,156 --> 00:51:22,367
You walked into--
we were on the sound stage
1353
00:51:22,367 --> 00:51:24,747
at Columbia there
for St. Elmo's Fire.
1354
00:51:24,747 --> 00:51:26,416
And my memory is you came--
Joel kind of
1355
00:51:26,416 --> 00:51:28,379
brought you in
and presented you
1356
00:51:28,379 --> 00:51:29,674
to the room as this--
1357
00:51:29,674 --> 00:51:31,343
this creature
that he's created.
1358
00:51:31,343 --> 00:51:33,472
And it's like--
and it was just so weird.
1359
00:51:33,472 --> 00:51:35,017
And I just remember going,
"Oh, why is Joel
1360
00:51:35,017 --> 00:51:36,019
treating her like that?"
[laughs]
1361
00:51:36,019 --> 00:51:37,606
You know, it was--
1362
00:51:37,606 --> 00:51:39,275
DEMI: But you know what was
so beautiful is he really
1363
00:51:39,275 --> 00:51:40,987
stuck his neck out for me
'cause it's not like
1364
00:51:40,987 --> 00:51:42,699
I had any box office draw.
1365
00:51:42,699 --> 00:51:44,995
I-- we were all just beginning.
1366
00:51:44,995 --> 00:51:47,626
I didn't-- I didn't have
anything to really
1367
00:51:47,626 --> 00:51:50,339
warrant him sticking by me.
1368
00:51:50,339 --> 00:51:55,224
They paid to have a companion,
a sober companion with me 24/7
1369
00:51:55,224 --> 00:51:56,519
during the whole shooting.
ANDREW: Did they?
1370
00:51:56,519 --> 00:51:57,855
Yeah.
ANDREW: I didn't even notice.
1371
00:51:57,855 --> 00:52:00,484
I didn't even notice.
- And I literally was--
1372
00:52:00,484 --> 00:52:02,614
like, they could have easily
just found someone else.
1373
00:52:02,614 --> 00:52:04,869
Going to treatment,
they were like,
1374
00:52:04,869 --> 00:52:06,204
"We want you to check in.
1375
00:52:06,204 --> 00:52:07,791
I'm like, "No, no,
I'm starting a movie."
1376
00:52:07,791 --> 00:52:10,045
And they said, "Yes, but
what's more important to you,
1377
00:52:10,045 --> 00:52:11,758
the movie or your life?"
1378
00:52:11,758 --> 00:52:12,801
And I said, "The movie."
ANDREW: The movie.
1379
00:52:12,801 --> 00:52:14,012
[laughter]
Come on.
1380
00:52:14,012 --> 00:52:15,640
Come on.
What they talking about?
1381
00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:18,563
I mean, for me, like, I didn't
have any value for myself.
1382
00:52:18,563 --> 00:52:23,322
I think I was so fearful
of failing, fearful of losing,
1383
00:52:23,322 --> 00:52:26,453
and desperate to kind of
fit in, belong.
1384
00:52:26,453 --> 00:52:31,338
And my need to please
was definitely on high alert.
1385
00:52:31,338 --> 00:52:32,716
I think that's been
the nice thing
1386
00:52:32,716 --> 00:52:36,181
with Joel's casting.
He's been real insightful in--
1387
00:52:36,181 --> 00:52:37,518
in placing us.
1388
00:52:37,518 --> 00:52:40,649
Because it's--
we're all playing extensions
1389
00:52:40,649 --> 00:52:42,611
of ourselves that are real--
1390
00:52:42,611 --> 00:52:44,865
are real, you know, inward.
1391
00:52:44,865 --> 00:52:47,996
Inward places that we've
probably not yet looked at.
1392
00:52:47,996 --> 00:52:49,499
ANDREW: Do you remember where
you were the first time
1393
00:52:49,499 --> 00:52:50,961
you heard the term "Brat Pack"?
1394
00:52:50,961 --> 00:52:54,510
I remember it coming out
and being like, what the fuck?
1395
00:52:54,510 --> 00:52:55,595
[laughs]
1396
00:52:55,595 --> 00:52:57,473
Why did we take it
as an offense?
1397
00:52:57,473 --> 00:52:58,935
That's the thing.
1398
00:52:58,935 --> 00:53:00,522
Why did we take it as
something bad as opposed to--
1399
00:53:00,522 --> 00:53:02,024
Well, because
you're called a "brat."
1400
00:53:02,024 --> 00:53:03,277
You're called a fucking "brat."
[laughs]
1401
00:53:03,277 --> 00:53:04,487
DEMI: I know,
and it's because we were young
1402
00:53:04,487 --> 00:53:05,991
that we thought,
"Oh, if we're--"
1403
00:53:05,991 --> 00:53:07,493
And we were afraid
we were brats, you know?
1404
00:53:07,493 --> 00:53:10,124
DEMI: It definitely
really irritated me.
1405
00:53:10,124 --> 00:53:14,592
I felt like a sense of it
being unjust.
1406
00:53:14,592 --> 00:53:15,802
I just think it--
1407
00:53:15,802 --> 00:53:17,681
I just felt like it
didn't represent us,
1408
00:53:17,681 --> 00:53:21,313
and I felt like it was
a real limited perspective.
1409
00:53:21,313 --> 00:53:23,902
It stayed with me
for a while, you know,
1410
00:53:23,902 --> 00:53:26,824
just as I did press things.
1411
00:53:26,824 --> 00:53:28,578
You know, "The Brat Pack,"
blah, blah--
1412
00:53:28,578 --> 00:53:30,122
you know?
ANDREW: Yeah.
1413
00:53:30,122 --> 00:53:34,130
But I don't know if I took it
as personal over time
1414
00:53:34,130 --> 00:53:36,844
maybe than as you did--
or even the impact
1415
00:53:36,844 --> 00:53:38,388
that you may have had from it.
1416
00:53:38,388 --> 00:53:40,602
I'm still wrangling
with that notion
1417
00:53:40,602 --> 00:53:43,357
of, like, I allowed that--
1418
00:53:43,357 --> 00:53:45,361
even though I said it didn't.
1419
00:53:45,361 --> 00:53:48,450
But it was like there was
a belief that you were
1420
00:53:48,450 --> 00:53:52,959
holding underneath that
you made that mean something
1421
00:53:52,959 --> 00:53:55,548
about you that
then created a limitation
1422
00:53:55,548 --> 00:53:58,805
in your expression,
and that's-- you know, and in--
1423
00:53:58,805 --> 00:54:00,934
ANDREW: Say that again.
That's exactly right.
1424
00:54:00,934 --> 00:54:03,188
[laughter]
No, but that's exactly right.
1425
00:54:03,188 --> 00:54:06,236
Fear was such a dominant part
of my life when I was a kid.
1426
00:54:06,236 --> 00:54:07,990
And it's still something
I contend with
1427
00:54:07,990 --> 00:54:11,371
on a daily basis, right?
So-- and my fear--
1428
00:54:11,371 --> 00:54:12,958
I always felt like
I was being stabbed
1429
00:54:12,958 --> 00:54:14,085
right between
my shoulder blades
1430
00:54:14,085 --> 00:54:16,006
by some unknown kind of thing.
1431
00:54:16,006 --> 00:54:19,387
And that's what I felt like
when I first heard
1432
00:54:19,387 --> 00:54:20,598
the term "Brat Pack."
1433
00:54:20,598 --> 00:54:22,769
I have a similar one in--
1434
00:54:22,769 --> 00:54:24,272
in an old pattern.
1435
00:54:24,272 --> 00:54:27,486
And mine was the rug being
pulled out from under me.
1436
00:54:27,486 --> 00:54:32,038
Yeah, Jules, why do I feel
like I'm not here by accident?
1437
00:54:32,038 --> 00:54:33,791
I have been needing
to talk to you.
1438
00:54:33,791 --> 00:54:34,877
[laughs]
1439
00:54:34,877 --> 00:54:36,129
It sounds like
one of our infamous
1440
00:54:36,129 --> 00:54:37,841
conversations is coming.
1441
00:54:37,841 --> 00:54:41,097
I look at everything as
happening for us, not to us.
1442
00:54:41,097 --> 00:54:42,893
And you can't be selective
with that.
1443
00:54:42,893 --> 00:54:45,982
The fact that that came out
and it tried to diminish us
1444
00:54:45,982 --> 00:54:49,782
was also an opportunity
to rise above it, to say,
1445
00:54:49,782 --> 00:54:52,244
"No, I am much more than that.
1446
00:54:52,244 --> 00:54:55,125
"I am not, you know,
for whatever reason,
1447
00:54:55,125 --> 00:54:58,633
the offensive part of being
kind of seen as a 'brat.'"
1448
00:54:58,633 --> 00:55:01,054
ANDREW: For me,
that's years in the process
1449
00:55:01,054 --> 00:55:03,225
to come to that kind of thing.
1450
00:55:03,225 --> 00:55:05,270
That's really just wise.
You know?
1451
00:55:05,270 --> 00:55:06,816
That took me years to--
1452
00:55:06,816 --> 00:55:10,405
because all I felt is it was
negative for so long, and--
1453
00:55:10,405 --> 00:55:12,994
But I think that that is a
common part of our conditioning
1454
00:55:12,994 --> 00:55:17,671
is to see these things
that have been, in a sense,
1455
00:55:17,671 --> 00:55:19,591
what we hold as against-ness.
1456
00:55:19,591 --> 00:55:21,302
It was like
an against-ness to us.
1457
00:55:21,302 --> 00:55:22,889
It was a-- it was.
It was a--
1458
00:55:22,889 --> 00:55:24,475
ANDREW: Ooh, I like that--
an "against-ness."
1459
00:55:24,475 --> 00:55:26,187
DEMI: It was.
- Yeah, it was.
1460
00:55:26,187 --> 00:55:30,320
But against-ness
only provokes against-ness.
1461
00:55:30,320 --> 00:55:33,326
And so when we hold things
that way, we create...
1462
00:55:33,326 --> 00:55:35,497
- Totally.
- That pattern.
1463
00:55:35,497 --> 00:55:37,126
Like, that idea of being
stabbed in the back
1464
00:55:37,126 --> 00:55:39,715
is something you related to
as something much earlier
1465
00:55:39,715 --> 00:55:41,175
in your life.
ANDREW: Yeah.
1466
00:55:41,175 --> 00:55:43,305
So I'm predisposed
to interpret it that way.
1467
00:55:43,305 --> 00:55:45,225
Not only that,
you're predisposed
1468
00:55:45,225 --> 00:55:47,689
to recreating it until you
hit a point where you're...
1469
00:55:47,689 --> 00:55:48,774
Well, yeah.
1470
00:55:48,774 --> 00:55:50,110
You don't want
to do that anymore.
1471
00:55:50,110 --> 00:55:51,362
You go to enough therapy,
and you kind of go--
1472
00:55:51,362 --> 00:55:52,824
And here you are.
1473
00:55:52,824 --> 00:55:54,578
You're working through this
just with that same purpose.
1474
00:55:54,578 --> 00:55:56,372
And now here we are, Doctor.
Dr. Demi, listen.
1475
00:55:56,372 --> 00:55:57,792
[laughter]
1476
00:55:57,792 --> 00:55:59,630
There's the brink
of insanity,
1477
00:55:59,630 --> 00:56:01,424
and then there is the abyss...
1478
00:56:01,424 --> 00:56:02,761
- Kev, there's nothing to be...
- Which obviously...
1479
00:56:02,761 --> 00:56:04,180
- Ashamed of.
- You've fallen into.
1480
00:56:04,180 --> 00:56:06,351
I had ambition.
And yet part of me--
1481
00:56:06,351 --> 00:56:08,188
I have one hand
that really wants something,
1482
00:56:08,188 --> 00:56:09,566
and to this day,
I have one hand
1483
00:56:09,566 --> 00:56:10,777
that really wants something,
1484
00:56:10,777 --> 00:56:12,029
and on the other hand,
I just want to go,
1485
00:56:12,029 --> 00:56:13,239
"I just want to get
the fuck out of here."
1486
00:56:13,239 --> 00:56:14,952
I'm so similar in that way.
1487
00:56:14,952 --> 00:56:18,124
The other kind of story
I had is, like,
1488
00:56:18,124 --> 00:56:20,337
wanting to hide
and make myself small.
1489
00:56:20,337 --> 00:56:21,924
I think when
my life started to become
1490
00:56:21,924 --> 00:56:24,721
more important than my career,
I started to see--
1491
00:56:24,721 --> 00:56:27,059
to step back and have
the perspective
1492
00:56:27,059 --> 00:56:29,731
on the Brat Pack that it
allowed me to do
1493
00:56:29,731 --> 00:56:31,359
what we're talking about now,
to see it as
1494
00:56:31,359 --> 00:56:32,904
a as a good thing
as opposed to--
1495
00:56:32,904 --> 00:56:33,990
Right.
1496
00:56:33,990 --> 00:56:35,450
When I stopped
pressing so hard,
1497
00:56:35,450 --> 00:56:37,831
I think that shift,
which comes with age
1498
00:56:37,831 --> 00:56:40,586
and/or failure.
[laughs]
1499
00:56:40,586 --> 00:56:42,089
The event is the event.
1500
00:56:42,089 --> 00:56:45,680
What we make it mean
is the value
1501
00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:48,351
that it all of a sudden has.
Does that--
1502
00:56:48,351 --> 00:56:49,938
ANDREW: Yeah, I gave it
so much power.
1503
00:56:49,938 --> 00:56:51,692
You gave it so--
exactly.
1504
00:56:51,692 --> 00:56:53,278
When you really
look at that now,
1505
00:56:53,278 --> 00:56:54,948
we thought we were like so--
1506
00:56:54,948 --> 00:56:56,367
And, of course, we thought
we were like-- yeah.
1507
00:56:56,367 --> 00:56:58,998
So grown up.
But we were babies.
1508
00:56:58,998 --> 00:57:00,877
What?
[laughter]
1509
00:57:00,877 --> 00:57:03,591
REPORTER: OK.
- Andrew.
1510
00:57:03,591 --> 00:57:04,926
[laughter]
1511
00:57:04,926 --> 00:57:06,930
I mean...
1512
00:57:06,930 --> 00:57:09,936
[soft dramatic music]
1513
00:57:09,936 --> 00:57:12,776
♪ ♪
1514
00:57:12,776 --> 00:57:15,113
ANDREW: Things that happen
to us when we're young,
1515
00:57:15,113 --> 00:57:17,367
they're really intense,
and they go deep.
1516
00:57:17,367 --> 00:57:19,581
You know, had the same thing,
the Brat Pack--
1517
00:57:19,581 --> 00:57:20,917
if the Brat Pack happened
when we were 40,
1518
00:57:20,917 --> 00:57:23,213
we would have gone like,
"Whatever, dude."
1519
00:57:23,213 --> 00:57:25,050
You know, because you're young,
1520
00:57:25,050 --> 00:57:26,887
you just take it so personally
because you're not sure
1521
00:57:26,887 --> 00:57:28,557
of yourself yet, and so I think
1522
00:57:28,557 --> 00:57:30,812
that article tapped into
doubts and fears
1523
00:57:30,812 --> 00:57:32,397
that we had about ourselves.
1524
00:57:32,397 --> 00:57:35,112
My God, are we maybe
really undeserving of this?
1525
00:57:35,112 --> 00:57:37,784
Are we this or that, you know?
1526
00:57:37,784 --> 00:57:41,290
If it didn't touch something--
you know, it's that old saying,
1527
00:57:41,290 --> 00:57:43,169
"If it gets you, you got it."
1528
00:57:43,169 --> 00:57:44,714
If it didn't touch some fear
that we had
1529
00:57:44,714 --> 00:57:46,885
harbored about ourselves,
it wouldn't have mattered,
1530
00:57:46,885 --> 00:57:48,221
you know?
1531
00:57:48,221 --> 00:57:49,975
Was it touching truth?
1532
00:57:49,975 --> 00:57:52,981
It was touching fear,
and fear is a powerful thing.
1533
00:57:52,981 --> 00:57:56,154
♪ ♪
1534
00:57:56,154 --> 00:57:57,866
So who's in the Brat Pack then?
1535
00:57:57,866 --> 00:57:59,326
I would--
[laughs]
1536
00:57:59,326 --> 00:58:00,830
No, it's interesting.
1537
00:58:00,830 --> 00:58:01,999
I mean, it's not---
it's ridiculous.
1538
00:58:01,999 --> 00:58:03,209
But it's--
BRET: No, no.
1539
00:58:03,209 --> 00:58:05,422
It's true. It's--
- Because it's '80s culture.
1540
00:58:05,422 --> 00:58:06,758
It's you.
It's Judd Nelson.
1541
00:58:06,758 --> 00:58:08,094
It's Emilio.
1542
00:58:08,094 --> 00:58:09,556
I've been trying to answer
this question for years.
1543
00:58:09,556 --> 00:58:10,558
ALLY: Yeah.
1544
00:58:10,558 --> 00:58:12,520
The Brat Pack was just us.
1545
00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:13,898
People would say
Molly's in the Brat Pack.
1546
00:58:13,898 --> 00:58:15,317
- Really?
- Molly Ringwald.
1547
00:58:15,317 --> 00:58:19,241
I don't see Demi
or Ally being part of that.
1548
00:58:19,241 --> 00:58:21,204
Demi.
Ally.
1549
00:58:21,204 --> 00:58:24,418
- Jon Cryer.
- I am not in the Brat Pack.
1550
00:58:24,418 --> 00:58:26,214
What are
the Brat Pack movies?
1551
00:58:26,214 --> 00:58:27,592
I don't know.
1552
00:58:27,592 --> 00:58:28,969
Is Fast Times at
Ridgemont High Brat Pack?
1553
00:58:28,969 --> 00:58:31,307
No dice.
[laughter]
1554
00:58:31,307 --> 00:58:33,979
Is Young Guns
a Brat Pack movie? No.
1555
00:58:33,979 --> 00:58:35,315
MICHAEL: The Outsiders,
1556
00:58:35,315 --> 00:58:36,317
well, Emilio and Rob Lowe
were in that,
1557
00:58:36,317 --> 00:58:38,196
but is Tom Cruise
in the Brat Pack?
1558
00:58:38,196 --> 00:58:39,866
[Yello's "Oh Yeah"]
1559
00:58:39,866 --> 00:58:41,327
I've got to do
what's good for me.
1560
00:58:41,327 --> 00:58:43,081
Would you put Matt Dillon
in the Brat Pack?
1561
00:58:43,081 --> 00:58:45,085
- I don't know.
- Sean in the outer ring.
1562
00:58:45,085 --> 00:58:46,379
Relax.
1563
00:58:46,379 --> 00:58:48,091
Well, you were probably
the center of the nucleus
1564
00:58:48,091 --> 00:58:49,594
because of the article.
1565
00:58:49,594 --> 00:58:50,680
And then you were
in the two movies.
1566
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:52,057
But then so was Judd.
1567
00:58:52,057 --> 00:58:54,521
Judd Nelson,
Ally Sheedy, Molly Ringwald,
1568
00:58:54,521 --> 00:58:58,111
Emilio Estevez, Rob Lowe, um...
1569
00:58:58,111 --> 00:58:59,572
- Who are we forgetting?
- Demi Moore.
1570
00:58:59,572 --> 00:59:01,242
- Demi Moore and me.
- And you.
1571
00:59:01,242 --> 00:59:03,037
And--
[laughs]
1572
00:59:03,037 --> 00:59:05,835
And that it didn't really exist
doesn't matter.
1573
00:59:05,835 --> 00:59:09,341
♪ ♪
1574
00:59:09,341 --> 00:59:12,306
All right,
we are headed over here
1575
00:59:12,306 --> 00:59:14,143
to see Howie Deutch,
who directed
1576
00:59:14,143 --> 00:59:16,565
a movie called Pretty in Pink.
1577
00:59:16,565 --> 00:59:18,610
We're passing all
the hikers going up in--
1578
00:59:18,610 --> 00:59:20,531
up for their Sunday hikes.
1579
00:59:20,531 --> 00:59:22,409
God, look at them all.
1580
00:59:22,409 --> 00:59:24,288
LA, baby.
1581
00:59:24,288 --> 00:59:26,125
HOWIE: Andrew McCarthy.
- Howie.
1582
00:59:26,125 --> 00:59:28,004
HOWIE: Oh, my gosh.
- [laughs]
1583
00:59:28,004 --> 00:59:29,131
How are you?
1584
00:59:29,131 --> 00:59:30,175
[laughs]
Good.
1585
00:59:30,175 --> 00:59:31,344
HOWIE: 30 years.
1586
00:59:31,344 --> 00:59:32,597
ANDREW: That's what
I was just saying.
1587
00:59:32,597 --> 00:59:34,141
I think it's, like, 30 years.
1588
00:59:34,141 --> 00:59:35,310
HOWIE: You're gonna be
out of focus.
1589
00:59:35,310 --> 00:59:36,605
ANDREW: Come here.
HOWIE: How are you?
1590
00:59:36,605 --> 00:59:38,066
ANDREW: [laughs]
Good. How are you?
1591
00:59:38,066 --> 00:59:39,151
Great to see you.
ANDREW: Good to see you.
1592
00:59:39,151 --> 00:59:40,195
It's cool that
you're doing this.
1593
00:59:40,195 --> 00:59:41,364
ANDREW:
Yeah, well, we'll see.
1594
00:59:41,364 --> 00:59:43,409
[laughter]
1595
00:59:43,409 --> 00:59:46,374
So the Brat Pack--
what is it about that label?
1596
00:59:46,374 --> 00:59:48,754
I don't know.
I mean, the Brat Pack--
1597
00:59:48,754 --> 00:59:50,090
I was on the outside
of all that.
1598
00:59:50,090 --> 00:59:52,469
- Yeah.
- But my wife, Lea, wasn't.
1599
00:59:52,469 --> 00:59:55,768
And a lot of other actors,
like yourself, weren't.
1600
00:59:55,768 --> 00:59:59,901
And I feel like that is,
like, the headline sometimes
1601
00:59:59,901 --> 01:00:01,237
that they're stuck with.
1602
01:00:01,237 --> 01:00:03,282
That's the reason
I want to do it, why 35--
1603
01:00:03,282 --> 01:00:05,203
how many years later?
HOWIE: Well, but ask yourself.
1604
01:00:05,203 --> 01:00:07,792
Why don't you want
to be included in that?
1605
01:00:07,792 --> 01:00:11,716
That's part of why we're
doing this interview, I think,
1606
01:00:11,716 --> 01:00:13,554
this doc.
- Those movies--
1607
01:00:13,554 --> 01:00:15,098
and our movie
included in that--
1608
01:00:15,098 --> 01:00:17,687
represent a moment
for a certain generation
1609
01:00:17,687 --> 01:00:18,981
of people that is their youth.
1610
01:00:18,981 --> 01:00:20,860
And they're like,
"I feel just like that girl.
1611
01:00:20,860 --> 01:00:22,320
That's me."
1612
01:00:22,320 --> 01:00:23,782
And taking ownership
like that in movies--
1613
01:00:23,782 --> 01:00:25,452
that's why movies
are so powerful
1614
01:00:25,452 --> 01:00:27,414
because people can identify
and connect
1615
01:00:27,414 --> 01:00:28,667
and they're not
so alone anymore.
1616
01:00:28,667 --> 01:00:30,838
I hated the Brat Pack
for decades
1617
01:00:30,838 --> 01:00:32,758
because of my own defensiveness
of, I'm not a brat.
1618
01:00:32,758 --> 01:00:35,514
But let me look at,
what does the Brat Pack mean
1619
01:00:35,514 --> 01:00:39,354
to me then
and then what does it mean now.
1620
01:00:39,354 --> 01:00:42,152
And when I--
it finally kind of dawned
1621
01:00:42,152 --> 01:00:46,745
on me that maybe there's bounty
in that and not just brats.
1622
01:00:46,745 --> 01:00:48,999
Everybody's haunted
by something like that.
1623
01:00:48,999 --> 01:00:54,802
And sometimes, it makes you
do better work, you know,
1624
01:00:54,802 --> 01:00:56,347
and sometimes not.
1625
01:00:56,347 --> 01:00:59,019
[door rings]
BLANE: Jesus.
1626
01:00:59,019 --> 01:01:02,025
[soft dramatic music]
1627
01:01:02,025 --> 01:01:06,826
♪ ♪
1628
01:01:06,826 --> 01:01:08,454
HOWIE: And I remember
every time we were
1629
01:01:08,454 --> 01:01:12,170
about to do a scene,
Andrew, you would say to me,
1630
01:01:12,170 --> 01:01:13,507
"OK, tense up."
1631
01:01:13,507 --> 01:01:14,926
Like, that was--
- I do remember that.
1632
01:01:14,926 --> 01:01:16,345
Jesus, I forgot.
- Yeah, you'd say, tense up.
1633
01:01:16,345 --> 01:01:17,723
And I'd laugh.
1634
01:01:17,723 --> 01:01:18,934
And it relaxed me,
actually,
1635
01:01:18,934 --> 01:01:21,313
'cause I thought
you actually were nervous
1636
01:01:21,313 --> 01:01:23,735
and that it helped, the humor.
1637
01:01:23,735 --> 01:01:25,405
And action.
1638
01:01:25,405 --> 01:01:26,908
ANDREW: So the end of
Pretty in Pink--
1639
01:01:26,908 --> 01:01:29,914
we changed the whole ending.
You know better than me.
1640
01:01:29,914 --> 01:01:31,793
HOWIE: The test screening
was a disaster.
1641
01:01:31,793 --> 01:01:33,129
The original ending
was she goes with John.
1642
01:01:33,129 --> 01:01:34,674
You have a date,
1643
01:01:34,674 --> 01:01:36,553
and they walk into
the dance circle,
1644
01:01:36,553 --> 01:01:37,722
and they start to dance,
1645
01:01:37,722 --> 01:01:39,391
and it becomes
a swirl of pink,
1646
01:01:39,391 --> 01:01:40,686
and it's over.
1647
01:01:40,686 --> 01:01:43,107
And booing like
I've never heard in my life--
1648
01:01:43,107 --> 01:01:45,613
screaming, booing,
you know, yelling,
1649
01:01:45,613 --> 01:01:48,577
throwing things.
It was like, what?
1650
01:01:48,577 --> 01:01:52,042
And that was it.
It was just a disaster.
1651
01:01:52,042 --> 01:01:54,631
And they gave us one day
to shoot all of it,
1652
01:01:54,631 --> 01:01:56,676
which you know,
which is insane,
1653
01:01:56,676 --> 01:01:57,928
but that's what they did.
1654
01:01:57,928 --> 01:01:59,348
And you had to do it
on a stage even though--
1655
01:01:59,348 --> 01:02:00,934
ANDREW: Yeah, yeah.
We did it on the stage.
1656
01:02:00,934 --> 01:02:02,354
You were
in New York shooting.
1657
01:02:02,354 --> 01:02:03,857
Yeah, I was in New York
doing a play,
1658
01:02:03,857 --> 01:02:06,278
and my head was shaved because
I was playing a marine,
1659
01:02:06,278 --> 01:02:09,201
so they had to make me a wig,
and it was such a bad wig.
1660
01:02:09,201 --> 01:02:11,246
I always joked that
if they'd known
1661
01:02:11,246 --> 01:02:13,042
that we'd still be talking
about it 35 years later,
1662
01:02:13,042 --> 01:02:14,503
they would have paid
for a better wig.
1663
01:02:14,503 --> 01:02:15,923
[laughs]
ANDREW: It was a terrible wig,
1664
01:02:15,923 --> 01:02:18,219
and it just sat on my head
like some bird's nest
1665
01:02:18,219 --> 01:02:20,557
and gave me
such a forlorn and sad look.
1666
01:02:20,557 --> 01:02:23,104
So all I had to do was go up
to Molly and say, you know,
1667
01:02:23,104 --> 01:02:24,857
"I love you,"
or whatever the line was.
1668
01:02:24,857 --> 01:02:26,276
I love you.
1669
01:02:26,276 --> 01:02:27,530
ANDREW: I just looked so sad
1670
01:02:27,530 --> 01:02:29,534
that it did
all the acting for me.
1671
01:02:29,534 --> 01:02:31,203
Always.
1672
01:02:31,203 --> 01:02:33,124
ANDREW: You know, our youth
is there for us to look at.
1673
01:02:33,124 --> 01:02:34,794
You know,
and how has it evolved
1674
01:02:34,794 --> 01:02:36,673
then over the years,
your relationship
1675
01:02:36,673 --> 01:02:38,050
to early success?
1676
01:02:38,050 --> 01:02:39,804
Because early success
is something else.
1677
01:02:39,804 --> 01:02:41,390
It's like, you know,
Tennessee Williams wrote
1678
01:02:41,390 --> 01:02:42,935
a great article called
1679
01:02:42,935 --> 01:02:45,189
"The Catastrophe of Success"
1680
01:02:45,189 --> 01:02:47,695
when Glass Menagerie
was successful.
1681
01:02:47,695 --> 01:02:49,322
And it just, like,
blew his whole life up.
1682
01:02:49,322 --> 01:02:53,665
It's fortunate to have it,
but it's also a struggle
1683
01:02:53,665 --> 01:02:57,005
to escape being pigeonholed
into just
1684
01:02:57,005 --> 01:02:59,134
that category and that arena.
1685
01:02:59,134 --> 01:03:00,929
There's an inexplicable thing
1686
01:03:00,929 --> 01:03:03,685
that happens when something
really cooks and works
1687
01:03:03,685 --> 01:03:05,271
like the movie we did.
1688
01:03:05,271 --> 01:03:07,192
And it's funny,
trying to get back
1689
01:03:07,192 --> 01:03:09,404
to doing something--
1690
01:03:09,404 --> 01:03:11,618
sometimes, a little knowledge
is dangerous.
1691
01:03:11,618 --> 01:03:14,080
That innocence is--
yeah, we spend a lot of time
1692
01:03:14,080 --> 01:03:15,793
trying to get back to that.
[laughs]
1693
01:03:15,793 --> 01:03:17,630
HOWIE: Yeah, because
you're using more of yourself.
1694
01:03:17,630 --> 01:03:20,092
Honesty is something
you really can't fake.
1695
01:03:20,092 --> 01:03:22,263
FEE: This is Fee Waybill
for MTV here
1696
01:03:22,263 --> 01:03:24,769
at the premiere for
Pretty in Pink
1697
01:03:24,769 --> 01:03:27,315
at the lovely
Mann's Chinese Theater.
1698
01:03:27,315 --> 01:03:29,529
My mother was
a reporter for The LA Times,
1699
01:03:29,529 --> 01:03:33,954
and she also often
covered movie premieres.
1700
01:03:33,954 --> 01:03:38,254
I remember going with her to
the Pretty in Pink premiere
1701
01:03:38,254 --> 01:03:40,258
and walking up the red carpet,
1702
01:03:40,258 --> 01:03:42,680
and I got to shake
John Hughes' hand.
1703
01:03:42,680 --> 01:03:45,309
Howie Deutch,
Mr. John Hughes--
1704
01:03:45,309 --> 01:03:46,729
respectively,
the director of the film
1705
01:03:46,729 --> 01:03:48,190
and the producer
and writer of the film.
1706
01:03:48,190 --> 01:03:49,861
ANDREW: That same night
when we were in that room
1707
01:03:49,861 --> 01:03:51,656
together, as the credits
started to roll, I got up...
1708
01:03:51,656 --> 01:03:53,325
MICHAEL: Yes, you got drunk.
1709
01:03:53,325 --> 01:03:54,829
And went across the street
to the Hamburger Hamlet...
1710
01:03:54,829 --> 01:03:56,164
MICHAEL: Hamburger Hamlet.
ANDREW: And got drunk.
1711
01:03:56,164 --> 01:03:57,543
I could not sit in that room.
1712
01:03:57,543 --> 01:03:59,087
I just found that
just so nerve-wracking.
1713
01:03:59,087 --> 01:04:01,425
Well, I've seen the video
of-- of you
1714
01:04:01,425 --> 01:04:03,387
in the-- you and Spader--
- Oh, my God.
1715
01:04:03,387 --> 01:04:04,724
Yeah, that lives on.
1716
01:04:04,724 --> 01:04:06,686
- At the after party. Yes.
- I just look at that.
1717
01:04:06,686 --> 01:04:08,732
And I just-- I'm just so lost.
1718
01:04:08,732 --> 01:04:11,361
Andrew McCarthy
and James Spader.
1719
01:04:11,361 --> 01:04:13,533
James is the not-so-good guy.
1720
01:04:13,533 --> 01:04:15,036
ANDREW:
So I just look at that,
1721
01:04:15,036 --> 01:04:16,496
And I go, "Oh, my God, I was
just so young, and like--"
1722
01:04:16,496 --> 01:04:17,541
You were
a living, breathing...
1723
01:04:17,541 --> 01:04:18,585
Ill-equipped.
1724
01:04:18,585 --> 01:04:19,587
MICHAEL:
Public service announcement.
1725
01:04:19,587 --> 01:04:21,089
[laughter]
1726
01:04:21,089 --> 01:04:22,300
Kids, don't do this.
Yeah.
1727
01:04:22,300 --> 01:04:23,595
But-- and yet,
at that moment,
1728
01:04:23,595 --> 01:04:25,557
I am the aspirational--
- 100%.
1729
01:04:25,557 --> 01:04:27,185
You know?
1730
01:04:27,185 --> 01:04:29,105
Andrew, did you actually
go to your high school prom?
1731
01:04:29,105 --> 01:04:30,984
- No.
- No?
1732
01:04:30,984 --> 01:04:32,947
Why not?
1733
01:04:32,947 --> 01:04:34,700
I couldn't get a date.
1734
01:04:34,700 --> 01:04:39,459
That night encapsulated
my entire '80s career, really--
1735
01:04:39,459 --> 01:04:41,965
thrilled, yet terrified,
the ambition,
1736
01:04:41,965 --> 01:04:43,927
and yet the wanting to run,
1737
01:04:43,927 --> 01:04:46,014
and then getting clouded
by alcohol.
1738
01:04:46,014 --> 01:04:47,851
That sort of--
that night was the '80s for me.
1739
01:04:47,851 --> 01:04:49,939
[laughs]
MICHAEL: Yeah.
1740
01:04:49,939 --> 01:04:51,526
You know?
1741
01:04:51,526 --> 01:04:54,155
Party at the Palace
continues after these messages.
1742
01:04:54,155 --> 01:04:57,538
♪ ♪
1743
01:04:57,538 --> 01:05:00,627
JEANNIE: [laughs]
Herb, he's mine now.
1744
01:05:00,627 --> 01:05:01,754
Lay off.
He's mine.
1745
01:05:01,754 --> 01:05:03,090
[laughs]
HERB: Jeannie?
1746
01:05:03,090 --> 01:05:05,721
JEANNIE: Yes?
HERB: Back off before we start.
1747
01:05:05,721 --> 01:05:10,856
♪ ♪
1748
01:05:10,856 --> 01:05:12,191
Hey, could I get
a cheeseburger
1749
01:05:12,191 --> 01:05:14,697
with lettuce, tomato, onion,
and pickle?
1750
01:05:18,328 --> 01:05:20,332
Oh, we're just doing
this documentary.
1751
01:05:22,963 --> 01:05:24,800
It's about--
that's a good question.
1752
01:05:24,800 --> 01:05:27,138
It's about looking for people.
[laughs]
1753
01:05:27,138 --> 01:05:29,100
Oh, yeah?
1754
01:05:29,100 --> 01:05:30,854
It's about
a group of actors
1755
01:05:30,854 --> 01:05:32,273
from the '80s
called the Brat Pack.
1756
01:05:32,273 --> 01:05:33,275
Do you know who they were?
1757
01:05:34,444 --> 01:05:35,781
The Brat Pack.
You ever hear of that?
1758
01:05:38,285 --> 01:05:40,247
Yeah, there you go.
1759
01:05:41,374 --> 01:05:43,253
Ancient history.
Thanks, man.
1760
01:05:44,632 --> 01:05:48,515
♪ ♪
1761
01:05:48,515 --> 01:05:50,519
These people I don't know
and hadn't seen
1762
01:05:50,519 --> 01:05:53,775
in 30-odd years, we all
share this monumental moment
1763
01:05:53,775 --> 01:05:55,529
in our lives together
and all had
1764
01:05:55,529 --> 01:05:57,406
exact similar reactions to it.
1765
01:05:57,406 --> 01:05:59,703
It just lets you know
why people need community
1766
01:05:59,703 --> 01:06:01,624
and why people
don't live isolated.
1767
01:06:01,624 --> 01:06:04,713
Because knowing
that everyone else
1768
01:06:04,713 --> 01:06:07,093
went through the same thing
somehow is, you know...
1769
01:06:07,093 --> 01:06:10,266
♪ ♪
1770
01:06:10,266 --> 01:06:12,395
That's good.
1771
01:06:12,395 --> 01:06:15,527
♪ ♪
1772
01:06:15,527 --> 01:06:18,741
So I'm still trying
to pin down Judd,
1773
01:06:18,741 --> 01:06:22,123
and I think this is
my third or fourth time
1774
01:06:22,123 --> 01:06:24,962
trying to meet up with Rob.
1775
01:06:24,962 --> 01:06:26,924
When we were young,
Rob and I were not close.
1776
01:06:26,924 --> 01:06:29,805
I think we were--
we were fairly competitive.
1777
01:06:29,805 --> 01:06:32,519
I was, like, this
New York, serious actor--
1778
01:06:32,519 --> 01:06:34,022
or wanting to be.
1779
01:06:34,022 --> 01:06:37,529
And Rob was the gorgeous
LA, you know,
1780
01:06:37,529 --> 01:06:38,948
young movie star.
1781
01:06:38,948 --> 01:06:40,911
And we each had
our little niche.
1782
01:06:40,911 --> 01:06:42,873
I should probably keep
my hands on the wheel here.
1783
01:06:42,873 --> 01:06:46,213
[laughs]
Hey. Hey.
1784
01:06:46,213 --> 01:06:48,091
ROB: Hey, there he is.
ANDREW: [laughs]
1785
01:06:48,091 --> 01:06:50,221
ROB: God, when was the
last time I actually saw you?
1786
01:06:50,221 --> 01:06:52,433
ANDREW: 30 years ago.
ROB: No, it can't be.
1787
01:06:52,433 --> 01:06:56,441
I think.
[laughter]
1788
01:06:56,441 --> 01:06:58,111
Jonathan, this is my mom.
1789
01:07:02,161 --> 01:07:04,332
Uh, very nice to meet you,
Mrs. Burroughs.
1790
01:07:05,585 --> 01:07:07,046
Hello.
Hello.
1791
01:07:07,046 --> 01:07:09,342
ROB: We were so lucky to be
in the right place
1792
01:07:09,342 --> 01:07:12,557
at the right time
as the movie business
1793
01:07:12,557 --> 01:07:15,354
was beginning the transition
1794
01:07:15,354 --> 01:07:18,277
to where it landed
and still exists,
1795
01:07:18,277 --> 01:07:22,619
which is movies made
almost exclusively for 18-
1796
01:07:22,619 --> 01:07:24,497
to 20-year-olds.
1797
01:07:24,497 --> 01:07:26,669
I mean,
every summer movie that's out
1798
01:07:26,669 --> 01:07:28,965
is geared towards
that audience.
1799
01:07:28,965 --> 01:07:30,259
It wasn't always like that.
1800
01:07:30,259 --> 01:07:33,641
But we were there
at a time when that began.
1801
01:07:33,641 --> 01:07:35,520
Maybe we had something to do
with it,
1802
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:37,649
which would either be
the good news or the bad news.
1803
01:07:37,649 --> 01:07:40,613
But not only being
in the Brat Pack,
1804
01:07:40,613 --> 01:07:43,703
but being around
at that time not only
1805
01:07:43,703 --> 01:07:45,122
changed all of our lives.
1806
01:07:45,122 --> 01:07:47,919
It changed
what entertainment is.
1807
01:07:47,919 --> 01:07:49,757
It's so weird to talk about
this because we're giving--
1808
01:07:49,757 --> 01:07:51,594
because we're focusing on it,
and I'm focusing
1809
01:07:51,594 --> 01:07:52,888
on making a movie,
but it's giving it
1810
01:07:52,888 --> 01:07:54,683
such import, you know?
1811
01:07:54,683 --> 01:07:56,311
But that's the way it is when
you're focusing on anything.
1812
01:07:56,311 --> 01:07:57,564
It's--
ROB: Yes.
1813
01:07:57,564 --> 01:07:58,941
And when you--
you have to take a step back.
1814
01:07:58,941 --> 01:08:00,152
Well, any time there's
a documentary about anything,
1815
01:08:00,152 --> 01:08:01,572
it's very important.
- [laughs]
1816
01:08:01,572 --> 01:08:02,616
But you're always been
very good
1817
01:08:02,616 --> 01:08:04,202
at kind of going,
"Dude, it's not,
1818
01:08:04,202 --> 01:08:05,496
you know, curing cancer.
It's the Brat Pack."
1819
01:08:05,496 --> 01:08:06,749
[laughs]
Yes.
1820
01:08:06,749 --> 01:08:07,918
And do you think
it affected your career
1821
01:08:07,918 --> 01:08:09,337
on the immediate level?
1822
01:08:09,337 --> 01:08:12,134
There's always gonna be
some perception that bumps up
1823
01:08:12,134 --> 01:08:14,556
against how you see yourself
1824
01:08:14,556 --> 01:08:16,434
and what you think
you can do as an actor.
1825
01:08:16,434 --> 01:08:18,105
And that never changes,
I don't think.
1826
01:08:18,105 --> 01:08:19,232
Did you like
the label at first?
1827
01:08:19,232 --> 01:08:20,777
I mean, I don't recall
anyone liked it.
1828
01:08:20,777 --> 01:08:22,029
No one liked it.
1829
01:08:22,029 --> 01:08:25,662
And look, I don't want
to come off seeming
1830
01:08:25,662 --> 01:08:30,379
like I'm so Pollyanna
that I don't realize,
1831
01:08:30,379 --> 01:08:34,638
or didn't know at the time,
what a fucking disaster
1832
01:08:34,638 --> 01:08:37,936
and how mean-spirited
and what an attempt that was
1833
01:08:37,936 --> 01:08:40,900
to minimize all of our talents.
I get why it happened.
1834
01:08:40,900 --> 01:08:42,486
There were just too many of us.
1835
01:08:42,486 --> 01:08:44,700
So there had to be
a catch-all name,
1836
01:08:44,700 --> 01:08:45,785
and Brat Pack is a good name.
1837
01:08:45,785 --> 01:08:48,916
These young actors
and these movies
1838
01:08:48,916 --> 01:08:51,630
about these young actors
and these people making them
1839
01:08:51,630 --> 01:08:53,509
like John Hughes and so forth,
1840
01:08:53,509 --> 01:08:56,932
are gonna start to lead
the business in a way
1841
01:08:56,932 --> 01:08:59,020
where there are gonna be
TV shows like Glee.
1842
01:08:59,020 --> 01:09:01,942
And there's going to be--
- I mean, look at Friends.
1843
01:09:01,942 --> 01:09:03,529
The CW.
1844
01:09:03,529 --> 01:09:04,865
There's gonna be
all of these things
1845
01:09:04,865 --> 01:09:06,619
that we now take for granted--
1846
01:09:06,619 --> 01:09:08,205
don't happen
without the Brat Pack.
1847
01:09:08,205 --> 01:09:10,000
They just don't.
- I had never thought
1848
01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:13,883
of it like that,
to give it such--
1849
01:09:13,883 --> 01:09:17,682
to be such a linchpin toward
the pivot in popular
1850
01:09:17,682 --> 01:09:19,143
movie culture.
- Yeah.
1851
01:09:19,143 --> 01:09:21,189
I guess I'm just too sort
of shame-based to sort of--
1852
01:09:21,189 --> 01:09:22,567
- [laughs]
- Really.
1853
01:09:22,567 --> 01:09:24,571
To, like-- I would just go,
"Oh, no, no, no, no, no."
1854
01:09:24,571 --> 01:09:27,159
And not be able to take it
in in a certain way,
1855
01:09:27,159 --> 01:09:28,579
which is one of your gifts,
that you've
1856
01:09:28,579 --> 01:09:30,542
always been able to do that.
- I get this all the time.
1857
01:09:30,542 --> 01:09:33,046
It's like, "Oh, my God,
I love those movies. Oh.
1858
01:09:33,046 --> 01:09:35,092
God, I was a big
Andrew McCarthy guy."
1859
01:09:35,092 --> 01:09:37,137
And I'm like--
- [laughs]
1860
01:09:37,137 --> 01:09:38,933
- What the fuck?
- I know.
1861
01:09:38,933 --> 01:09:41,062
But that's because they
treat us like we're not real.
1862
01:09:41,062 --> 01:09:42,273
I get all that all the time.
1863
01:09:42,273 --> 01:09:44,235
It's like,
"Oh, Rob was so good."
1864
01:09:44,235 --> 01:09:45,822
I'm like, "Dude, no
you're talking to Andrew."
1865
01:09:45,822 --> 01:09:47,534
ROB: Hi, hello?
- [laughs]
1866
01:09:47,534 --> 01:09:50,330
Ah, forgive me
for not getting intimate.
1867
01:09:50,330 --> 01:09:53,044
Here, it's a long ride.
1868
01:09:53,044 --> 01:09:55,132
- You shouldn't have.
- I know.
1869
01:09:55,132 --> 01:09:56,467
It was like being in a group.
1870
01:09:56,467 --> 01:09:58,013
I mean, I'm not gonna say
we were the Beatles
1871
01:09:58,013 --> 01:09:59,600
or anything,
but I gotta tell you,
1872
01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:03,064
there were some times where
the frenzy around it
1873
01:10:03,064 --> 01:10:06,070
was certainly up there with
anything any of those guys did.
1874
01:10:06,070 --> 01:10:07,574
Well, we didn't fill
Shea Stadium,
1875
01:10:07,574 --> 01:10:09,201
but I mean, there were moments.
[laughs]
1876
01:10:09,201 --> 01:10:12,542
We could have.
1985, I think we could have.
1877
01:10:12,542 --> 01:10:16,257
- [laughs]
- It was fun, excitement.
1878
01:10:16,257 --> 01:10:18,428
The world is your oyster.
1879
01:10:18,428 --> 01:10:21,852
You can't believe
what's happening.
1880
01:10:21,852 --> 01:10:23,396
Confusion.
1881
01:10:23,396 --> 01:10:25,526
And it was at the height
of the Brat Pack,
1882
01:10:25,526 --> 01:10:29,660
and it was super unbelievable.
1883
01:10:29,660 --> 01:10:31,245
Agreed.
And--
1884
01:10:31,245 --> 01:10:32,582
ROB: [laughs]
- And--
1885
01:10:32,582 --> 01:10:33,876
I don't believe you one--
ANDREW: Even for me.
1886
01:10:33,876 --> 01:10:35,337
No, but even for me, agreed.
1887
01:10:35,337 --> 01:10:36,757
Like, begrudgingly,
like, this is awesome.
1888
01:10:36,757 --> 01:10:37,884
[laughs]
- OK, good.
1889
01:10:37,884 --> 01:10:39,136
OK, yeah.
Begrudging, yes.
1890
01:10:39,136 --> 01:10:40,723
Yeah, yeah.
- All right.
1891
01:10:40,723 --> 01:10:42,101
What's your memory of
the night at Sammy's house?
1892
01:10:42,101 --> 01:10:43,521
- That happened, right?
- That--
1893
01:10:43,521 --> 01:10:44,648
[laughs].
Right?
1894
01:10:44,648 --> 01:10:46,025
So what's your recollection?
1895
01:10:46,025 --> 01:10:47,319
- It started at Spago.
- Yeah.
1896
01:10:47,319 --> 01:10:48,614
Right?
1897
01:10:48,614 --> 01:10:49,658
ANDREW: You asked me
to come out,
1898
01:10:49,658 --> 01:10:50,660
and I was like, "Really?"
1899
01:10:50,660 --> 01:10:52,162
We were shooting
St. Elmo's Fire.
1900
01:10:52,162 --> 01:10:53,582
And, like, I remember
following you over the hill.
1901
01:10:53,582 --> 01:10:54,876
And I'm like, "Where's Spago?"
1902
01:10:54,876 --> 01:10:56,462
You're like, "Follow me."
- Follow me, kid.
1903
01:10:56,462 --> 01:10:57,924
- Yeah, exactly.
- Idiot.
1904
01:10:57,924 --> 01:10:59,385
I just remember sitting down
next to the person being--
1905
01:10:59,385 --> 01:11:00,596
this is Liza.
1906
01:11:00,596 --> 01:11:01,640
And I went,
"I'll have a double vodka."
1907
01:11:01,640 --> 01:11:02,934
[laughter]
1908
01:11:02,934 --> 01:11:04,103
Yeah you didn't know
Liza Minnelli
1909
01:11:04,103 --> 01:11:05,439
was gonna be there.
- I'm sorry?
1910
01:11:05,439 --> 01:11:07,151
ANDREW: No idea. And it was--
she was lovely.
1911
01:11:07,151 --> 01:11:08,696
The best.
ANDREW: She was lovely.
1912
01:11:08,696 --> 01:11:11,075
And-- but there came
a time where
1913
01:11:11,075 --> 01:11:13,664
there's that moment where
it's clear the evening is over,
1914
01:11:13,664 --> 01:11:15,626
and I think we were literally
getting up out of our seats.
1915
01:11:15,626 --> 01:11:18,966
You went,
"Let's go to Sammy's."
1916
01:11:18,966 --> 01:11:22,014
So we follow Liza Minnelli
to Sammy Davis Jr.'s house.
1917
01:11:22,014 --> 01:11:23,183
I mean,
who's not gonna do that?
1918
01:11:23,183 --> 01:11:24,351
ANDREW:
Right, and you were pretty--
1919
01:11:24,351 --> 01:11:25,730
Hi. Come on in.
1920
01:11:25,730 --> 01:11:27,399
ANDREW: Cool and savvy
and been to some things.
1921
01:11:27,399 --> 01:11:29,028
And even you were just like,
"Holy shit."
1922
01:11:29,028 --> 01:11:30,656
- Holy shit.
- He was so gracious.
1923
01:11:30,656 --> 01:11:31,784
He was playing--
he was long sober,
1924
01:11:31,784 --> 01:11:33,077
but he was playing bartender,
1925
01:11:33,077 --> 01:11:34,455
and I was getting
drunker and drunker.
1926
01:11:34,455 --> 01:11:36,334
and me and Sammy were,
like, splitting cigarettes,
1927
01:11:36,334 --> 01:11:38,421
and he's like,
"I got my eye on you cats.
1928
01:11:38,421 --> 01:11:40,175
I love what you're doing."
- "I love what you do."
1929
01:11:40,175 --> 01:11:41,804
"Keep it up."
You know?
1930
01:11:41,804 --> 01:11:43,516
And it's the only time,
in my experience,
1931
01:11:43,516 --> 01:11:45,393
that the Brat Pack
met the Rat Pack.
1932
01:11:45,393 --> 01:11:48,066
ROB: That is when the
Brat Pack met the Rat Pack.
1933
01:11:48,066 --> 01:11:50,863
When I think of the Brat Pack,
I think of nights like that
1934
01:11:50,863 --> 01:11:53,536
because that stuff
routinely happened,
1935
01:11:53,536 --> 01:11:57,042
as it does
when you were in that moment.
1936
01:11:57,042 --> 01:12:01,175
And you see that moment
recycles every generation
1937
01:12:01,175 --> 01:12:03,597
with different people,
with different names,
1938
01:12:03,597 --> 01:12:05,392
and different places,
but it's the same story.
1939
01:12:05,392 --> 01:12:07,187
Someone is having that moment.
1940
01:12:07,187 --> 01:12:09,609
It can fuck you up,
or it can be fun,
1941
01:12:09,609 --> 01:12:11,404
or it can be all of the above.
1942
01:12:11,404 --> 01:12:15,997
But there are very few people
that are ever in a place
1943
01:12:15,997 --> 01:12:17,917
to go through that moment.
1944
01:12:17,917 --> 01:12:19,253
And yet,
there always will be people
1945
01:12:19,253 --> 01:12:21,465
who will go through that moment
every generation.
1946
01:12:21,465 --> 01:12:24,890
And it always pains me when
I see some of the other folks
1947
01:12:24,890 --> 01:12:28,564
who don't realize how much love
1948
01:12:28,564 --> 01:12:31,277
is infused into the Brat Pack,
1949
01:12:31,277 --> 01:12:33,072
and it makes me sad for them.
1950
01:12:33,072 --> 01:12:34,618
ANDREW: This is what
I've come to realize.
1951
01:12:34,618 --> 01:12:37,497
There's so much goodwill there.
1952
01:12:37,497 --> 01:12:39,168
By the way,
it's nothing but goodwill...
1953
01:12:39,168 --> 01:12:40,963
- Yeah.
- Now.
1954
01:12:40,963 --> 01:12:42,592
Where does it end,
the Brat Pack?
1955
01:12:42,592 --> 01:12:44,596
I mean, does it follow us
to the end?
1956
01:12:44,596 --> 01:12:46,015
It'll for sure.
1957
01:12:46,015 --> 01:12:47,894
I mean, it should.
1958
01:12:52,027 --> 01:12:54,950
ANDREW: The great surprise for
me has been how much affection
1959
01:12:54,950 --> 01:12:56,327
we all seem to have
for each other now
1960
01:12:56,327 --> 01:12:58,749
in a way that
we didn't then, and,
1961
01:12:58,749 --> 01:13:00,753
you know,
the people I've talked to.
1962
01:13:00,753 --> 01:13:03,174
And so that's been
really nice to kind of--
1963
01:13:03,174 --> 01:13:05,387
there's a lightness
that comes with it now
1964
01:13:05,387 --> 01:13:07,182
that did not exist back then.
1965
01:13:07,182 --> 01:13:09,061
Because back then,
we were all just pressurized,
1966
01:13:09,061 --> 01:13:10,438
and trying to figure out
what to do,
1967
01:13:10,438 --> 01:13:11,942
and trying to have a career,
and like, oh, my God,
1968
01:13:11,942 --> 01:13:13,486
something just happened,
and they're calling us
1969
01:13:13,486 --> 01:13:16,409
this negative name,
and, oh, shit, what do I do?
1970
01:13:16,409 --> 01:13:19,123
Now it's all just like--
[laughs]
1971
01:13:19,123 --> 01:13:21,545
You know, who cares?
1972
01:13:21,545 --> 01:13:24,300
And if you do still care,
it's--
1973
01:13:31,439 --> 01:13:33,109
So if you had told me
1974
01:13:33,109 --> 01:13:35,155
10, 20, 30 years ago,
1975
01:13:35,155 --> 01:13:37,367
I'd be walking up to see
David Blum's apartment,
1976
01:13:37,367 --> 01:13:39,706
the writer of
the "Brat Pack" article,
1977
01:13:39,706 --> 01:13:42,044
I would have said,
"You're fucking crazy."
1978
01:13:42,044 --> 01:13:44,883
Let's see what happens.
David?
1979
01:13:44,883 --> 01:13:47,095
[laughs]
Hi.
1980
01:13:47,095 --> 01:13:48,431
- How are you?
- Hi.
1981
01:13:48,431 --> 01:13:50,060
And how are you?
- Good to meet you...
1982
01:13:50,060 --> 01:13:51,312
Nice to meet you.
1983
01:13:51,312 --> 01:13:52,523
- At long last.
- Yeah.
1984
01:13:52,523 --> 01:13:53,734
- I'm Dave.
- I'm Adrian.
1985
01:13:53,734 --> 01:13:55,070
That's Adrian.
1986
01:13:55,070 --> 01:13:56,573
I asked you this the other day,
but I--
1987
01:13:56,573 --> 01:13:59,078
I was rushing.
Do you prefer David or Dave?
1988
01:13:59,078 --> 01:14:00,163
- Dave.
- Dave.
1989
01:14:00,163 --> 01:14:04,380
OK, Dave.
So thank you. Thank you.
1990
01:14:04,380 --> 01:14:07,010
Was it a pitch to go do
a thing on Emilio?
1991
01:14:07,010 --> 01:14:08,806
Or did the mag-- were you
freelancing in New York?
1992
01:14:08,806 --> 01:14:10,058
Or were you--
- No.
1993
01:14:10,058 --> 01:14:13,649
I was on a contract
at New York Magazine,
1994
01:14:13,649 --> 01:14:17,489
and I had to do eight stories
a year, something like that.
1995
01:14:17,489 --> 01:14:19,076
And so it was just
gonna be a story
1996
01:14:19,076 --> 01:14:21,122
about a feature on Emilio?
DAVE: Mm-hmm.
1997
01:14:21,122 --> 01:14:22,959
He said, "Hey, we're
having dinner tonight,
1998
01:14:22,959 --> 01:14:26,716
me, and, you know,
Judd, and Rob."
1999
01:14:26,716 --> 01:14:28,929
They were in full flower,
having a great time,
2000
01:14:28,929 --> 01:14:31,350
drinking and toasting
and nostrovia.
2001
01:14:31,350 --> 01:14:32,937
Nostrovia.
2002
01:14:32,937 --> 01:14:34,983
DAVE: You know, a lot of people
were coming around the table.
2003
01:14:34,983 --> 01:14:38,489
And especially--
2004
01:14:38,489 --> 01:14:41,663
you know, no surprise, Rob Lowe
2005
01:14:41,663 --> 01:14:44,168
was getting a lot
of the special attention,
2006
01:14:44,168 --> 01:14:45,546
but everybody was.
2007
01:14:45,546 --> 01:14:47,884
I was getting the least
attention of all, you know,
2008
01:14:47,884 --> 01:14:49,554
which was, you know, fine,
2009
01:14:49,554 --> 01:14:51,766
and I was just really able
to observe.
2010
01:14:51,766 --> 01:14:53,227
Did you like Emilio
when you interviewed him?
2011
01:14:53,227 --> 01:14:54,856
I really did, all the way
through the whole process.
2012
01:14:54,856 --> 01:14:56,066
I didn't dislike any of them.
2013
01:14:56,066 --> 01:14:57,904
I thought they were
all quite nice.
2014
01:14:57,904 --> 01:15:00,200
It's hard to explain,
but I didn't think at the time,
2015
01:15:00,200 --> 01:15:03,122
ugh, these brats, at all.
2016
01:15:03,122 --> 01:15:04,709
So you come home
to New York then.
2017
01:15:04,709 --> 01:15:06,337
DAVE: Well,
before I came back--
2018
01:15:06,337 --> 01:15:08,341
the night before
this all happened,
2019
01:15:08,341 --> 01:15:11,055
I had gone out to dinner
with some friends who happened
2020
01:15:11,055 --> 01:15:12,432
to be in LA, journalists.
2021
01:15:12,432 --> 01:15:16,398
We had a very large meal
at this dinner.
2022
01:15:16,398 --> 01:15:18,110
And one of--
this guy from People Magazine,
2023
01:15:18,110 --> 01:15:21,242
who was a very funny writer
named Alan Richmond,
2024
01:15:21,242 --> 01:15:24,498
referred to us as
the "Fat Pack," which
2025
01:15:24,498 --> 01:15:26,670
I thought was very funny.
2026
01:15:26,670 --> 01:15:29,174
So at some point
while I was in LA,
2027
01:15:29,174 --> 01:15:31,888
I was driving from
one place to another,
2028
01:15:31,888 --> 01:15:34,978
and that joke
re-emerged in my brain,
2029
01:15:34,978 --> 01:15:36,355
and I said, "Brat Pack."
2030
01:15:36,355 --> 01:15:39,696
And then I thought, "Ha,
a light bulb has gone on,
2031
01:15:39,696 --> 01:15:41,783
and I now have a title."
2032
01:15:41,783 --> 01:15:44,079
I thought, "Well, this is fun.
It's fun."
2033
01:15:44,079 --> 01:15:45,874
I just thought, "Oh, oh, yeah."
2034
01:15:45,874 --> 01:15:49,716
And Emilio did that thing where
he got the cheaper ticket.
2035
01:15:49,716 --> 01:15:51,010
And I don't know.
2036
01:15:51,010 --> 01:15:52,722
I just start listing
all the things.
2037
01:15:52,722 --> 01:15:54,601
You know, they said that thing
about Tim Hutton.
2038
01:15:54,601 --> 01:15:55,769
Oh, yeah.
They're brats.
2039
01:15:55,769 --> 01:15:57,022
You know, it's funny.
2040
01:15:57,022 --> 01:15:58,650
It honestly didn't
cross my mind, really,
2041
01:15:58,650 --> 01:16:02,032
that it was
all that big a deal.
2042
01:16:02,032 --> 01:16:05,079
The article comes out,
and, you know, the cover--
2043
01:16:05,079 --> 01:16:06,332
Hollywood's Brat Pack,
2044
01:16:06,332 --> 01:16:07,334
those guys.
It really--
2045
01:16:07,334 --> 01:16:08,837
you know,
people were like, "Wow."
2046
01:16:08,837 --> 01:16:11,926
And the phrase definitely--
people dug it, you know.
2047
01:16:11,926 --> 01:16:13,471
Well, one or two people
were like, "Wow,"
2048
01:16:13,471 --> 01:16:14,974
that's like really mean."
You know?
2049
01:16:14,974 --> 01:16:16,561
I thought it was pretty,
like, whoa.
2050
01:16:16,561 --> 01:16:18,774
DAVE: Well, you referred to it
in, I think, that Today Show
2051
01:16:18,774 --> 01:16:20,653
interview as "scathing."
That was the word.
2052
01:16:20,653 --> 01:16:22,405
I thought it was-- yeah,
I did think it was scathing.
2053
01:16:22,405 --> 01:16:23,742
Didn't you?
2054
01:16:23,742 --> 01:16:26,790
Um...
2055
01:16:26,790 --> 01:16:29,044
I mean, I guess
in retrospect, yes.
2056
01:16:29,044 --> 01:16:33,135
Um, at the time, no.
2057
01:16:33,135 --> 01:16:38,437
I was proud of my creation
of the phrase.
2058
01:16:38,437 --> 01:16:39,982
Look, I was--
2059
01:16:39,982 --> 01:16:41,736
I don't know
how old you were then.
2060
01:16:41,736 --> 01:16:42,863
I was--
- I was, like, 22.
2061
01:16:42,863 --> 01:16:44,408
OK.
I was 29.
2062
01:16:44,408 --> 01:16:48,875
And I definitely knew
it was gonna have a reaction.
2063
01:16:48,875 --> 01:16:50,671
Yeah.
I mean, it certainly was--
2064
01:16:50,671 --> 01:16:53,008
my recollection is that
it was instantaneous,
2065
01:16:53,008 --> 01:16:56,641
and burned deep, and...
2066
01:16:56,641 --> 01:16:59,605
I just remember seeing
that cover and being like,
2067
01:16:59,605 --> 01:17:01,275
"What just happened?"
2068
01:17:01,275 --> 01:17:03,237
Really, it hit like that--
like a car wreck.
2069
01:17:03,237 --> 01:17:05,617
And I felt instantly--
and it proved to be
2070
01:17:05,617 --> 01:17:07,036
the experience--
that I'd lost control
2071
01:17:07,036 --> 01:17:08,915
of the narrative of my career.
2072
01:17:08,915 --> 01:17:10,334
Well, that's very well put.
2073
01:17:10,334 --> 01:17:12,380
What really upset me
about the article
2074
01:17:12,380 --> 01:17:15,011
was that it felt like
they're not that interested
2075
01:17:15,011 --> 01:17:16,765
in doing the craft of it.
2076
01:17:16,765 --> 01:17:19,436
They want to be famous
and be-- and party.
2077
01:17:19,436 --> 01:17:21,774
And what I was--
you know, I took offense
2078
01:17:21,774 --> 01:17:23,444
at that because I felt like--
2079
01:17:23,444 --> 01:17:25,281
Well, you had gone
to acting school,
2080
01:17:25,281 --> 01:17:26,743
and you had gone to college.
2081
01:17:26,743 --> 01:17:28,412
You got--
did you graduate from NYU?
2082
01:17:28,412 --> 01:17:29,456
I did not.
I was kicked out.
2083
01:17:29,456 --> 01:17:30,709
Oh, oh.
2084
01:17:30,709 --> 01:17:32,170
But I did go
to acting school, yeah.
2085
01:17:32,170 --> 01:17:33,840
I think part of my point
was, you know,
2086
01:17:33,840 --> 01:17:35,259
guys like Tom Cruise,
who went straight
2087
01:17:35,259 --> 01:17:38,140
from a production
of A Christmas Carol
2088
01:17:38,140 --> 01:17:40,144
to being in--
- Being in Top Gun.
2089
01:17:40,144 --> 01:17:41,480
[chuckling]
2090
01:17:41,480 --> 01:17:42,983
It worked out for him.
2091
01:17:42,983 --> 01:17:44,987
It felt like to me,
and I know to the other people
2092
01:17:44,987 --> 01:17:46,406
at the time--
putting words
2093
01:17:46,406 --> 01:17:48,912
in their mouth--
we have to reposition this,
2094
01:17:48,912 --> 01:17:51,166
or deflect this,
or get away from this,
2095
01:17:51,166 --> 01:17:52,545
or whatever
because it certainly
2096
01:17:52,545 --> 01:17:55,466
wasn't perceived in
the industry as a compliment.
2097
01:17:55,466 --> 01:17:59,934
It would take
a Herculean ability
2098
01:17:59,934 --> 01:18:04,527
to be sort of cool
with yourself to,
2099
01:18:04,527 --> 01:18:08,367
in June of 1985, go,
"Hey, this is a good thing."
2100
01:18:08,367 --> 01:18:09,870
I get that.
2101
01:18:09,870 --> 01:18:11,874
I mean, nobody was gonna,
like, immediately go,
2102
01:18:11,874 --> 01:18:13,628
"Oh, my God,
we're gonna be famous forever.
2103
01:18:13,628 --> 01:18:15,674
This is like a--"
[laughs]
2104
01:18:15,674 --> 01:18:17,260
Who would think that?
2105
01:18:17,260 --> 01:18:18,722
To me, when I look back on it,
2106
01:18:18,722 --> 01:18:21,603
I actually feel more redeemed
than ever
2107
01:18:21,603 --> 01:18:23,857
by the fact
that I was not wrong.
2108
01:18:23,857 --> 01:18:26,028
You were a bunch of talented
and interesting people
2109
01:18:26,028 --> 01:18:27,781
to write about
at a point when Hollywood
2110
01:18:27,781 --> 01:18:30,453
had finally decided
young adults
2111
01:18:30,453 --> 01:18:33,292
should be in movies.
Why not?
2112
01:18:33,292 --> 01:18:34,879
But in fairness,
you didn't write it
2113
01:18:34,879 --> 01:18:36,841
with any affection toward them.
You wrote it with more of a--
2114
01:18:36,841 --> 01:18:38,637
You were all adults.
2115
01:18:38,637 --> 01:18:40,056
I would not have written
that story about minors.
2116
01:18:40,056 --> 01:18:41,308
Yeah, sure.
2117
01:18:41,308 --> 01:18:43,103
DAVE: No, I mean, I felt
that I could do that.
2118
01:18:43,103 --> 01:18:44,481
And I felt that--
this is maybe
2119
01:18:44,481 --> 01:18:46,109
not the best analogy,
but Woody Allen,
2120
01:18:46,109 --> 01:18:48,489
at one point in his travails
2121
01:18:48,489 --> 01:18:51,036
of recent memory, said,
"I'm in it--
2122
01:18:51,036 --> 01:18:53,457
I'm cool with it because
of the Knicks tickets."
2123
01:18:53,457 --> 01:18:55,419
[chuckles]
And I thought, "Wow, really?"
2124
01:18:55,419 --> 01:18:57,215
That's-- you know,
for him, that's what it is,
2125
01:18:57,215 --> 01:18:59,344
getting to sit courtside
at the Knicks.
2126
01:18:59,344 --> 01:19:01,724
OK, and I don't even know
what that means, but--
2127
01:19:01,724 --> 01:19:03,477
DAVE: Well, it's just like,
there's trade-offs
2128
01:19:03,477 --> 01:19:05,147
to being a celebrity.
- Uh-huh.
2129
01:19:05,147 --> 01:19:06,734
DAVE:
And some of it is positive.
2130
01:19:06,734 --> 01:19:11,326
You get whisked around the gate
to get into the nightclub.
2131
01:19:11,326 --> 01:19:14,082
These people wanted
to be written about.
2132
01:19:14,082 --> 01:19:16,294
These people agreed
to talk to me.
2133
01:19:16,294 --> 01:19:17,923
These people behaved
the way they did.
2134
01:19:17,923 --> 01:19:19,426
I'm doing my job
as a journalist.
2135
01:19:19,426 --> 01:19:21,263
It wasn't meant to destroy
or hurt anyone
2136
01:19:21,263 --> 01:19:23,935
but really just to define
a group of people
2137
01:19:23,935 --> 01:19:26,858
in a clever
and interesting way.
2138
01:19:26,858 --> 01:19:28,485
There were a couple of things
in the article that were
2139
01:19:28,485 --> 01:19:30,197
just plain-old not nice,
and I'm sure
2140
01:19:30,197 --> 01:19:32,995
I should have
been scolded by somebody,
2141
01:19:32,995 --> 01:19:36,334
and I was.
I was just trying to be funny.
2142
01:19:36,334 --> 01:19:39,633
And I actually think I may--
2143
01:19:39,633 --> 01:19:42,013
I hope I won't sound
too arrogant by thinking
2144
01:19:42,013 --> 01:19:43,432
that I might have succeeded.
2145
01:19:43,432 --> 01:19:45,227
They were all on
Donahue one day
2146
01:19:45,227 --> 01:19:47,649
for promoting St. Elmo's Fire,
2147
01:19:47,649 --> 01:19:49,987
and Donahue was, at the time,
you know, a very popular show,
2148
01:19:49,987 --> 01:19:52,325
and they were
all together on stage.
2149
01:19:52,325 --> 01:19:54,245
And he's running around
with his microphone.
2150
01:19:54,245 --> 01:19:56,834
And Richard Schickel, who was
the critic of TIME Magazine...
2151
01:19:56,834 --> 01:19:58,378
TIME Magazine, yeah.
2152
01:19:58,378 --> 01:20:00,466
Was there, it seemed to me,
to attack me.
2153
01:20:00,466 --> 01:20:03,388
The article reviewed
the life and apparently
2154
01:20:03,388 --> 01:20:06,979
followed the so-called
Brat Pack for a couple of days.
2155
01:20:06,979 --> 01:20:08,900
RICHARD: Could I apologize
for my profession for that?
2156
01:20:08,900 --> 01:20:10,027
[laughter]
- Oh, thank you.
2157
01:20:10,027 --> 01:20:11,614
Thank you.
2158
01:20:11,614 --> 01:20:13,618
RICHARD: I really thought that
was a scurrilous article.
2159
01:20:13,618 --> 01:20:15,496
[applause]
2160
01:20:15,496 --> 01:20:18,001
And I'm like, "Really?"
2161
01:20:18,001 --> 01:20:19,839
That seems a little harsh,
you know?
2162
01:20:19,839 --> 01:20:21,801
The film critic
at TIME Magazine.
2163
01:20:21,801 --> 01:20:23,888
Well, St. Elmo's Fire became--
and, you know,
2164
01:20:23,888 --> 01:20:26,101
again, it became a hit.
2165
01:20:26,101 --> 01:20:27,855
And ultimately,
I think I should have gotten
2166
01:20:27,855 --> 01:20:29,900
more credit
for helping that along.
2167
01:20:29,900 --> 01:20:31,153
[laughter]
2168
01:20:31,153 --> 01:20:32,698
Honestly, no, I'm serious.
2169
01:20:32,698 --> 01:20:35,704
You know, controversy sells.
2170
01:20:35,704 --> 01:20:37,206
Did it affect your career?
2171
01:20:37,206 --> 01:20:39,670
DAVE: Not as much as I thought
it was going to.
2172
01:20:39,670 --> 01:20:42,634
I really thought that
I was gonna be suddenly ushered
2173
01:20:42,634 --> 01:20:45,765
into Tina Brown's office.
I've spent my whole--
2174
01:20:45,765 --> 01:20:49,022
honestly, really, whole life,
it comes up sooner
2175
01:20:49,022 --> 01:20:52,486
or later with people I know.
You created the Brat Pack?
2176
01:20:52,486 --> 01:20:54,073
I mean, people just
literally don't know
2177
01:20:54,073 --> 01:20:55,619
how to process
that information.
2178
01:20:55,619 --> 01:20:57,079
Like I said, I'm proud of it.
It's fine.
2179
01:20:57,079 --> 01:20:59,668
I think-- I think
I have no regrets,
2180
01:20:59,668 --> 01:21:01,589
and I'm glad
it's lived on forever,
2181
01:21:01,589 --> 01:21:05,680
but it's not the great--
2182
01:21:05,680 --> 01:21:09,312
I hope it's not
the greatest thing I ever did.
2183
01:21:09,312 --> 01:21:10,941
I really do.
2184
01:21:10,941 --> 01:21:12,778
When you say that,
I hope I'm not known for--
2185
01:21:12,778 --> 01:21:15,449
you sound like a member
of the Brat Pack.
2186
01:21:15,449 --> 01:21:17,036
So if you could
wave a magic wand
2187
01:21:17,036 --> 01:21:19,667
and do anything different
about that article, would you?
2188
01:21:19,667 --> 01:21:24,342
No, partially because,
you know, you're 29--
2189
01:21:24,342 --> 01:21:26,555
look, I think
I can say this to you
2190
01:21:26,555 --> 01:21:28,810
and you hopefully will get it,
is that you make--
2191
01:21:28,810 --> 01:21:31,189
that's when you make mistakes.
- Yeah.
2192
01:21:31,189 --> 01:21:32,316
You know?
2193
01:21:32,316 --> 01:21:33,945
And even if it was a mistake--
2194
01:21:33,945 --> 01:21:35,824
and I still don't think
it was--
2195
01:21:35,824 --> 01:21:38,370
you got to take chances
and just swing
2196
01:21:38,370 --> 01:21:40,457
and do crazy things.
2197
01:21:40,457 --> 01:21:42,461
When I talk to you here now,
2198
01:21:42,461 --> 01:21:47,138
I have this sort of affection
for you in spite--
2199
01:21:47,138 --> 01:21:48,599
No, I totally understand.
2200
01:21:48,599 --> 01:21:50,812
We have--
even though we've never met
2201
01:21:50,812 --> 01:21:52,314
and never been in contact,
we have something.
2202
01:21:52,314 --> 01:21:53,483
We share something.
2203
01:21:53,483 --> 01:21:55,029
And I actually think
you've actually
2204
01:21:55,029 --> 01:21:57,241
found the emotional
beating heart
2205
01:21:57,241 --> 01:21:59,997
of the story, which is,
you know,
2206
01:21:59,997 --> 01:22:02,001
that we all share something.
2207
01:22:02,001 --> 01:22:04,882
Who would have ever thought
we'd even be here?
2208
01:22:04,882 --> 01:22:07,470
ANDREW: Yeah.
- It's crazy.
2209
01:22:07,470 --> 01:22:10,977
But that's cool, I think.
- Thank you.
2210
01:22:10,977 --> 01:22:12,354
DAVE: It was really great
to meet you.
2211
01:22:12,354 --> 01:22:13,941
ANDREW: Thank you.
2212
01:22:13,941 --> 01:22:15,695
DAVE: Stay in touch, and let me
know how this is going.
2213
01:22:15,695 --> 01:22:18,743
I will.
And we'll get out of your hair.
2214
01:22:18,743 --> 01:22:21,749
Um, but do you think
you could have been nicer?
2215
01:22:21,749 --> 01:22:23,795
- [chuckles]
- Seriously.
2216
01:22:23,795 --> 01:22:25,422
I mean,
it's collateral damage,
2217
01:22:25,422 --> 01:22:28,638
in my view,
to making the point that
2218
01:22:28,638 --> 01:22:30,224
here was a bunch of people
2219
01:22:30,224 --> 01:22:32,311
that had become very famous
and popular,
2220
01:22:32,311 --> 01:22:33,815
and I'm calling them
the "Brat Pack,"
2221
01:22:33,815 --> 01:22:35,192
and here's how I'm saying it.
2222
01:22:35,192 --> 01:22:36,612
But there was
collateral damage?
2223
01:22:36,612 --> 01:22:38,031
DAVE: Oh, yeah.
2224
01:22:38,031 --> 01:22:40,327
I guess I feel like, you know,
sticks and stones.
2225
01:22:40,327 --> 01:22:47,258
♪ ♪
2226
01:23:01,745 --> 01:23:03,415
ANDREW:
We went through something.
2227
01:23:03,415 --> 01:23:04,877
ALLY: Yeah.
ANDREW: And it was real.
2228
01:23:04,877 --> 01:23:06,504
And the fallout was real.
2229
01:23:06,504 --> 01:23:10,513
And it affected our lives,
my life, profoundly.
2230
01:23:10,513 --> 01:23:11,765
Yeah, me, too.
2231
01:23:11,765 --> 01:23:14,312
ANDREW: To this day.
2232
01:23:14,312 --> 01:23:15,690
Me, too.
2233
01:23:15,690 --> 01:23:17,527
ANDREW: And so
we're members of a club
2234
01:23:17,527 --> 01:23:19,489
we never asked to join.
2235
01:23:19,489 --> 01:23:22,746
And so there is
an unspoken kind of like--
2236
01:23:22,746 --> 01:23:24,248
just that.
2237
01:23:24,248 --> 01:23:26,419
It's like, oh, hello, hello.
ALLY: Yeah.
2238
01:23:26,419 --> 01:23:28,340
And I am really grateful
for that,
2239
01:23:28,340 --> 01:23:30,595
for having the people
2240
01:23:30,595 --> 01:23:34,895
that I know I have
this connection with.
2241
01:23:34,895 --> 01:23:36,439
Do you know what I mean?
2242
01:23:36,439 --> 01:23:39,655
The fondness that
I feel for everybody,
2243
01:23:39,655 --> 01:23:41,157
that's real.
2244
01:23:41,157 --> 01:23:42,953
I mean, that's--
that's genuine.
2245
01:23:42,953 --> 01:23:44,205
You know?
2246
01:23:44,205 --> 01:23:48,421
♪ ♪
2247
01:23:48,421 --> 01:23:50,175
And, you know,
on your tombstone--
2248
01:23:50,175 --> 01:23:51,595
I think I heard you say this--
2249
01:23:51,595 --> 01:23:55,102
"Emilio Brat Pack Estevez"
will be your epitaph.
2250
01:23:55,102 --> 01:23:56,104
I did.
I said it last year.
2251
01:23:56,104 --> 01:23:57,314
Did you?
Yeah.
2252
01:23:57,314 --> 01:23:59,026
And it's--
EMILIO: Yeah.
2253
01:23:59,026 --> 01:24:01,949
And-- and what
do you think of that?
2254
01:24:01,949 --> 01:24:03,953
I think that
we have no control
2255
01:24:03,953 --> 01:24:05,957
of how we're remembered.
2256
01:24:05,957 --> 01:24:07,877
The toothpaste is--
it's out of the tube.
2257
01:24:07,877 --> 01:24:09,673
It's not coming back.
- [laughs]
2258
01:24:09,673 --> 01:24:12,386
And so I think for us,
it's like
2259
01:24:12,386 --> 01:24:16,979
there's a--
there's a surrender to it.
2260
01:24:16,979 --> 01:24:19,651
ANDREW: It is part of--
warts and all,
2261
01:24:19,651 --> 01:24:22,574
part of who I, you, we are.
2262
01:24:22,574 --> 01:24:26,289
And you, and I, and the
other people in the Brat Pack
2263
01:24:26,289 --> 01:24:29,630
are in--
are bound together--
2264
01:24:29,630 --> 01:24:30,882
Inexorably.
2265
01:24:30,882 --> 01:24:32,134
ANDREW: Inexorably.
That's the word.
2266
01:24:32,134 --> 01:24:33,554
It's true.
2267
01:24:33,554 --> 01:24:34,556
ANDREW: But it's like,
I don't know you
2268
01:24:34,556 --> 01:24:35,725
in 30-odd years.
2269
01:24:35,725 --> 01:24:37,227
I hadn't seen Demi
in all these years,
2270
01:24:37,227 --> 01:24:38,814
and yet,
if I saw someone else
2271
01:24:38,814 --> 01:24:40,317
I'd been in movies with
30 years ago,
2272
01:24:40,317 --> 01:24:41,737
I'd have nothing
to talk about with them.
2273
01:24:41,737 --> 01:24:43,239
Right.
ANDREW: Nothing.
2274
01:24:43,239 --> 01:24:46,204
And yet, we have this
deep thing in common.
2275
01:24:46,204 --> 01:24:49,335
That's-- I don't--
the look in your eye--
2276
01:24:49,335 --> 01:24:51,005
No, it's unusual.
ANDREW: It's certainly unusual.
2277
01:24:51,005 --> 01:24:52,466
At best, it's unusual.
2278
01:24:52,466 --> 01:24:54,095
ANDREW: And it's--
and I don't know.
2279
01:24:54,095 --> 01:24:56,140
I find it a beautiful thing
to actually get to go
2280
01:24:56,140 --> 01:24:57,727
and see you and talk to you
about that.
2281
01:24:57,727 --> 01:25:02,111
I find that exciting
and, like, liberating
2282
01:25:02,111 --> 01:25:04,741
in a certain way.
Thank you.
2283
01:25:04,741 --> 01:25:06,119
EMILIO: Of course.
Hey, man.
2284
01:25:06,119 --> 01:25:07,246
Nice to see you.
ANDREW: It's great to see you.
2285
01:25:07,246 --> 01:25:09,543
And we're both wearing
the same shirt.
2286
01:25:09,543 --> 01:25:13,049
In my opinion, it was kind of
the end of old Hollywood.
2287
01:25:13,049 --> 01:25:14,427
I mean, even the idea--
2288
01:25:14,427 --> 01:25:16,139
the Rat Pack, Brat Pack--
2289
01:25:16,139 --> 01:25:20,188
was trying to, like,
hold on to the last vestiges
2290
01:25:20,188 --> 01:25:22,944
of old Hollywood.
And you guys were involved.
2291
01:25:22,944 --> 01:25:26,577
Well, that's kind of cool.
[laughter]
2292
01:25:26,577 --> 01:25:28,121
You know, like Al Pacino
because of The Godfather--
2293
01:25:28,121 --> 01:25:29,331
he goes,
it's taken me a lifetime
2294
01:25:29,331 --> 01:25:30,877
to accept The Godfather.
- Exactly.
2295
01:25:30,877 --> 01:25:33,047
If it takes Al Pacino
that 50 years
2296
01:25:33,047 --> 01:25:34,885
to accept The Godfather,
I'm in good company.
2297
01:25:34,885 --> 01:25:36,638
Exactly.
Al Pacino.
2298
01:25:36,638 --> 01:25:38,099
I mean, God bless us,
but Pretty in Pink
2299
01:25:38,099 --> 01:25:39,477
is not The Godfather.
But you know--
2300
01:25:39,477 --> 01:25:40,980
[laughter]
- Agreed.
2301
01:25:40,980 --> 01:25:44,654
We all made it mean something
and in varying degrees.
2302
01:25:44,654 --> 01:25:46,658
That's right.
We all made it mean something.
2303
01:25:46,658 --> 01:25:48,996
And it actually wasn't even
about really any of us.
2304
01:25:48,996 --> 01:25:51,167
It was about the person
who wrote it
2305
01:25:51,167 --> 01:25:53,672
trying to be clever
and get their next job.
2306
01:25:53,672 --> 01:25:56,469
- Yeah.
- [laughs]
2307
01:25:56,469 --> 01:25:58,599
ANDREW: Yeah.
2308
01:25:58,599 --> 01:26:00,393
♪ ♪
2309
01:26:00,393 --> 01:26:02,732
Yeah.
2310
01:26:02,732 --> 01:26:04,569
My youth, I ran from.
2311
01:26:04,569 --> 01:26:09,538
The very thing that I was
identified as and/or with,
2312
01:26:09,538 --> 01:26:11,457
I dissociated from it
because I didn't
2313
01:26:11,457 --> 01:26:13,921
want that to be who I was.
2314
01:26:13,921 --> 01:26:16,927
And so to bring that up
into my present,
2315
01:26:16,927 --> 01:26:19,683
like, oh.
2316
01:26:19,683 --> 01:26:21,854
Yeah, that personally of value.
2317
01:26:21,854 --> 01:26:23,356
I'm more than the sum
of my parts
2318
01:26:23,356 --> 01:26:25,151
because of being a member
of the Brat Pack.
2319
01:26:25,151 --> 01:26:26,863
Yes, it gives you cachet.
2320
01:26:26,863 --> 01:26:31,038
You were part of the lexicon,
and that gave you great cachet.
2321
01:26:31,038 --> 01:26:32,542
Maybe not at the time
you didn't think that,
2322
01:26:32,542 --> 01:26:34,003
but it did.
2323
01:26:34,003 --> 01:26:36,257
So we are part of the sort of
'80s cultural lexicon.
2324
01:26:36,257 --> 01:26:39,221
Yes, we are.
Yes, we are, and proud of it.
2325
01:26:39,221 --> 01:26:40,850
You're awesome.
Come here, Lauren.
2326
01:26:40,850 --> 01:26:42,477
[laughter]
2327
01:26:42,477 --> 01:26:45,400
Listen, to be a part
of anything that anybody
2328
01:26:45,400 --> 01:26:48,824
still talks about
30-plus years
2329
01:26:48,824 --> 01:26:51,914
is really, really
a special thing.
2330
01:26:51,914 --> 01:26:54,418
And when we're 21, 22,
you're just sort of
2331
01:26:54,418 --> 01:26:55,963
cusping into the world.
2332
01:26:55,963 --> 01:26:57,926
Your life is a blank slate
to be written upon,
2333
01:26:57,926 --> 01:26:59,721
and it's a thrilling time
in life.
2334
01:26:59,721 --> 01:27:02,602
And we represent that
to that generation of people
2335
01:27:02,602 --> 01:27:04,898
who are coming of age
at that moment.
2336
01:27:04,898 --> 01:27:06,610
And they look at you.
They look at me.
2337
01:27:06,610 --> 01:27:08,363
And they go, "Oh,
the Brat Pack movies."
2338
01:27:08,363 --> 01:27:09,950
And I see their eyes
glaze over because they're
2339
01:27:09,950 --> 01:27:12,037
really, in many ways,
talking about themselves...
2340
01:27:12,037 --> 01:27:13,039
100%
ANDREW: And their own youth.
2341
01:27:13,039 --> 01:27:14,458
ROB: Yeah.
2342
01:27:14,458 --> 01:27:16,295
And we are the avatars
of that moment in their life.
2343
01:27:16,295 --> 01:27:17,590
ROB: Yeah.
2344
01:27:17,590 --> 01:27:18,676
ANDREW: And I've come
to realize
2345
01:27:18,676 --> 01:27:20,387
that's a beautiful thing.
- Totally.
2346
01:27:20,387 --> 01:27:22,307
Something that was
so hated by me
2347
01:27:22,307 --> 01:27:27,442
and I felt did me damage
has become a blessing
2348
01:27:27,442 --> 01:27:29,196
is kind of amazing.
DAVE: Wow.
2349
01:27:29,196 --> 01:27:31,994
Sometimes,
we need some distance.
2350
01:27:31,994 --> 01:27:34,958
We got mixed up with each other
on this crazy thing
2351
01:27:34,958 --> 01:27:36,878
that none of us intended.
2352
01:27:36,878 --> 01:27:39,718
It all just turned into
2353
01:27:39,718 --> 01:27:43,266
tremendous, deep fondness
2354
01:27:43,266 --> 01:27:45,311
for you and for everybody
2355
01:27:45,311 --> 01:27:47,023
who was involved in it,
you know?
2356
01:27:47,023 --> 01:27:50,447
It was a complicated time,
a really complicated time.
2357
01:27:50,447 --> 01:27:55,290
But the good memories
I have are--
2358
01:27:55,290 --> 01:27:57,127
are deep, you know?
2359
01:27:57,127 --> 01:27:59,256
And they're-- they're in there.
2360
01:27:59,256 --> 01:28:03,431
So if somebody said,
"Was it worth it?"
2361
01:28:03,431 --> 01:28:06,897
Yes, it was.
2362
01:28:06,897 --> 01:28:09,861
Oh, yeah.
ALLY: Yeah.
2363
01:28:09,861 --> 01:28:11,405
Oh, yeah.
2364
01:28:11,405 --> 01:28:14,161
Well, we're very
different people personally.
2365
01:28:14,161 --> 01:28:16,165
And if you threw us together
outside of
2366
01:28:16,165 --> 01:28:18,587
that kind of situation,
I don't know if we'd get along.
2367
01:28:18,587 --> 01:28:20,591
But somehow,
2368
01:28:20,591 --> 01:28:21,968
when we were
all there together,
2369
01:28:21,968 --> 01:28:23,346
the ship kind of
balanced itself out.
2370
01:28:23,346 --> 01:28:27,312
♪ ♪
2371
01:28:27,312 --> 01:28:30,318
[Zoe Fox and the Rocket Clocks
"Don't You (Forget About Me)"]
2372
01:28:30,318 --> 01:28:36,873
♪ ♪
2373
01:28:36,873 --> 01:28:40,965
ZOE: ♪ Won't you
come see about me ♪
2374
01:28:40,965 --> 01:28:43,929
♪ I'll be alone dancing ♪
2375
01:28:43,929 --> 01:28:46,016
♪ And you know it, baby ♪
2376
01:28:46,016 --> 01:28:49,858
♪ Tell me
your troubles and doubts ♪
2377
01:28:49,858 --> 01:28:55,118
♪ Giving me everything
inside and out ♪
2378
01:28:55,118 --> 01:28:59,126
♪ Love's strange,
so real in the dark ♪
2379
01:28:59,126 --> 01:29:03,844
♪ Think of the tender things
that we were working on ♪
2380
01:29:03,844 --> 01:29:08,477
♪ Slow change
may pull us apart ♪
2381
01:29:08,477 --> 01:29:13,487
♪ When the light gets
into your heart, baby ♪
2382
01:29:13,487 --> 01:29:19,416
♪ Don't you forget about me ♪
2383
01:29:19,416 --> 01:29:23,132
[phone ringing]
2384
01:29:23,132 --> 01:29:26,180
ANDREW: Hello.
Judd?
2385
01:29:26,180 --> 01:29:29,186
[Simple Minds'
"Don't You (Forget About Me)"
2386
01:29:29,186 --> 01:29:31,691
JIM: ♪ Hey, hey, hey, hey ♪
2387
01:29:31,691 --> 01:29:35,490
♪ Ooh ♪
2388
01:29:35,490 --> 01:29:39,791
♪ Whoa ♪
2389
01:29:39,791 --> 01:29:44,717
♪ ♪
2390
01:29:44,717 --> 01:29:48,391
♪ Won't you
come see about me ♪
2391
01:29:48,391 --> 01:29:51,146
♪ I'll be alone dancing ♪
2392
01:29:51,146 --> 01:29:52,900
♪ You know it, baby ♪
2393
01:29:52,900 --> 01:29:56,783
♪ Tell me
your troubles and doubts ♪
2394
01:29:56,783 --> 01:30:00,916
♪ Giving everything
inside and out ♪
2395
01:30:00,916 --> 01:30:05,133
♪ And love's strange,
so real in the dark ♪
2396
01:30:05,133 --> 01:30:09,934
♪ Think of the tender things
that we were working on ♪
2397
01:30:09,934 --> 01:30:14,318
♪ Slow change
may pull us apart ♪
2398
01:30:14,318 --> 01:30:18,618
♪ When the light
gets into your heart, baby ♪
2399
01:30:18,618 --> 01:30:22,960
♪ Don't you forget about me ♪
2400
01:30:22,960 --> 01:30:25,048
♪ ♪
2401
01:30:25,048 --> 01:30:27,553
♪ Don't, don't, don't, don't ♪
2402
01:30:27,553 --> 01:30:31,603
♪ Don't you forget about me ♪
2403
01:30:31,603 --> 01:30:35,903
♪ ♪
2404
01:30:35,903 --> 01:30:39,952
♪ Will you stand above me ♪
2405
01:30:39,952 --> 01:30:42,374
♪ Look my way ♪
2406
01:30:42,374 --> 01:30:44,463
♪ Never love me ♪