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Downloaded from
YTS.MX

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We're animation nerds
who love this medium.

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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

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If you can do it in live-action,
then we don't want to do it.

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<i>So we would have to come up</i>
<i>with even crazier things.</i>

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We definitely had to make some big swings

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<i>in order to arrive</i>
<i>at something that was uniquely ours.</i>

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Okay. This show is going to be weird.

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-Pete Docter, <i>Meet the Pickles.</i>

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At Pixar Animation Studios
we've done 27 feature films now,

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<i>and they're all super hard.</i>

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<i>They're fun, but they always blow up</i>
<i>and then stuff happens</i>

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and we have to scramble
to put it back together.

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<i>We're used to that.</i>
<i>We understand the challenge.</i>

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When long-form streaming
started coming up,

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we were like,
"Woah. This looks really intriguing."

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All of the conventions and things
that we've gotten used to

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are out the window.

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How do we make something
that is broken up into smaller bites,

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continue to grab people
from one week to the next.

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It probably uses
completely new technology.

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There are probably all sorts of problems
we have no idea how to solve.

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So, let's do it.

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<i>Come on, look alive!</i>
<i>Game day, folks!</i>

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<i>Win or Lose</i> is our first long-form series.

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It's an eight-episode series

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<i>where we follow a coed</i>
<i>middle school softball team</i>

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<i>in the week leading up</i>
<i>to their championship game.</i>

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We're making roughly eight episodes,
18 minutes each.

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<i>You're talking about 145-or-so minutes.</i>

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So it's longer
than one of our feature films.

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<i>That's a lot of animation to produce.</i>

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And in a shorter amount of time.

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Most of our films, 90 minutes,
take about five years to make.

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If you do the math, 145 minutes
would take about eight years.

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Well, we told these guys, "You got four."

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Challenge accepted. Here we go.

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We are a smaller show than most,
and so we have to do more with less.

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<i>In terms of ambition,</i>

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I don't know if any of us knew
what we were signing up for.

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<i>One of the big things we wanted</i>
<i>to have was an ensemble cast.</i>

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You can't do that in a film.

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You can't spend
as much time with each character.

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<i>A multi-protagonist story.</i>

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Streaming is the perfect format for that.

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<i>This show doesn't have</i>
<i>one main character</i>

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<i>that we can put all of our people behind.</i>

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We have eight that are on equal footing
in terms of their importance.

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You are all winners.

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Each episode is following
a different main character.

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And we get to work our way up
to that game, through the perspective

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<i>and through the lens</i>
<i>of a completely different character.</i>

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- Say "Pickles."
- Pickles!

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You get a chance to walk
in someone else's shoes for a week

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<i>and see what the problem is in their life</i>

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<i>and then experience that</i>
<i>through animation.</i>

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Each character has what
we're calling their own animation device.

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<i>And this is almost like a personified</i>
<i>glimpse of their emotions.</i>

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<i>Practice, practice.</i>
<i>Come on, you can do it.</i>

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For Laurie, softball brings more stress
'cause she's trying to impress her dad.

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Laurie's story, her problem being anxiety.

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How we feeling? I'm feeling goodish-bad.

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How do you move past that,
and how do you shake that off?

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Her confidence is not there.

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<i>And, of course, there's the pressure</i>
<i>of her dad being the coach of the team.</i>

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The coach inflates up to a huge blimp.

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Strike two!

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<i>Van is a very hard-working mom.</i>

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Van's mommy magic,
which is all rainbows and sparkles.

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<i>She's bringing color with her</i>
<i>to this dull environment.</i>

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She's the person
that comes into the office

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<i>and she brightens everyone's day.</i>

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Guess what?
It's Rochelle's playoff game today!

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Rochelle is the catcher.
It's a tough position to play.

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Rochelle, the world comes apart

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<i>and floats</i>
<i>whenever she feels stressed out.</i>

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-<i>We have Frank's armor.</i>

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He's the umpire
and he has to make the calls.

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<i>And some people</i>
<i>don't agree with his calls.</i>

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<i>And so, in order to deal with that,</i>
<i>he's built this armored shield.</i>

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Yuwen, who's the macho pitcher
on the team,

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<i>his main animation device is that you go</i>
<i>inside his little paper craft heart.</i>

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Please like me.

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Ira is this character that sees the world

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through his toilet paper periscope.

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We have Ira's 2D animation world,
which slots

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<i>into the 3D world</i>
<i>through his kaleidoscope.</i>

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Another character we have
is our character, Kai,

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<i>who's the new kid in town</i>
<i>trying to find where she belongs.</i>

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Kai, the flying and the sinking.

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<i>Flying when she feels like</i>

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<i>she's really helping people</i>
<i>and feeling really successful,</i>

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<i>to when she shuts down,</i>
<i>she sinks below the ground</i>

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<i>into a sunken place.</i>

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<i>It's great fun to try to figure out</i>
<i>a new idea for every single episode.</i>

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The cool thing about this show
is that, because it's about perspective,

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<i>sometimes I would grow</i>
<i>more attached to one character</i>

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<i>and Michael grow more</i>
<i>attached to the other.</i>

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You do have a point on the exit.

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He's almost coming in
like he's the savior here.

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It helped make the episode stronger
because we'd be arguing

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from that different
character's perspective.

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I'm not quite getting
the idea of the gut punch

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to motivate his arms being flung forward.

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And taking both of our points of view
and mashing 'em together,

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<i>always constantly bettering</i>
<i>each other's work as we go.</i>

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I never worked with two directors

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who also carry
the equal footing on the show,

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<i>and just seeing both</i>
<i>Yates and Carrie merge</i>

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<i>and it becomes</i>
<i>the overall voice of the show,</i>

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it was just very beautiful to watch.

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<i>Carrie and Michael</i>
<i>were story artists at Pixar for a while,</i>

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<i>and for a little bit there,</i>
<i>they were office mates.</i>

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And so we would talk a lot.

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Always pitching ideas back and forth,
showing each other our scenes.

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<i>And one thing we noticed</i>
<i>was we would often have</i>

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<i>different impressions of the same event.</i>

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We always talked about it.

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Like, why are our perceptions
of this different?

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We'd always be analyzing
how we each had a different interpretation

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<i>of how a meeting went.</i>

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<i>One of us was like,</i>
<i>"That was terrible."</i>

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<i>And the other was like, "No, it was fine.</i>
<i>What are you talking about?"</i>

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The spirit of that idea
gave birth to the idea

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of <i>Win or Lose</i> and how we all
experience things differently.

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<i>We'd start meeting up after hours.</i>

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<i>We would go to like local coffee shops</i>
<i>and just brainstorm different things.</i>

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Sometimes we would improv dialogue
as well as a way of writing,

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<i>- just like start to become the character.</i>
- No!

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<i>Michael is always drawing.</i>

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<i>Yeah, I draw all the time.</i>

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<i>He's got a sketchbook that's brilliant.</i>

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<i>I carry sketchbooks</i>
<i>with me everywhere.</i>

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<i>Full of just constantly,</i>
<i>like, riffing on who these characters are.</i>

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<i>What it looks like when they act,</i>
<i>what their design is.</i>

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<i>And a lot of times,</i>
<i>it was just us</i>

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<i>talking about like our own families,</i>
<i>life experiences,</i>

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<i>like Vanessa, who's, like, the single mom.</i>

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And that was something that was
really interesting to me,

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to tell a story of a single mom
'cause my mom was a single mom.

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My sister is a single mom.
Like Rochelle, for example.

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<i>This is me at this age.</i>

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<i>When I was in middle school, I used to,</i>
<i>like, always try to make money.</i>

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I think I just wanted to buy video games.

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<i>The first initial pitch was like,</i>
<i>you go to the school classroom,</i>

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and then each episode
you follow a different kid home

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and you see what their home life is like.
That's what the episode would be.

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<i>Then Carrie, who played softball as a kid,</i>
<i>was like, "What if it's a softball team?"</i>

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There's different personalities,
and it was cool,

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the girls that I played with
weren't who I was going to school with.

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I played softball growing up,
and it's just such a unique environment.

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And the sport itself...
Okay, I love it.

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<i>Because it has</i>
<i>this great metaphor for life.</i>

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<i>You're playing this game...</i>

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-Run, Carrie, run!
-Go! Go! Go!

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<i>...that there's a lot of time</i>
<i>where you can think</i>

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<i>and you can think on your mistakes.</i>

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<i>And so you really have to learn to move on</i>

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<i>if you make a mistake,</i>
<i>and focus on the next play.</i>

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Homerun for Grandpa!
Yeah!

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<i>Win or Lose</i> has a lot
of what we call "perspective views."

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And that is like animation fun.

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<i>Anxiety, what does that feel like?</i>

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Make that into a character.

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It seems straightforward,
but it's really, really difficult.

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<i>Laurie, the voice of her anxiety</i>

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is a creature that grows
through her entire episode.

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Let's just replay
all the mistakes you made today.

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<i>And it says all the worst thoughts</i>
<i>we all have in our head about ourselves.</i>

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That's some deep trauma.
You wanna unpack that?

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We should unpack that now.

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And we did many iterations trying to find

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<i>what's the right level</i>
<i>of derpiness for this thing?</i>

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<i>How does it evolve</i>
<i>over the course of her episode?</i>

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So, in the beginning, Laurie's anxiety
is small and insignificant,

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<i>and then grows and grows and grows.</i>
<i>And what does that turn into?</i>

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You want it to be fun.
You don't want it to be gross,

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like various mud monsters or poo,

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frankly...

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<i>came up a lot.</i>

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<i>Excusez-moi?</i>

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<i>And then Lou and I said, okay,</i>

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we need to have a bigger idea
about what this is.

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<i>And we came up with the idea</i>

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<i>that Laurie's challenge</i>
<i>is between faith and doubt.</i>

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I have faith,
but sometimes, the doubt creeps in.

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And the faith is faith in her father.

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<i>But she's wracked with doubt.</i>

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<i>And so, we said,</i>
<i>"Let's use that metaphor."</i>

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So we used faith
as, like, the Holy Spirit,

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as a metaphor,
and doubt would have been the snake.

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<i>And so, if you look in the final form</i>
<i>of the blob monster,</i>

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<i>it's actually just coiled up around her</i>
<i>like a giant snake.</i>

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We all know, like, Laurie was sort of
based on Carrie in some way.

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She says she's not Laurie,
but she's Laurie in the show.

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There's a few similarities
between Laurie and I.

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<i>My dad was my coach.</i>

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<i>My dad, he's just, like, such a good dad</i>
<i>and such a good coach</i>

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and I really struggled with softball.

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I'm not the most coordinated.

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Way to go, way to go!

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And I always felt like
I was letting him down,

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and I think I was letting him down.

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<i>I learned so much</i>
<i>from that time in my life.</i>

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Go, Carrie!

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<i>It's just so formative,</i>
<i>like, being on a team.</i>

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I do really relate to Laurie.
I do really relate to

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that pressure of, like,
I'm just looking for approval here,

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like, I hate this sport.

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- Are you having fun?
- Loads.

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<i>I liked sports</i>
<i>a little bit more than Laurie did,</i>

212
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<i>but I still performed</i>
<i>with quite a bit of anxiety.</i>

213
00:10:11.444 --> 00:10:13.195
One of my first coaches was my mom.

214
00:10:13.279 --> 00:10:15.364
So I actually know what it's like

215
00:10:15.448 --> 00:10:18.159
to have, you know,
your parent there on the sideline,

216
00:10:18.242 --> 00:10:22.121
maybe critiquing you a little bit more
than they're critiquing the other players.

217
00:10:22.204 --> 00:10:25.458
That's always fun, and then going home
and talking about it over dinner,

218
00:10:25.541 --> 00:10:26.917
all the mistakes you made.

219
00:10:27.001 --> 00:10:28.294
That's what we're trying to do,

220
00:10:28.377 --> 00:10:33.215
is seep up this sense of being a human
and the specificity of what that is

221
00:10:33.299 --> 00:10:35.968
and connect that to the storytelling.

222
00:10:36.052 --> 00:10:38.220
I do see myself probably the most in Ira.

223
00:10:38.929 --> 00:10:42.058
<i>I'm gonna make a fun world for myself.</i>

224
00:10:42.141 --> 00:10:44.268
The Ira episode. When I was a kid,

225
00:10:44.352 --> 00:10:47.521
<i>I had these older friends that I shouldn't</i>
<i>have been hanging out with.</i>

226
00:10:47.605 --> 00:10:50.608
I'm not sure why they hung out with me,
they were way older.

227
00:10:50.691 --> 00:10:55.029
<i>But it was such a big learning</i>
<i>and maturing phase for me.</i>

228
00:10:55.112 --> 00:11:00.242
MOYER:<i> For Ira's episode, we wanted</i>
<i>to make it that he had this real,</i>

229
00:11:00.326 --> 00:11:03.162
<i>like, little kid fantasy universe.</i>

230
00:11:03.245 --> 00:11:04.789
<i>It just seemed like 2D</i>

231
00:11:04.872 --> 00:11:07.792
<i>was a really exciting opportunity</i>
<i>to be able to do that.</i>

232
00:11:07.875 --> 00:11:10.294
Whatever you can think of, you can draw.

233
00:11:10.378 --> 00:11:12.129
<i>And I think 2D gave us the flexibility</i>

234
00:11:12.213 --> 00:11:17.510
to be able to really just embrace
the imagination of a little child.

235
00:11:17.593 --> 00:11:22.556
<i>We had Ira interacting with Cheryl,</i>
<i>who is the snack lady.</i>

236
00:11:22.640 --> 00:11:25.559
When Ira looks at Cheryl
through his scope,

237
00:11:25.643 --> 00:11:28.187
<i>you have to match up the 2D</i>
<i>with the 3D in the same shot,</i>

238
00:11:28.270 --> 00:11:29.980
<i>which also presented some challenges.</i>

239
00:11:30.064 --> 00:11:31.857
<i>Really interesting questions came up,</i>

240
00:11:31.941 --> 00:11:35.152
like should the 2D element drop a shadow
in the 3D world?

241
00:11:35.236 --> 00:11:38.447
When a character
is having a perspective moment,

242
00:11:38.531 --> 00:11:40.282
<i>how does that affect the physical world?</i>

243
00:11:40.366 --> 00:11:42.618
<i>Is this something that everyone can see?</i>

244
00:11:42.702 --> 00:11:44.412
<i>Is it something only he can see?</i>

245
00:11:44.495 --> 00:11:46.205
<i>Should this thing that's not real,</i>

246
00:11:46.288 --> 00:11:49.083
<i>that's part of his imagination,</i>
<i>affect the world around him?</i>

247
00:11:49.166 --> 00:11:50.334
<i>We decided, no,</i>

248
00:11:50.418 --> 00:11:52.878
because it's something
that is only visible to Ira.

249
00:11:52.962 --> 00:11:55.256
It doesn't make sense
that it's casting a shadow.

250
00:11:55.339 --> 00:11:56.757
<i>It should just be affecting him.</i>

251
00:11:59.844 --> 00:12:02.596
One of the most exciting parts
about this show

252
00:12:02.680 --> 00:12:08.352
is that Carrie and Yates draw from
so many things out in the world.

253
00:12:10.938 --> 00:12:14.275
You watch TikTok and YouTube
and you just watch all these things.

254
00:12:14.358 --> 00:12:17.278
<i>It's like, it's inspiring,</i>
<i>and that gets infused into our show.</i>

255
00:12:17.361 --> 00:12:19.196
- That's my favorite part.
- Pure gold, right?

256
00:12:19.280 --> 00:12:21.574
One of the props
that we deal with a lot on this show

257
00:12:21.657 --> 00:12:23.868
just comes from the modern age,
which is the phone.

258
00:12:23.951 --> 00:12:24.952
<i>Every kid has a phone.</i>

259
00:12:25.035 --> 00:12:28.038
And there's a lot of beats
and jokes and whatnot

260
00:12:28.122 --> 00:12:30.916
that come through watching
what happens on the phone.

261
00:12:31.000 --> 00:12:34.587
You won't just see a character
on their phone, but go in with them.

262
00:12:34.670 --> 00:12:37.381
<i>Like what texting feels like,</i>
<i>what dating apps feel like.</i>

263
00:12:37.465 --> 00:12:41.260
And then even when you're a mother
looking into your daughter's phone,

264
00:12:41.343 --> 00:12:42.678
what that feels like.

265
00:12:42.762 --> 00:12:45.556
<i>Which is different than</i>
<i>when the daughter is in her phone.</i>

266
00:12:45.639 --> 00:12:48.559
<i>And even talking to strangers online.</i>
<i>What that feels like.</i>

267
00:12:48.642 --> 00:12:50.478
<i>It just kept evolving as we went.</i>

268
00:12:50.561 --> 00:12:54.023
Could we actually do something
where we go in and it actually feels like

269
00:12:54.106 --> 00:12:55.816
there's this whole other world in there,

270
00:12:55.900 --> 00:12:58.652
<i>where you become an avatar</i>
<i>and it's more like a video game.</i>

271
00:12:58.736 --> 00:13:00.946
<i>It's a little bit more engaging</i>
<i>and relatable.</i>

272
00:13:01.030 --> 00:13:04.325
We tried to make it a unique experience
to each one instead of,

273
00:13:04.408 --> 00:13:07.077
"Oh, this is what
everyone's digital life is like."

274
00:13:07.161 --> 00:13:09.955
<i>Because, like the show as a whole,</i>

275
00:13:10.039 --> 00:13:13.542
<i>it's their own perspective of what</i>
<i>the digital world will feel like.</i>

276
00:13:13.626 --> 00:13:15.920
<i>Lou actually came up</i>
<i>with this really cool</i>

277
00:13:16.003 --> 00:13:19.715
<i>8-bit animation style</i>
<i>for a video game that Ira is playing.</i>

278
00:13:19.799 --> 00:13:22.384
Almost like an homage
to old-school video games.

279
00:13:23.969 --> 00:13:28.015
<i>In Frank's case, he was on a dating app,</i>
<i>running around, battling off people</i>

280
00:13:28.098 --> 00:13:30.017
<i>- who want to match with him.</i>
-Not you.

281
00:13:30.100 --> 00:13:33.062
Sometimes, when I watch the show,
when we get to that dating stuff,

282
00:13:33.145 --> 00:13:34.772
I'm like, "Yeah, we also made that."

283
00:13:34.855 --> 00:13:37.233
There's just so many things.
I can't even keep track of it anymore.

284
00:13:38.609 --> 00:13:40.986
Frank hits a little
too close to home for me.

285
00:13:41.737 --> 00:13:43.113
<i>I'm much more of a Frank guy.</i>

286
00:13:43.197 --> 00:13:45.032
Give me a sweater vest
any day of the week.

287
00:13:45.115 --> 00:13:48.077
The fact that each episode
follows a different character

288
00:13:48.160 --> 00:13:51.497
allows you to do these explorations of,

289
00:13:51.580 --> 00:13:53.833
"Okay, how does that character
see the world?"

290
00:13:53.916 --> 00:13:56.252
There isn't one reality.

291
00:13:56.335 --> 00:14:00.005
There isn't one way of thinking
about the world or seeing situations.

292
00:14:00.089 --> 00:14:02.716
What's unique to that perspective on life

293
00:14:02.800 --> 00:14:05.761
and what are they feeling,
and how do we show that feeling?

294
00:14:05.845 --> 00:14:09.640
<i>For instance, Frank,</i>
<i>he has to defend himself</i>

295
00:14:09.723 --> 00:14:13.310
<i>from the slings and arrows</i>
<i>of the crowd yelling insults at him.</i>

296
00:14:13.394 --> 00:14:16.397
<i>- So what did those insults look like?</i>
<i>- </i>

297
00:14:16.480 --> 00:14:18.190
And it would just be all hands on deck.

298
00:14:18.274 --> 00:14:21.318
<i>Every department,</i>
<i>throwing in ideas to try to figure out</i>

299
00:14:21.402 --> 00:14:22.987
<i>what's the best way to achieve that?</i>

300
00:14:23.070 --> 00:14:25.531
What does it actually mean
for the armor to come on?

301
00:14:25.614 --> 00:14:27.825
<i>And how does it come on?</i>
<i>Does it come on at once?</i>

302
00:14:27.908 --> 00:14:30.661
<i>Does it just appear?</i>
<i>And is there a glowing effect?</i>

303
00:14:30.744 --> 00:14:33.038
You start seeing the stuff
that Art is producing,

304
00:14:33.122 --> 00:14:36.250
and suddenly it doesn't become
this abstract hypothetical.

305
00:14:36.333 --> 00:14:38.127
<i>It's no longer you just thinking,</i>

306
00:14:38.210 --> 00:14:41.338
<i>"Frank putting on his armor</i>
<i>is just a really loose drawing I did."</i>

307
00:14:41.422 --> 00:14:44.133
<i>Suddenly it feels like,</i>
<i>"This is what it's gonna be."</i>

308
00:14:44.216 --> 00:14:45.593
<i>It becomes really inspiring</i>

309
00:14:45.676 --> 00:14:48.512
<i>'cause you're no longer</i>
<i>trying to conjure something.</i>

310
00:14:48.596 --> 00:14:50.264
<i>You're trying to channel something.</i>

311
00:14:50.347 --> 00:14:52.182
<i>You're seeing</i>
<i>the characters as characters.</i>

312
00:14:52.808 --> 00:14:54.143
Strike!

313
00:14:54.226 --> 00:14:57.438
We really wanted to keep the audience

314
00:14:57.521 --> 00:15:00.024
in tune emotionally
with where this character was

315
00:15:00.107 --> 00:15:01.734
and never break their train of thought.

316
00:15:04.528 --> 00:15:07.197
So, from the very beginning,
Carrie and Yates are very clear

317
00:15:07.281 --> 00:15:10.075
<i>that they want very cool transitions.</i>

318
00:15:10.159 --> 00:15:14.622
Not just transitioning between scenes,
but it's also how sets can transform.

319
00:15:14.705 --> 00:15:17.833
One of the first ones we did
was Frank in the classroom,

320
00:15:17.917 --> 00:15:20.502
<i>calling back to his memory</i>
<i>with his ex-girlfriend.</i>

321
00:15:22.880 --> 00:15:25.382
<i>He's in the classroom,</i>
<i>sitting at his desk,</i>

322
00:15:25.466 --> 00:15:29.303
<i>thinking about this memory</i>
<i>in a different physical space.</i>

323
00:15:29.386 --> 00:15:33.307
I am always inspired by a live stage show,

324
00:15:33.390 --> 00:15:35.100
how right in front of your eyes

325
00:15:35.184 --> 00:15:38.228
<i>they can move different pieces</i>
<i>of the sets.</i>

326
00:15:38.312 --> 00:15:41.065
I always loved that idea
of seeing something

327
00:15:41.148 --> 00:15:42.816
that changes in front of your eyes.

328
00:15:42.900 --> 00:15:45.069
And just give them
just enough time to slow down

329
00:15:45.152 --> 00:15:48.530
and the camera swung around
to match his thoughts.

330
00:15:48.614 --> 00:15:50.783
It's all about timing and the staging.

331
00:15:51.408 --> 00:15:52.660
<i>I proposed that,</i>

332
00:15:52.743 --> 00:15:56.330
<i>"How about we try to do</i>
<i>all the transitions in camera?"</i>

333
00:15:56.413 --> 00:15:59.833
<i>When Frank goes into his memory,</i>
<i>we built two sets together.</i>

334
00:15:59.917 --> 00:16:02.711
<i>We built the school sets</i>
<i>and the apartment sets.</i>

335
00:16:02.795 --> 00:16:04.630
And we merged them together,

336
00:16:04.713 --> 00:16:07.758
so that when the camera's looking one way
it's the school,

337
00:16:07.841 --> 00:16:11.637
<i>and a very simple camera movement,</i>
<i>becomes his apartment.</i>

338
00:16:11.720 --> 00:16:15.599
<i>So we can just shift between memory</i>
<i>and real life seamlessly.</i>

339
00:16:15.683 --> 00:16:19.687
So we have to break the set
in order to make that work.

340
00:16:19.770 --> 00:16:23.273
And it's just those little things
about filmmaking that I love.

341
00:16:23.357 --> 00:16:24.566
That's cinematic.

342
00:16:24.650 --> 00:16:27.236
<i>And emotionally,</i>
<i>that's what the shot needs.</i>

343
00:16:27.319 --> 00:16:28.570
"...removed his heavy helmet."

344
00:16:30.990 --> 00:16:34.410
<i>I think the one who I can relate</i>
<i>to the most, it might have been Yuwen</i>

345
00:16:34.493 --> 00:16:37.413
because deflecting emotional feelings

346
00:16:37.496 --> 00:16:41.250
and like leaning more into
playing off as a joke.

347
00:16:41.333 --> 00:16:43.502
In the Yuwen episode, when he's pitching,

348
00:16:43.585 --> 00:16:45.838
<i>and it's the way</i>
<i>that this character feels.</i>

349
00:16:45.921 --> 00:16:48.882
Here comes the Yuwen Special!

350
00:16:50.718 --> 00:16:53.721
We had to make sure that any motion we did

351
00:16:53.804 --> 00:16:58.767
<i>sold the mechanics of the softball action,</i>
<i>which is very important to Carrie.</i>

352
00:16:58.851 --> 00:17:01.520
Carrie initially was really wanting Yuwen,

353
00:17:01.603 --> 00:17:04.773
<i>in his pitch, to be really specific</i>
<i>and not too stylized,</i>

354
00:17:04.857 --> 00:17:07.609
<i>'cause we wanted to say that,</i>
<i>"He was a powerful, strong pitcher."</i>

355
00:17:07.693 --> 00:17:11.155
Then we had an animator that said,
"I'm just gonna try a double windmill."

356
00:17:13.741 --> 00:17:15.367
<i>We showed it to Carrie, and she said,</i>

357
00:17:15.451 --> 00:17:17.244
"You proved me wrong. Let's go that way."

358
00:17:17.327 --> 00:17:19.204
"Are you not entertained"?

359
00:17:19.997 --> 00:17:22.833
Something super important
to Michael and I was,

360
00:17:22.916 --> 00:17:24.710
we wanted a very stylized show.

361
00:17:25.544 --> 00:17:27.838
<i>It's okay to be cartoony.</i>

362
00:17:27.921 --> 00:17:29.923
<i>It's okay to push the expressions.</i>

363
00:17:30.007 --> 00:17:32.217
<i>Embracing that it's a caricature of life.</i>

364
00:17:32.301 --> 00:17:35.679
We wanted to hit really big expressions
throughout the show.

365
00:17:35.763 --> 00:17:37.723
<i>Super big mouths, cutout mouths.</i>

366
00:17:37.806 --> 00:17:40.642
Perhaps for an expression
on someone like Yuwen,

367
00:17:40.726 --> 00:17:44.063
remove the nose
and make the mouth extremely large.

368
00:17:44.146 --> 00:17:46.440
<i>He's a very boisterous, loud character.</i>

369
00:17:46.523 --> 00:17:50.110
We saw all these storyboards
and they were crazy,

370
00:17:50.194 --> 00:17:53.322
and we were like,
"Well, is this even possible?"

371
00:17:53.405 --> 00:17:58.243
And these are all things that are
very hard for us to do in characters.

372
00:17:58.327 --> 00:18:01.288
Because we build our characters
like a real person,

373
00:18:01.371 --> 00:18:03.999
where the mouth is in one spot
and the eyes are in one spot

374
00:18:04.083 --> 00:18:07.961
and you expect those
to stick in the same places.

375
00:18:08.045 --> 00:18:10.172
What if we could
Mr. Potato Head characters

376
00:18:10.255 --> 00:18:12.800
<i>where we take the ears or nose</i>
<i>or mouth from any character</i>

377
00:18:12.883 --> 00:18:13.884
<i>and reassemble them?</i>

378
00:18:13.967 --> 00:18:15.511
Oh, that just breaks my brain.

379
00:18:15.594 --> 00:18:19.098
There was a new process
that we created on this show specifically,

380
00:18:19.181 --> 00:18:23.936
which internally we're calling DFF,
or Detached Facial Features.

381
00:18:24.019 --> 00:18:27.439
And what that means is that
the mouth, the nose, the ears

382
00:18:27.523 --> 00:18:28.857
are all separate pieces.

383
00:18:28.941 --> 00:18:31.527
<i>And you can slide those things around</i>

384
00:18:31.610 --> 00:18:35.864
<i>and position them in weird places</i>
<i>to get very specific performance choices.</i>

385
00:18:35.948 --> 00:18:39.785
<i>There was a great test</i>
<i>that animator Rob Russ did,</i>

386
00:18:39.868 --> 00:18:42.913
<i>really, in some of the very first DFF,</i>

387
00:18:42.996 --> 00:18:44.832
where he took it, and he, like,

388
00:18:44.915 --> 00:18:47.417
did "The quick brown fox"
as a lip-sync thing.

389
00:18:47.501 --> 00:18:51.380
<i>The quick brown fox</i>
<i>jumped over the lazy dog.</i>

390
00:18:51.463 --> 00:18:55.592
<i>And just the mouth slides</i>
<i>across the face.</i>

391
00:18:55.676 --> 00:18:58.303
<i>And it took a ton of work</i>

392
00:18:58.387 --> 00:19:01.890
to figure out how to then
blend the pieces back on.

393
00:19:01.974 --> 00:19:04.935
You no longer have one surface
that you're actually shading.

394
00:19:05.018 --> 00:19:09.231
<i>You have multiple parts that you need</i>
<i>to make them look as if they were all one.</i>

395
00:19:09.314 --> 00:19:10.607
That's very tricky.

396
00:19:10.691 --> 00:19:13.068
<i>Ana and I,</i>
<i>we went through a lot of tests.</i>

397
00:19:13.152 --> 00:19:14.820
We tried to break it as much as possible.

398
00:19:14.903 --> 00:19:17.030
<i>We put freckles in areas</i>
<i>where we knew that</i>

399
00:19:17.114 --> 00:19:19.032
<i>the mouth was going to move around.</i>

400
00:19:19.116 --> 00:19:21.243
<i>Take the mouth,</i>
<i>run it over the blush area.</i>

401
00:19:21.326 --> 00:19:22.327
<i>What happens with that?</i>

402
00:19:22.411 --> 00:19:24.371
<i>Or we put a character</i>
<i>that had a beard</i>

403
00:19:24.454 --> 00:19:28.041
<i>and see what happens</i>
<i>when we have this mouth slide around.</i>

404
00:19:28.125 --> 00:19:30.794
Once we get into full production,
we're gonna have to balance

405
00:19:30.878 --> 00:19:33.213
both the shading issues
and the rigging issues.

406
00:19:33.297 --> 00:19:35.382
<i>There's still some challenges</i>
<i>with DFF.</i>

407
00:19:35.465 --> 00:19:38.927
In the end, I mean, it required
a lot of hand work to come in

408
00:19:39.011 --> 00:19:41.513
and fix stuff that was broken in DFF.

409
00:19:41.597 --> 00:19:44.975
<i>And yet, it unlocked spontaneity</i>
<i>and joy of the animators</i>

410
00:19:45.058 --> 00:19:46.643
<i>to do stuff that they've never done.</i>

411
00:19:46.727 --> 00:19:49.521
There's a freedom that you get
as an animator with a character

412
00:19:49.605 --> 00:19:52.524
that's designed in such a stylistic way.

413
00:19:52.608 --> 00:19:54.568
<i>You can push different expressions</i>

414
00:19:54.651 --> 00:19:57.362 line:5%
<i>in ways that you can't</i>
<i>with a realistic character.</i>

415
00:19:57.446 --> 00:19:59.990
Just seeing what you can do
when you give the animators

416
00:20:00.073 --> 00:20:02.826
<i>the tools to go out there and play,</i>
<i>it's really exciting.</i>

417
00:20:05.495 --> 00:20:07.873
<i>Because this is a wholly original story,</i>

418
00:20:07.956 --> 00:20:10.626
that gives you
a lot of freedom and flexibility

419
00:20:10.709 --> 00:20:14.421
to invent a style and a look
bespoke to your story.

420
00:20:14.504 --> 00:20:18.675
Initially, the design of the world
was to be, every episode is different,

421
00:20:18.759 --> 00:20:20.677
<i>because it's from everyone's perspective.</i>

422
00:20:20.761 --> 00:20:24.181
<i>And as I started to do artwork</i>
<i>and we had lots of conversations about it,</i>

423
00:20:24.264 --> 00:20:26.516
we realized that's just
going to be disjointed.

424
00:20:26.600 --> 00:20:29.311
<i>What we need is</i>
<i>what we call "a default world."</i>

425
00:20:29.394 --> 00:20:31.563
<i>It's much more caricatured</i>
<i>than our natural world.</i>

426
00:20:31.647 --> 00:20:35.734
<i>But it is a world that everyone</i>
<i>can agree on design-wise.</i>

427
00:20:35.817 --> 00:20:39.071
<i>It also means that we want</i>
<i>the tactile quality of it to be soft.</i>

428
00:20:39.154 --> 00:20:42.407
You look at their hair,
the grass and the trees,

429
00:20:42.491 --> 00:20:44.826
it all has this tactile softness.

430
00:20:45.744 --> 00:20:49.373
The hair is actually done with fuzz,
the same treatment that we would use on,

431
00:20:49.456 --> 00:20:50.916
<i>like, a character's sweater</i>

432
00:20:50.999 --> 00:20:53.752
<i>on a feature. We were like,</i>
<i>"What if we modeled the hair</i>

433
00:20:53.835 --> 00:20:56.588
<i>"and used fuzz to get that</i>
<i>hair-like detail?"</i>

434
00:20:56.672 --> 00:21:00.384
We wanted to make it look like
a felted fuzzy thing,

435
00:21:00.467 --> 00:21:03.762
but it was very nebulous
what that was gonna look like.

436
00:21:03.845 --> 00:21:06.390
<i>So we went back and forth a lot between</i>

437
00:21:06.473 --> 00:21:09.434
<i>just finding the style</i>
<i>of what this weird piece</i>

438
00:21:09.518 --> 00:21:11.270
<i>of stylistic hair was going to look like.</i>

439
00:21:11.353 --> 00:21:13.939
<i>But we used it as an opportunity</i>
<i>to try something different</i>

440
00:21:14.022 --> 00:21:17.651
and said every time we have a challenge,
we're gonna make an opportunity

441
00:21:17.734 --> 00:21:19.319
to make a design choice.

442
00:21:19.403 --> 00:21:23.573
So we made a really crazy design choice
to simplify all the vegetation and trees.

443
00:21:26.451 --> 00:21:30.956
We ended up using a very similar
technology from what the fuzz

444
00:21:31.039 --> 00:21:34.710
and from the hair technology
was to create vegetation

445
00:21:34.793 --> 00:21:38.380
<i>and control the leaves</i>
<i>and make it feel like vegetation,</i>

446
00:21:38.463 --> 00:21:42.968
but not necessarily have all the detail
that you would see in nature.

447
00:21:43.051 --> 00:21:45.178
<i>Let's give it a cartoony,</i>
<i>fluffy look.</i>

448
00:21:45.262 --> 00:21:48.348
It still reads as a tree,
but that's all you need.

449
00:21:48.432 --> 00:21:54.104
The trees got described
as artichokes or corn dogs a lot.

450
00:21:54.187 --> 00:21:57.107
It evolved from there
to where it became a game of,

451
00:21:57.190 --> 00:21:59.359
"Can you figure out
what food this looks like?"

452
00:21:59.443 --> 00:22:02.654
<i>The trees look like corn on the cob</i>
<i>or like heads of lettuce.</i>

453
00:22:02.738 --> 00:22:03.947
<i>So do people's hairstyles.</i>

454
00:22:04.031 --> 00:22:08.035
We have characters, for example,
who have, like curly fry hair.

455
00:22:08.118 --> 00:22:09.619
<i>There's cotton candy hair.</i>

456
00:22:09.703 --> 00:22:12.331
<i>Frank's hair, we talked about</i>
<i>cinnamon rolls.</i>

457
00:22:12.414 --> 00:22:15.083
<i>And every time</i>
<i>we'd come to a question of,</i>

458
00:22:15.167 --> 00:22:16.877
<i>"What does this feel like or look like?"</i>

459
00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:18.420
Someone'd go, "Spaghetti."

460
00:22:18.503 --> 00:22:20.005
Chris had this idea.

461
00:22:20.088 --> 00:22:23.383
"What if we just put, like,
a piece of bacon on her face?"

462
00:22:23.467 --> 00:22:26.261
Not real bacon, like a piece of hair
that looked like bacon.

463
00:22:26.345 --> 00:22:28.347
-Maybe fuzzy?
-Like a fuzzy piece of bacon.

464
00:22:28.430 --> 00:22:30.432
We must have just been a very hungry crew.

465
00:22:30.515 --> 00:22:32.184
Maybe I'm not feeding them enough.

466
00:22:32.267 --> 00:22:33.560
<i>It's the simple, cute foods.</i>

467
00:22:33.643 --> 00:22:36.021
I don't know where it came from,
but it's funny.

468
00:22:36.104 --> 00:22:39.316
Always looking for something
that was playful

469
00:22:39.399 --> 00:22:42.903
and maybe a little bit more
on the junk food side of things.

470
00:22:42.986 --> 00:22:45.781
<i>It's all like</i>
<i>softball field foods.</i>

471
00:22:45.864 --> 00:22:48.909
<i>Anything you can buy at the snack shack</i>
<i>is in the world.</i>

472
00:22:48.992 --> 00:22:50.786
The world is built from that.

473
00:22:52.037 --> 00:22:54.956
<i>The sports are sort of the thing</i>
<i>that connects everyone.</i>

474
00:22:55.040 --> 00:22:58.627
We never wanted it to be a sports show.
It's more of a show about life.

475
00:22:58.710 --> 00:23:00.504
<i>Sprinkle in that softball</i>

476
00:23:00.587 --> 00:23:01.797
<i>- just enough...</i>
- Out!

477
00:23:01.880 --> 00:23:04.132
...to make some unique flavor to the show.

478
00:23:04.216 --> 00:23:06.551
But not enough
that it becomes the sole focus.

479
00:23:06.635 --> 00:23:08.637
<i>Because this is just</i>
<i>a character-driven show,</i>

480
00:23:08.720 --> 00:23:11.264
<i>and that should always remain</i>
<i>at the core of it all.</i>

481
00:23:11.848 --> 00:23:15.143
Softball is the vehicle
of them just trying to find

482
00:23:15.227 --> 00:23:17.145
their sense of community,
their sense of love.

483
00:23:17.229 --> 00:23:21.400
<i>This is not a show</i>
<i>that should only be for sports people...</i>

484
00:23:22.692 --> 00:23:23.693
We tried.

485
00:23:23.777 --> 00:23:26.696
...and it is not a show
made by only sports people.

486
00:23:26.780 --> 00:23:30.575
Because we're a bunch of artists,
and even though I played softball,

487
00:23:30.659 --> 00:23:32.577
I was not the most coordinated.

488
00:23:32.661 --> 00:23:35.205
We definitely have a good mix
of those who love sports

489
00:23:35.288 --> 00:23:36.957
<i>and grew up playing sports.</i>

490
00:23:37.040 --> 00:23:41.044
<i>And then we have some folks who</i>
<i>would never set foot on a sports field.</i>

491
00:23:41.128 --> 00:23:44.714
<i>There are those kids that, like,</i>
<i>have that raw passion or that raw energy</i>

492
00:23:44.798 --> 00:23:46.758
of, "I am getting so much out of this."

493
00:23:46.842 --> 00:23:48.760
And then there's the other kids
that are just like,

494
00:23:48.844 --> 00:23:50.387
"My dad signed me up."

495
00:23:50.470 --> 00:23:51.888
We will need a catcher.

496
00:23:52.722 --> 00:23:54.558
- Terrence.
- Oh, no.

497
00:23:54.641 --> 00:23:59.229
Obviously, you got a lot
of the getting-picked-last as a kid.

498
00:23:59.312 --> 00:24:02.399
I played Little League
when I was super, super little,

499
00:24:02.482 --> 00:24:04.985
but my only memory is, like,
playing in dirt,

500
00:24:05.068 --> 00:24:07.529
playing with worms,
pulling grass out in the outfield.

501
00:24:07.612 --> 00:24:08.905
<i>I came onto the show</i>

502
00:24:08.989 --> 00:24:11.324
<i>with no knowledge</i>
<i>about softball whatsoever.</i>

503
00:24:11.408 --> 00:24:14.536
I can now say,
"Oh, this person is on first base,"

504
00:24:14.619 --> 00:24:16.538
and I feel very proud of that.

505
00:24:16.621 --> 00:24:22.711
I know that they have innings
and not touchdowns.

506
00:24:22.794 --> 00:24:26.798
That's basically all I know
about baseball.

507
00:24:26.882 --> 00:24:29.009
It's not baseball, though.
It's softball.

508
00:24:29.092 --> 00:24:30.969
It is not baseball. It is softball.

509
00:24:35.182 --> 00:24:39.311
Most of our time is spent thinking
about the internal life of characters.

510
00:24:39.394 --> 00:24:42.397
<i>It's not just making a character,</i>
<i>it's making this character.</i>

511
00:24:43.565 --> 00:24:46.276
<i>And what we end up doing</i>
<i>is we look at ourselves.</i>

512
00:24:46.359 --> 00:24:49.321
Each character is a version
of me and Carrie together.

513
00:24:49.404 --> 00:24:51.990
And that's what makes
our characters so rich,

514
00:24:52.073 --> 00:24:54.409
<i>hopefully, is that they come</i>
<i>from real places.</i>

515
00:24:54.493 --> 00:24:56.077
These are characters that you end up

516
00:24:56.161 --> 00:25:00.415
really, truly, deeply caring about
and identifying with.

517
00:25:00.499 --> 00:25:01.541
I relate to all of them.

518
00:25:01.625 --> 00:25:04.878
I feel like every character's struggle
is something that's universal.

519
00:25:04.961 --> 00:25:06.755
<i>Wanting the approval of your parent.</i>

520
00:25:06.838 --> 00:25:07.839
Am I good enough?

521
00:25:07.923 --> 00:25:09.174
<i>Wanting friends.</i>

522
00:25:09.257 --> 00:25:11.468
- Bleacher Creatures for life!
- Quack, quack!

523
00:25:11.551 --> 00:25:13.011
<i>Wanting to find love.</i>

524
00:25:13.094 --> 00:25:14.763
- I love to cook.
- Me, too.

525
00:25:14.846 --> 00:25:17.390
I'm hoping that people
see themselves in everybody.

526
00:25:17.474 --> 00:25:21.353
<i>I certainly see a little bit of things</i>
<i>that I respond to in everyone.</i>

527
00:25:21.436 --> 00:25:25.065
<i>That tapestry of experience</i>
<i>and perspective is,</i>

528
00:25:25.148 --> 00:25:26.983
I think, what's so beautiful
about the show.

529
00:25:27.067 --> 00:25:28.401
That's it, buddy.

530
00:25:28.485 --> 00:25:30.320
Hey, good to see everybody.

531
00:25:31.821 --> 00:25:33.740
<i>While there was</i>
<i>technical challenges,</i>

532
00:25:33.823 --> 00:25:36.201
I think on this show,
more than any show I've been on,

533
00:25:36.284 --> 00:25:39.454
<i>everyone was not only up</i>
<i>for the challenge, but pushed it</i>

534
00:25:39.538 --> 00:25:41.039
<i>every opportunity they had.</i>

535
00:25:41.122 --> 00:25:44.417
<i>Making a series like this</i>
<i>is certainly very much like</i>

536
00:25:44.501 --> 00:25:46.294
<i>being on a team like the Pickles,</i>

537
00:25:46.378 --> 00:25:48.547
and everybody has
their strengths and weaknesses,

538
00:25:48.630 --> 00:25:51.550
<i>and we just come together</i>
<i>and try to support each other</i>

539
00:25:51.633 --> 00:25:53.426
<i>and fill in each other's blind spots.</i>

540
00:25:53.510 --> 00:25:56.137
<i>I truly believe that</i>
<i>making a movie is a team sport.</i>

541
00:25:56.221 --> 00:26:00.141
Because you have to understand
your teammates, what their roles are.

542
00:26:00.225 --> 00:26:03.019
<i>When they pass you something,</i>
<i>you know what to do with it.</i>

543
00:26:03.103 --> 00:26:06.147
<i>And you have to pass it</i>
<i>to the right person afterwards.</i>

544
00:26:06.231 --> 00:26:08.900
A sports team
and a film crew is very similar

545
00:26:08.984 --> 00:26:11.444
in the sense that
if I don't pull my weight,

546
00:26:11.528 --> 00:26:14.239
then I'm gonna drag everything down.
It's the same pressure.

547
00:26:14.322 --> 00:26:16.533
Either you hit the ball or you don't.

548
00:26:16.616 --> 00:26:19.369
But you have to keep going no matter what.

549
00:26:19.452 --> 00:26:20.495
You can't just stop.

550
00:26:20.579 --> 00:26:24.916
All of that is in service of this idea
that we have our own perspective.

551
00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:27.335
<i>And that everyone around us,</i>

552
00:26:27.419 --> 00:26:30.255
<i>no matter what it seems</i>
<i>like they're doing,</i>

553
00:26:30.338 --> 00:26:33.633
<i>is living that same experience</i>
<i>in their own way.</i>

554
00:26:33.717 --> 00:26:36.553
<i>Win or lose, they come together as a team.</i>

555
00:26:36.636 --> 00:26:40.098
I feel like that's been
the story of our show as well.

556
00:26:40.181 --> 00:26:45.061
Everyone on your crew becomes a partner
in shepherding this little baby.

557
00:26:45.145 --> 00:26:47.230
<i>We're all its parents.</i>

558
00:26:54.446 --> 00:26:55.572
It's legit now.

559
00:26:56.573 --> 00:26:58.533
Everything's become serious now.

560
00:26:58.617 --> 00:26:59.618
Quiet on set.

561
00:26:59.701 --> 00:27:01.077
I'm sorry. Is that my job?

562
00:27:01.161 --> 00:27:03.622
-Thank you, Carrie.
- Okay.

563
00:27:03.705 --> 00:27:05.707
Don't look directly
at the camera and like...

564
00:27:05.790 --> 00:27:08.376
Yeah, I had a great time working on this.

565
00:27:10.128 --> 00:27:11.630
My piece is still in place, though?

566
00:27:12.422 --> 00:27:14.341
-Yes.
- Okay.

567
00:27:14.424 --> 00:27:17.177
We try to have a base set of...

568
00:27:18.637 --> 00:27:20.305
The airplane. Okay.

569
00:27:21.514 --> 00:27:23.767
Is it a helicopter?

570
00:27:23.850 --> 00:27:25.518
-Airplane.
- Okay.

571
00:27:25.602 --> 00:27:27.729
- This is gonna happen all day.
- Okay.

572
00:27:27.812 --> 00:27:30.106
Any time he throws a pitch,
there's this motion trail

573
00:27:30.190 --> 00:27:32.025
that comes off in the back
of the softball.

574
00:27:32.108 --> 00:27:33.109
Dog.

575
00:27:35.028 --> 00:27:37.197
He's just a bouncing toupee.

576
00:27:41.326 --> 00:27:43.244
Some of the first times
we were returning to doing...

577
00:27:43.328 --> 00:27:44.954
Bird.

578
00:27:47.332 --> 00:27:48.375
More dogs.

579
00:27:50.126 --> 00:27:51.461
Oh. Okay.

580
00:27:53.129 --> 00:27:55.465
Firetruck. Oh, no, hope someone is okay.

581
00:27:55.548 --> 00:27:57.008
It's a new sound every time.

582
00:27:58.301 --> 00:28:02.305
Wow. How many of these
do you get a day? Or an hour?

583
00:28:02.389 --> 00:28:06.851
It's not trains, it's sirens,
it's planes, it's civilization.

584
00:28:06.935 --> 00:28:09.437
- Say "Pickles."
- Pickles!





