WEBVTT FILE 1 00:00:02.000 --> 00:00:07.000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:05.880 --> 00:00:08.400 WIND HOWLS 3 00:00:08.000 --> 00:00:13.000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 4 00:00:23.640 --> 00:00:26.400 MAN: I'm terrified of Auschwitz. 5 00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:27.600 MAN EXHALES 6 00:00:27.680 --> 00:00:28.680 Okay. 7 00:00:30.000 --> 00:00:30.880 No. 8 00:00:30.960 --> 00:00:33.160 I'm not ready to walk in yet. Sorry. 9 00:00:34.000 --> 00:00:35.000 MAN EXHALES 10 00:00:35.080 --> 00:00:37.280 Why do I not have the guts to do it? 11 00:00:43.040 --> 00:00:45.280 DIRECTOR: You live in a very unique world, 12 00:00:45.360 --> 00:00:49.240 because the world knows about your mother and father. 13 00:00:50.840 --> 00:00:52.560 WOMAN: Mr. Sokolov... 14 00:00:54.200 --> 00:00:55.440 Call me Lali. 15 00:00:55.520 --> 00:00:59.120 You're looking for someone to write your life story? 16 00:01:00.320 --> 00:01:05.120 My parents were almost like, that got put away in a box. 17 00:01:05.840 --> 00:01:07.920 His story was kept hidden for decades, 18 00:01:08.000 --> 00:01:10.280 until he revealed it to author Heather Morris. 19 00:01:10.360 --> 00:01:12.040 It is a Holocaust story. 20 00:01:12.560 --> 00:01:14.640 It's not the story of the Holocaust. 21 00:01:16.600 --> 00:01:18.440 GARY: There are still unanswered questions. 22 00:01:18.520 --> 00:01:20.640 Why was my dad so hardened? 23 00:01:20.720 --> 00:01:23.240 Why was my mom so depressed? 24 00:01:23.320 --> 00:01:25.040 The people that have read the book 25 00:01:25.120 --> 00:01:29.040 actually knew more than I did growing up. 26 00:01:29.120 --> 00:01:31.800 The thought of having to walk through those gates 27 00:01:31.880 --> 00:01:33.240 terrifies me. 28 00:01:33.320 --> 00:01:36.520 And I have tried four times and I couldn't even cross, 29 00:01:36.600 --> 00:01:39.080 which made me feel like a coward. 30 00:01:40.160 --> 00:01:42.560 This is my parents' history. 31 00:01:44.160 --> 00:01:45.960 My dad would be so proud of that. 32 00:01:46.440 --> 00:01:47.720 It's amazing. 33 00:01:48.240 --> 00:01:51.480 I felt the presence of your mom. 34 00:01:51.560 --> 00:01:53.920 She let me tell this story. 35 00:01:54.640 --> 00:01:56.920 He's just this one man and he's so small 36 00:01:57.000 --> 00:01:59.040 in this enormous camp, 37 00:01:59.120 --> 00:02:01.440 and he's learning about the horror that's unfolding. 38 00:02:01.960 --> 00:02:03.760 GARY: And that's what beats me up, 39 00:02:03.840 --> 00:02:05.800 is that there's this gap 40 00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:12.000 of their experience that I haven't experienced yet. 41 00:02:13.440 --> 00:02:14.880 I have to do this now. 42 00:02:43.920 --> 00:02:45.280 GARY: Smile for the camera. 43 00:02:46.440 --> 00:02:47.960 You beautiful bird. 44 00:02:49.000 --> 00:02:51.440 When she's not trying to tell me off. 45 00:02:51.520 --> 00:02:52.680 There you go. 46 00:02:52.760 --> 00:02:53.720 BIRD CHEEPS 47 00:02:53.800 --> 00:02:55.160 GARY: Yeah, oh! 48 00:02:56.840 --> 00:02:59.520 Okay, so, my name's Gary Sokolov. 49 00:03:00.640 --> 00:03:05.880 I am the only child of Lali and Gita Sokolov. 50 00:03:05.960 --> 00:03:08.240 My parents were happy people. 51 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:14.880 They had managed to almost wipe out that whole experience, 52 00:03:14.960 --> 00:03:17.920 and for them, it was always about moving forward. 53 00:03:18.000 --> 00:03:19.920 I mean, how beautiful is my mom? 54 00:03:20.760 --> 00:03:23.840 And look at my dad. And there was that smile. 55 00:03:23.920 --> 00:03:27.920 How proud they were to have had a child. 56 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:31.600 You know, 16 years of trying, 57 00:03:31.680 --> 00:03:33.240 and they finally had a son. 58 00:03:33.320 --> 00:03:35.240 And you can just see the glow. 59 00:03:43.480 --> 00:03:44.680 I'm 63. 60 00:03:45.120 --> 00:03:46.120 It's time. 61 00:03:46.200 --> 00:03:49.560 It's time for me to know my parents. 62 00:03:52.240 --> 00:03:55.640 And they deserve for me 63 00:03:55.720 --> 00:03:58.160 to understand what they went through. 64 00:04:00.760 --> 00:04:04.480 I want now to walk in their footsteps. 65 00:04:06.040 --> 00:04:07.760 You know, try and understand 66 00:04:07.840 --> 00:04:09.920 what was going through their heads, 67 00:04:10.000 --> 00:04:12.560 because the impact it had on them was lifelong. 68 00:04:16.920 --> 00:04:19.160 INTERVIEWER: When did you arrive in Australia? 69 00:04:19.240 --> 00:04:22.120 1949, September. 70 00:04:23.000 --> 00:04:24.280 You want to see the picture? 71 00:04:24.920 --> 00:04:27.000 In that photo is when we arrived, 72 00:04:27.080 --> 00:04:29.160 the first day, to Australia. 73 00:04:29.240 --> 00:04:31.120 It is Sydney. 74 00:04:32.080 --> 00:04:33.640 INTERVIEWER 2: Have you had any children? 75 00:04:33.720 --> 00:04:35.920 I have one son. Thanks, God. 76 00:04:36.000 --> 00:04:38.160 Who is a very big and good boy. 77 00:04:38.240 --> 00:04:41.440 He is big all the time, but good occasionally. 78 00:04:41.520 --> 00:04:42.840 INTERVIEWER 2: What's his name? 79 00:04:42.920 --> 00:04:44.680 Gary, and we love him very much. 80 00:04:53.280 --> 00:04:54.480 GARY: Do you want some help? 81 00:04:55.880 --> 00:04:57.480 GIRL: Can you grab the mayonnaise? 82 00:04:57.560 --> 00:04:58.360 GARY: Yeah. 83 00:04:58.440 --> 00:04:59.600 And salt. 84 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:01.240 -Yeah. -What's that? 85 00:05:02.640 --> 00:05:06.760 GARY: Being a dad was really, really important to me. 86 00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:11.280 I suppose, if there was any enormous guilt, 87 00:05:11.920 --> 00:05:16.400 it would have been if my parents had survived 88 00:05:16.480 --> 00:05:18.480 and there was no continuity. 89 00:05:18.960 --> 00:05:21.400 -Hello. Good Shabbos. -GARY: Good Shabbos. 90 00:05:21.480 --> 00:05:24.600 -Hello, Mommy. -Mali, you look beautiful! 91 00:05:24.680 --> 00:05:26.800 How are you? Good Shabbos. 92 00:05:28.280 --> 00:05:33.480 GARY: I cherish every single happy or sad moment with them, 93 00:05:33.560 --> 00:05:35.360 because I'm a dad. 94 00:05:35.440 --> 00:05:36.920 And that's, like, amazing. 95 00:05:38.440 --> 00:05:41.000 -Good Shabbos, everyone! -Good Shabbos, everyone! 96 00:05:42.000 --> 00:05:44.400 -L'chaim. -MOM: L'chaim. 97 00:05:44.800 --> 00:05:46.000 Dig in and eat. 98 00:05:46.520 --> 00:05:47.920 Right, who stole the gravy? 99 00:05:48.400 --> 00:05:49.200 GIRL: Me. 100 00:05:55.600 --> 00:05:57.560 -HEATHER: Are you ready? -Yes. 101 00:06:00.920 --> 00:06:03.320 HEATHER: When I had spent that first day with him, 102 00:06:03.400 --> 00:06:04.360 he said to me, 103 00:06:04.440 --> 00:06:07.520 "Did you know I was the Tattoowierer in Auschwitz?" 104 00:06:08.160 --> 00:06:11.400 I was spending time with this man who had lived through 105 00:06:11.480 --> 00:06:15.040 one of the most horrific episodes of recent history. 106 00:06:15.120 --> 00:06:19.000 Not only lived, he'd survived. He'd been a fighter. 107 00:06:22.280 --> 00:06:24.920 He always would do that to his arm, 108 00:06:25.000 --> 00:06:26.520 and made the numbers... 109 00:06:36.920 --> 00:06:38.840 GARY: I would sometimes come home from work 110 00:06:38.920 --> 00:06:42.200 and he would be standing, staring at that window. 111 00:06:42.280 --> 00:06:44.000 He wouldn't even hear me come in. 112 00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:46.840 And it would be like, "Hi, Dad." 113 00:06:49.920 --> 00:06:53.160 And he wouldn't react for a minute or two. 114 00:06:55.640 --> 00:06:56.920 LALI INHALES 115 00:06:58.920 --> 00:07:00.040 I'm right here. 116 00:07:02.360 --> 00:07:03.360 You know it. 117 00:07:07.160 --> 00:07:09.200 HEATHER: Your dad said to me so many times 118 00:07:09.280 --> 00:07:11.800 about he was constantly surrounded by ghosts. 119 00:07:11.880 --> 00:07:13.280 Mm. Yeah. 120 00:07:13.360 --> 00:07:15.520 They had been part of his life since the day he left there. 121 00:07:15.600 --> 00:07:18.000 I could see every now and then when he left me, 122 00:07:18.720 --> 00:07:21.440 and I knew, "Now he's back in 1942." 123 00:07:23.080 --> 00:07:26.680 I was 11 or 12 years old, and there was a documentary. 124 00:07:27.240 --> 00:07:29.200 Um... World at War. 125 00:07:30.880 --> 00:07:34.680 And my parents said to me that I have to watch this. 126 00:07:37.480 --> 00:07:39.960 And I had to sit there by myself, 127 00:07:40.040 --> 00:07:42.000 watching this. 128 00:07:42.720 --> 00:07:45.680 NARRATOR: What we went through will be difficult to understand, 129 00:07:45.760 --> 00:07:47.440 even for our contemporaries, 130 00:07:48.160 --> 00:07:49.960 and much more difficult for the generations 131 00:07:50.040 --> 00:07:52.920 that have already no personal experience from those days. 132 00:07:57.960 --> 00:07:58.760 EXHALES 133 00:08:00.000 --> 00:08:04.160 I saw the bulldozers 134 00:08:04.240 --> 00:08:07.280 doing piles of dead bodies, 135 00:08:07.920 --> 00:08:11.320 and people just lying there, 136 00:08:11.400 --> 00:08:13.200 just skin and bone. 137 00:08:13.280 --> 00:08:17.160 That has stuck with me, and that was my first exposure. 138 00:08:17.560 --> 00:08:19.000 And even after that... 139 00:08:20.200 --> 00:08:22.400 have something to eat, go to bed. 140 00:08:22.920 --> 00:08:26.920 DIRECTOR: Would you say you've been traumatized 141 00:08:27.000 --> 00:08:28.480 by their trauma? 142 00:08:31.080 --> 00:08:33.120 That's a really interesting question. 143 00:08:33.200 --> 00:08:35.760 My parents were almost like, 144 00:08:36.160 --> 00:08:38.040 that got put away in a box. 145 00:08:39.000 --> 00:08:41.560 "That was where we were. 146 00:08:41.640 --> 00:08:45.360 This is where we are now. We're in Australia." 147 00:08:45.800 --> 00:08:47.760 INTERVIEWER 2: Why did you come to Australia? 148 00:08:47.840 --> 00:08:49.360 Why we came to Australia? 149 00:08:49.440 --> 00:08:52.320 As far away from "ism" as possible. 150 00:08:52.400 --> 00:08:56.160 Nazism, communism, I didn't want to hear about it, 151 00:08:56.240 --> 00:08:57.480 so as far away. 152 00:09:00.640 --> 00:09:02.360 SHIP HORN BLOWS 153 00:09:02.440 --> 00:09:04.360 NARRATOR: Australia opened its doors to Europe 154 00:09:04.440 --> 00:09:05.840 after World War II. 155 00:09:05.920 --> 00:09:09.720 A million-odd migrants brought a new flavor and a new look, 156 00:09:09.800 --> 00:09:12.720 learning English, finding jobs, raising families, 157 00:09:12.800 --> 00:09:15.480 and, by and large, having few regrets. 158 00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:19.440 Yes, young Australia is a bright light, 159 00:09:19.520 --> 00:09:21.240 a fair dinkum land, 160 00:09:21.800 --> 00:09:24.400 in our changing world. 161 00:09:44.120 --> 00:09:47.320 GARY: I've never met a Holocaust survivor 162 00:09:47.400 --> 00:09:52.120 that's actually willing to talk about his experiences. 163 00:09:53.200 --> 00:09:55.000 So, we're now on our way to visit 164 00:09:55.080 --> 00:09:57.440 a gentleman called Abram Goldberg. 165 00:09:57.960 --> 00:09:59.720 He was one of the founders 166 00:09:59.800 --> 00:10:03.160 of the Holocaust Museum here in Melbourne. 167 00:10:04.760 --> 00:10:06.760 It's actually his birthday in ten days' time. 168 00:10:06.840 --> 00:10:08.240 He's going to be 100. 169 00:10:26.280 --> 00:10:27.840 When they opened the doors, 170 00:10:27.920 --> 00:10:30.040 do you remember what your first thought was? 171 00:10:30.120 --> 00:10:34.400 I only thought about, "What will I do? How will I save my mom?" 172 00:10:34.480 --> 00:10:35.840 Right. Okay. 173 00:10:36.440 --> 00:10:43.160 And when my mother had to go down to the high cattle train, 174 00:10:43.240 --> 00:10:45.240 we didn't know what those flames are. 175 00:10:45.320 --> 00:10:47.960 -GARY: Right. -ABRAM: Nobody knew anything. 176 00:10:48.040 --> 00:10:50.040 You only realize it's hell. 177 00:10:51.200 --> 00:10:54.400 And outside, the way people were treated, 178 00:10:54.480 --> 00:10:56.920 she realized she is not going to survive. 179 00:10:57.000 --> 00:10:58.200 No. Okay. 180 00:10:59.320 --> 00:11:01.200 So she turned to me and said, 181 00:11:01.280 --> 00:11:05.320 "Abram, you should do everything humanly possible to survive." 182 00:11:06.320 --> 00:11:09.280 I knew that I was going to dedicate my life. 183 00:11:10.120 --> 00:11:11.600 It's what I'm doing. 184 00:11:13.360 --> 00:11:14.560 You've done an amazing job. 185 00:11:14.640 --> 00:11:16.480 Not let the world forget what happened. 186 00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:26.400 GARY: I'm so honored that I got to talk to you, 187 00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:28.560 because my whole life, no one spoke to me. 188 00:11:28.640 --> 00:11:30.640 No one wanted to. 189 00:11:30.720 --> 00:11:33.600 ABRAM: I made sure that my children knows. 190 00:11:38.280 --> 00:11:39.800 NARRATOR: The young Jew in Australia 191 00:11:39.880 --> 00:11:41.560 has often been brought up in the shadow 192 00:11:41.640 --> 00:11:44.200 of his parents' direct experience of persecution. 193 00:11:44.280 --> 00:11:49.120 SINGING IN HEBREW 194 00:11:55.280 --> 00:11:58.680 My name is George Halasz, and for the last 25 years, 195 00:11:58.760 --> 00:12:01.840 I've been researching intergenerational trauma 196 00:12:01.920 --> 00:12:05.640 based on the lived experiences of my mother, Alice, 197 00:12:05.720 --> 00:12:07.480 who's a Holocaust survivor. 198 00:12:08.200 --> 00:12:11.360 You're a second generation like I'm a second generation. 199 00:12:11.440 --> 00:12:15.160 So, were you curious about their stories? 200 00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:18.400 I think I was already at the point where I stopped asking, 201 00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:20.760 because my parents never answered. 202 00:12:21.360 --> 00:12:26.360 So, that, to me, speaks about the desire to be secretive. 203 00:12:26.440 --> 00:12:27.320 Yes. 204 00:12:27.400 --> 00:12:30.720 Do you think there was any quality of numbness in either, 205 00:12:30.800 --> 00:12:32.160 or both, of your parents? 206 00:12:32.240 --> 00:12:35.520 Definitely not Mom. Very possible with Dad. 207 00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:41.120 Just because I never saw any emotion from him. 208 00:12:41.200 --> 00:12:42.080 Right. 209 00:12:42.600 --> 00:12:45.240 So something must have happened to him in the camps 210 00:12:46.120 --> 00:12:47.400 that numbed him, 211 00:12:47.880 --> 00:12:51.640 where he became a person that only ever looked forward. 212 00:12:51.720 --> 00:12:53.240 -GEORGE: Yes. -Never looked back. 213 00:12:54.720 --> 00:12:57.000 Look, I witnessed things. 214 00:12:57.440 --> 00:12:59.400 Killings. Right? 215 00:12:59.480 --> 00:13:02.680 Torture. Beatings. Right? 216 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:06.800 Unbelievable, where boys killed boys, 217 00:13:06.880 --> 00:13:08.800 inmates killed inmates. 218 00:13:09.520 --> 00:13:11.760 What I'm hearing, your father, 219 00:13:11.840 --> 00:13:16.560 despite the experiences of Auschwitz-Birkenau, 220 00:13:17.680 --> 00:13:20.400 went on regardless. 221 00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:23.600 If you survived when everyone around you is dying, 222 00:13:24.240 --> 00:13:27.760 you just think, "All right, I've survived today." 223 00:13:28.280 --> 00:13:30.480 That survival instinct. 224 00:13:30.920 --> 00:13:33.400 Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. 225 00:13:33.480 --> 00:13:34.360 Right. 226 00:13:35.120 --> 00:13:38.480 Holocaust trauma is the lived experiences 227 00:13:38.560 --> 00:13:40.440 that were so overwhelming 228 00:13:40.520 --> 00:13:44.280 as to actually have changed their minds and their bodies. 229 00:13:44.760 --> 00:13:47.880 And it is this persistent survival mode 230 00:13:47.960 --> 00:13:51.120 that is labelled "traumatic experience". 231 00:13:52.880 --> 00:13:55.280 GARY: Why was my dad so hardened? 232 00:13:55.360 --> 00:13:58.200 Why was my mom so depressed? 233 00:13:58.800 --> 00:14:04.840 How they must have felt every single day when they woke up. 234 00:14:04.920 --> 00:14:05.840 The concept of, 235 00:14:05.920 --> 00:14:08.240 "Am I still going to be alive in ten minutes' time, 236 00:14:08.320 --> 00:14:10.720 or will someone just walk past me and shoot me?" 237 00:14:11.080 --> 00:14:13.840 I want to understand and feel that. 238 00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:20.960 I think I'd like to go back there. 239 00:14:23.760 --> 00:14:25.880 Yes, to Birkenau, to the camp. 240 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:32.920 I... I thought you'd never go back to Europe. 241 00:14:36.560 --> 00:14:40.000 GARY: One of my biggest regrets with my father 242 00:14:40.840 --> 00:14:43.600 is I should have just hopped on a plane and taken him. 243 00:14:45.960 --> 00:14:48.720 I'm terrified of Auschwitz. 244 00:14:49.880 --> 00:14:51.880 You know, you hear the stories, 245 00:14:51.960 --> 00:14:54.200 you read the book, you see the miniseries, 246 00:14:54.280 --> 00:14:58.200 but to actually stand where they stood... 247 00:14:59.720 --> 00:15:02.120 Yeah, I don't know. I've been avoiding doing it. 248 00:15:02.200 --> 00:15:03.960 I'm 63 now, yeah? 249 00:15:04.960 --> 00:15:05.920 Um... 250 00:15:06.520 --> 00:15:08.440 I wake up at night and sweat. 251 00:15:11.560 --> 00:15:13.440 Why do I not have the guts to do it? 252 00:15:13.520 --> 00:15:15.920 This is my parents' history. 253 00:15:17.520 --> 00:15:18.760 I have to do this now. 254 00:15:19.960 --> 00:15:24.000 Keys, phone, wallet, passport. 255 00:15:24.520 --> 00:15:25.720 I'm ready to go. 256 00:15:26.200 --> 00:15:29.680 Look at that. It's real. It's actually happening. 257 00:15:31.400 --> 00:15:32.520 Ooh! 258 00:15:40.520 --> 00:15:42.880 FLIGHT ATTENDANT: Passengers and cabin crew should now be seated 259 00:15:42.960 --> 00:15:46.200 with their seatbelts securely fastened... 260 00:15:57.680 --> 00:16:00.320 INTERVIEWER: Where were you born in Czechoslovakia? 261 00:16:00.400 --> 00:16:03.280 In a small town named Krompachy. 262 00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:04.760 It is Slovakia. 263 00:16:09.320 --> 00:16:12.680 GARY: See, this view, it's just phenomenal. 264 00:16:13.600 --> 00:16:15.680 Overlooking the hills and the valley. 265 00:16:17.680 --> 00:16:19.720 Imagine waking up to that every morning. 266 00:16:20.960 --> 00:16:22.960 What a peaceful way to grow up. 267 00:16:23.440 --> 00:16:26.200 What would it have looked like back then? 268 00:16:29.600 --> 00:16:33.320 So, I know absolutely nothing about Krompachy. 269 00:16:33.400 --> 00:16:40.240 All I know is that my dad lived in Krompachy with his parents. 270 00:16:41.800 --> 00:16:44.400 I mean, what a shock. 271 00:16:45.000 --> 00:16:47.440 There was a war about to happen. 272 00:16:50.640 --> 00:16:55.680 INTERVIEWER: 1942, the Germans came into Slovakia. 273 00:16:55.760 --> 00:16:56.600 LALI: Yeah. 274 00:16:56.680 --> 00:16:59.240 INTERVIEWER: Did you have any indication before that, 275 00:16:59.320 --> 00:17:01.480 that they were coming your way? 276 00:17:02.320 --> 00:17:03.320 Not... 277 00:17:03.920 --> 00:17:05.560 What... If I want to tell you... 278 00:17:06.040 --> 00:17:09.040 I never believed it, right? 279 00:17:11.600 --> 00:17:13.000 I never believed it, 280 00:17:13.080 --> 00:17:17.960 because we lived in a different environment, right? 281 00:17:20.560 --> 00:17:22.640 HEATHER: I don't think Gary has any idea 282 00:17:23.320 --> 00:17:27.080 what he's about to see, feel, and learn 283 00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:29.040 over the next few days here. 284 00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:34.240 He's now learning it for the first time 285 00:17:34.320 --> 00:17:36.880 as a man in his early sixties. 286 00:17:38.040 --> 00:17:41.960 I suspect this is going to be a very, very emotional time. 287 00:17:42.440 --> 00:17:43.880 I'll be there for him. 288 00:17:55.880 --> 00:17:57.240 Heather. 289 00:17:58.280 --> 00:18:01.000 -HEATHER: Oh! -GARY EXHALES 290 00:18:01.840 --> 00:18:04.000 HEATHER: We have no more special place in Krompachy 291 00:18:04.080 --> 00:18:06.040 than where we are standing right now. 292 00:18:09.160 --> 00:18:12.400 This is my gift to your dad and your mom, to you and your girls. 293 00:18:12.480 --> 00:18:15.240 -GARY: And my girls. -HEATHER: Yeah. This is it. 294 00:18:16.840 --> 00:18:18.640 Lenka, please come and join us. 295 00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:19.680 GARY: Hi, Lenka. 296 00:18:19.760 --> 00:18:21.920 -LENKA: Pleasure meeting you. -GARY: And you, too. 297 00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:24.120 HEATHER: Lenka, can you translate? 298 00:18:24.200 --> 00:18:25.640 LENKA: It would be my honor. 299 00:18:25.720 --> 00:18:31.560 So, "This is to the memory of Mr. Ludwig Eisenberg Sokolov 300 00:18:31.640 --> 00:18:33.560 who has lived here. 301 00:18:33.640 --> 00:18:37.080 And this memorial has been dedicated 302 00:18:37.160 --> 00:18:41.880 to all the people deprived of their freedom, 303 00:18:41.960 --> 00:18:44.080 dignity, home, 304 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:45.600 and their own name. 305 00:18:46.080 --> 00:18:49.600 For the memory of all victims of Holocaust." 306 00:18:49.680 --> 00:18:52.240 My dad would be so proud of that. 307 00:18:52.320 --> 00:18:53.840 It's amazing. 308 00:18:55.520 --> 00:18:57.520 LENKA: And we are very proud to have it here. 309 00:18:58.720 --> 00:19:01.440 GARY: This image, 310 00:19:01.920 --> 00:19:04.400 you know, is embedded in my brain. 311 00:19:05.960 --> 00:19:09.480 My whole life, my parents held hands. 312 00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:13.160 They were just so in love. 313 00:19:19.840 --> 00:19:22.080 INTERVIEWER: Did you go to school in Krompachy? 314 00:19:22.160 --> 00:19:24.000 Yeah. Yeah, I went. 315 00:19:26.200 --> 00:19:29.640 I went for eight years in the normal school, 316 00:19:29.720 --> 00:19:31.920 like every child should have. 317 00:19:35.040 --> 00:19:36.800 -Hi. -Hi. Gary? 318 00:19:36.880 --> 00:19:38.680 -Gary. I'm Gary, yes. -Anna. 319 00:19:38.760 --> 00:19:40.280 Nice to meet you, Anna. 320 00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:43.760 -ANNA: Dobry den. -Dobry den. 321 00:19:43.840 --> 00:19:45.920 Wow, wow. 322 00:19:46.000 --> 00:19:48.720 Am I allowed to sit in a chair? 323 00:19:48.800 --> 00:19:50.440 HEATHER: I don't think it's an original one. 324 00:19:50.520 --> 00:19:52.240 GARY: That doesn't matter. It's the room. 325 00:19:52.320 --> 00:19:55.240 Sit down. In the back row. 326 00:19:55.320 --> 00:19:57.720 Yeah, because Dad would never have been in the front row. 327 00:19:57.800 --> 00:19:58.640 HEATHER: Yes. 328 00:19:58.720 --> 00:20:01.120 It was just something he said to me about, at school, 329 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:04.520 how he used to sit and look out the window and daydream. 330 00:20:04.960 --> 00:20:05.960 Look at this, Dad. 331 00:20:06.040 --> 00:20:07.680 I'm probably sitting in your chair, 332 00:20:07.760 --> 00:20:11.760 looking outside the window at your hometown. How cool! 333 00:20:21.360 --> 00:20:25.600 SPEAKS SLOVAK 334 00:20:25.680 --> 00:20:26.720 "When the book came out 335 00:20:26.800 --> 00:20:28.680 about The Tattooist of Auschwitz... 336 00:20:28.760 --> 00:20:30.080 SPEAKS SLOVAK 337 00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:35.200 ...I realized that Lali was born in 1916." 338 00:20:35.280 --> 00:20:38.040 SPEAKS SLOVAK 339 00:20:38.120 --> 00:20:40.880 "My father was born in 1916, too. 340 00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:44.520 We are hoping for you to pick your dad, Lali." 341 00:20:45.360 --> 00:20:47.520 It will be one of those two. 342 00:20:48.280 --> 00:20:51.160 More than likely this one. Definitely him. 343 00:20:52.240 --> 00:20:55.000 Right there, looking really smart. 344 00:20:55.080 --> 00:20:56.800 GARY LAUGHS 345 00:20:56.880 --> 00:20:58.800 SPEAKS SLOVAK 346 00:21:00.520 --> 00:21:01.680 Really? 347 00:21:03.520 --> 00:21:05.960 LENKA: "And keep it as a memory." 348 00:21:08.120 --> 00:21:09.200 Thank you so much. 349 00:21:10.640 --> 00:21:14.160 I've never seen a photo of my dad before the war. 350 00:21:14.240 --> 00:21:15.040 Nothing. 351 00:21:15.440 --> 00:21:16.560 Thank you. 352 00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:18.680 Thank you so much. 353 00:21:22.520 --> 00:21:26.400 GARY: Today was the most amazing day. 354 00:21:41.440 --> 00:21:43.040 LENKA: I have found something 355 00:21:43.120 --> 00:21:46.400 that I believe you would love to see. 356 00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:50.840 I can confirm that we have found a house 357 00:21:50.920 --> 00:21:55.320 where your dad lived in the year 1930. 358 00:21:56.320 --> 00:21:58.760 -This is my friend, Miro. -GARY: Hi, Miro. 359 00:21:58.840 --> 00:22:01.080 -Very nice to meet you. -MIRO: Nice to meet you, too. 360 00:22:01.160 --> 00:22:02.560 This is a very good find. 361 00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:04.080 -Thank you. -Well done, you. 362 00:22:07.080 --> 00:22:09.680 LENKA: The houses here are beyond repair 363 00:22:09.760 --> 00:22:11.640 and they have to be demolished. 364 00:22:11.720 --> 00:22:15.080 MIRO: This part of the building was for the animals. 365 00:22:15.160 --> 00:22:16.800 -GARY: The stables. -MIRO: Yeah. 366 00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:20.280 And you can imagine where there are some rabbits, 367 00:22:20.360 --> 00:22:23.160 maybe some chickens. 368 00:22:23.240 --> 00:22:25.320 There would have been a horse as well. 369 00:22:27.360 --> 00:22:29.640 LALI: We had horses, 370 00:22:29.720 --> 00:22:32.480 with two people carrying stuff 371 00:22:33.000 --> 00:22:35.400 over from the station 372 00:22:35.480 --> 00:22:38.040 to the places where they had to go. 373 00:22:38.120 --> 00:22:40.480 INTERVIEWER: Did you help out in your family business? 374 00:22:41.160 --> 00:22:43.280 LALI [LAUGHING]: No, not much. 375 00:22:50.280 --> 00:22:55.600 So, finally, we are approaching your grandfather's house, 376 00:22:55.680 --> 00:22:56.960 where your father lived. 377 00:23:00.840 --> 00:23:04.040 So, we've got the steps leading into the house, 378 00:23:04.120 --> 00:23:07.880 for sure, the family members would have walked. 379 00:23:10.120 --> 00:23:11.320 Lucky they were short. 380 00:23:11.400 --> 00:23:12.440 MIRO LAUGHS 381 00:23:15.560 --> 00:23:19.480 Yeah, as you can see, it's in a very bad situation, 382 00:23:20.040 --> 00:23:21.760 so this is probably the last chance 383 00:23:21.840 --> 00:23:23.840 to visit the property as it is. 384 00:23:31.040 --> 00:23:32.040 Wow. 385 00:23:37.240 --> 00:23:41.400 I was really hoping, when I walked in, 386 00:23:41.480 --> 00:23:43.360 just to get, I don't know, 387 00:23:43.440 --> 00:23:46.840 a feeling, something spiritual. 388 00:23:49.520 --> 00:23:55.920 I'm just looking for some stones to put on my dad's grave 389 00:23:56.000 --> 00:23:59.360 from his home. 390 00:24:03.360 --> 00:24:04.680 Look at this. 391 00:24:05.480 --> 00:24:08.560 I've got enough for both graves. Huh. 392 00:24:09.840 --> 00:24:11.400 Wow! 393 00:24:11.480 --> 00:24:13.360 This is just superb. 394 00:24:16.680 --> 00:24:18.840 Every time you go and visit someone's grave, 395 00:24:18.920 --> 00:24:20.560 you're supposed to leave a stone, 396 00:24:21.320 --> 00:24:23.720 just to let them know you've come to visit. 397 00:24:28.320 --> 00:24:31.280 You know how you were talking about living history? 398 00:24:32.960 --> 00:24:35.720 This is the history of where they were living. 399 00:24:35.800 --> 00:24:37.600 CHUCKLES 400 00:24:38.160 --> 00:24:40.280 That is just unbelievable. 401 00:24:50.640 --> 00:24:53.960 Hello, Lali from Krompachy. 402 00:24:56.400 --> 00:24:57.520 I have to go. 403 00:24:58.720 --> 00:24:59.720 Wait! Wait! 404 00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:02.360 I don't know your name. 405 00:25:03.280 --> 00:25:04.280 It's Gita. 406 00:25:09.240 --> 00:25:10.840 INTERVIEWER 2: Where were you born? 407 00:25:10.920 --> 00:25:13.120 Vranov nad Topl'ou, Slovakia. 408 00:25:15.360 --> 00:25:19.560 About 200 families were in that little town. 409 00:25:20.760 --> 00:25:23.320 It was a very close-knit town. 410 00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:25.920 INTERVIEWER 2: Was it 200 Jewish families, or...? 411 00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:27.800 GITA: Jewish families, yes. 412 00:25:29.240 --> 00:25:31.520 INTERVIEWER 2: How many people were in your immediate family? 413 00:25:32.880 --> 00:25:36.200 Six children, my late father and mother. 414 00:25:38.720 --> 00:25:44.320 We wanted to show you the birth records of your mom... 415 00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:45.400 Oh, wow! 416 00:25:45.480 --> 00:25:48.720 ...which we have found at this registry office. 417 00:25:49.520 --> 00:25:50.720 GARY: I'm tingling. 418 00:25:52.280 --> 00:25:53.720 Wow, wow, wow! 419 00:25:54.480 --> 00:25:56.400 -Baby steps, please. -Baby steps, yes. 420 00:25:56.480 --> 00:25:59.080 Yeah, because otherwise, I get so overwhelmed. 421 00:26:02.400 --> 00:26:04.600 I've never seen that photo. 422 00:26:04.680 --> 00:26:05.760 That... 423 00:26:05.840 --> 00:26:08.240 How stylish is my mom? 424 00:26:08.320 --> 00:26:11.520 And look. You know, look at the smile. 425 00:26:11.600 --> 00:26:13.920 And there's no trauma in that photo. 426 00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:17.400 There's a genuinely happy person. 427 00:26:17.480 --> 00:26:18.920 Happy to be alive. 428 00:26:19.480 --> 00:26:22.600 It's a pretty cool photo, huh? Bless my mom. 429 00:26:24.880 --> 00:26:28.640 LENKA: Gary, this is a place where you register the birth 430 00:26:28.720 --> 00:26:31.400 of every child being born in Vranov. 431 00:26:31.480 --> 00:26:33.560 The first and probably the most special. 432 00:26:34.440 --> 00:26:36.240 -GARY: Mom. -LENKA: It's your mom. 433 00:26:36.320 --> 00:26:37.360 GARY: Mm. 434 00:26:37.440 --> 00:26:42.280 So, this is the record of her being born in Vranov 435 00:26:42.360 --> 00:26:45.960 on the 11th of March, 1925. 436 00:26:46.840 --> 00:26:52.120 Here you can see a record of your mother's sisters. 437 00:26:52.200 --> 00:26:55.000 We've got Rachel, Golda and Franny. 438 00:26:55.600 --> 00:26:57.440 HEATHER: Didn't come home. 439 00:26:59.640 --> 00:27:00.720 Didn't come home. 440 00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:03.520 Yeah. Okay. 441 00:27:05.360 --> 00:27:06.960 Those bastards. 442 00:27:17.920 --> 00:27:20.480 DIRECTOR: Why did your mom not tell you about her sisters? 443 00:27:22.040 --> 00:27:23.600 How do I answer that? 444 00:27:24.120 --> 00:27:27.960 How closed must my mom have been, 445 00:27:28.040 --> 00:27:29.680 and shut down, 446 00:27:29.760 --> 00:27:32.320 to not even mention that she had three sisters? 447 00:27:33.840 --> 00:27:35.320 I love my dad dearly, 448 00:27:36.200 --> 00:27:39.840 but all my heart came from Mom. 449 00:27:40.960 --> 00:27:45.280 And this just has that little bit more meaning. 450 00:27:45.840 --> 00:27:48.200 She just buried it. 451 00:27:48.280 --> 00:27:49.440 She buried it. 452 00:27:49.520 --> 00:27:51.840 And maybe that's why she was so depressed, 453 00:27:51.920 --> 00:27:53.360 because she buried it all so deep, 454 00:27:53.440 --> 00:27:55.680 but it was still in the back of her head. 455 00:27:55.760 --> 00:27:58.960 And, you know, that would explain the nightmares. 456 00:28:08.120 --> 00:28:09.680 GARY: Where we're standing, 457 00:28:09.760 --> 00:28:12.960 in what was the heart of the Jewish community, 458 00:28:13.040 --> 00:28:16.600 is symbolic of what happened all over Europe. 459 00:28:16.680 --> 00:28:18.480 And I'll phrase it like this. 460 00:28:18.560 --> 00:28:21.080 So, here there was a synagogue... 461 00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:25.880 until there wasn't. 462 00:28:25.960 --> 00:28:28.200 Over here was the spiritual bath 463 00:28:28.280 --> 00:28:31.520 called the Mikvah, until there wasn't. 464 00:28:31.960 --> 00:28:35.040 The Jewish people were there, until they weren't anymore. 465 00:28:35.600 --> 00:28:38.280 What's left is a plaque. 466 00:28:39.680 --> 00:28:41.400 That's it. That's all that's left. 467 00:28:41.760 --> 00:28:45.480 This was the wall of the synagogue, here, 468 00:28:45.560 --> 00:28:47.360 that my mom attended. 469 00:28:48.440 --> 00:28:51.400 It's a bit of stone from my mom's synagogue 470 00:28:51.480 --> 00:28:53.320 that is no more. 471 00:29:00.200 --> 00:29:01.600 We're reading excerpts 472 00:29:01.680 --> 00:29:04.280 from something called my mom's Shoah tape. 473 00:29:04.360 --> 00:29:06.720 And this is a phenomenal project 474 00:29:06.800 --> 00:29:12.280 to videotape every single living 475 00:29:12.360 --> 00:29:16.280 Holocaust survivor's story. 476 00:29:16.800 --> 00:29:20.320 If you don't mind, I just want to read to you what... 477 00:29:24.000 --> 00:29:25.240 my mom remembered. 478 00:29:27.480 --> 00:29:29.040 "So I went to school." 479 00:29:29.840 --> 00:29:31.960 GITA: Then they kicked me out of school. 480 00:29:33.240 --> 00:29:35.200 "Like every young person... 481 00:29:37.280 --> 00:29:40.640 I had hopes that I had to study." 482 00:29:41.280 --> 00:29:42.480 GITA: At 17, 483 00:29:42.560 --> 00:29:45.320 you still haven't got a clear mind what you want to do. 484 00:29:45.400 --> 00:29:48.720 We knew that the times aren't very healthy. 485 00:29:49.480 --> 00:29:51.720 Knew something was going wrong. 486 00:29:52.320 --> 00:29:54.920 They didn't fully understand what. 487 00:29:55.800 --> 00:29:58.320 And then they asked her the question. 488 00:30:00.440 --> 00:30:03.040 INTERVIEWER 2: Was your father able to continue working? 489 00:30:04.160 --> 00:30:07.040 GITA: No. They took away the bakery. 490 00:30:07.120 --> 00:30:09.960 That's when the troubles started. 491 00:30:10.480 --> 00:30:13.280 "And after they had closed everything down 492 00:30:13.360 --> 00:30:16.040 a few weeks later, they took us." 493 00:30:17.440 --> 00:30:18.800 HE SOBS 494 00:30:20.520 --> 00:30:24.800 And for her, that simple life, 495 00:30:25.800 --> 00:30:28.240 overnight, gone. 496 00:30:29.560 --> 00:30:32.360 Childhood, gone. 497 00:30:33.440 --> 00:30:34.720 Family, 498 00:30:36.520 --> 00:30:37.880 ripped apart. 499 00:30:38.720 --> 00:30:39.640 Gone. 500 00:30:39.720 --> 00:30:41.200 Everything was... 501 00:30:42.560 --> 00:30:43.560 just... 502 00:30:45.920 --> 00:30:46.880 gone. 503 00:31:08.320 --> 00:31:10.640 LALI: The Slovaks were always antisemites. 504 00:31:10.720 --> 00:31:14.680 You talked to everybody. They knew that you are a Jew. 505 00:31:14.760 --> 00:31:17.600 But maybe, inside, they hated you. 506 00:31:17.680 --> 00:31:18.880 People ask whether 507 00:31:18.960 --> 00:31:21.840 what is being done with the Jews is Christian. 508 00:31:21.920 --> 00:31:24.440 Is it human? Is it not robbery? 509 00:31:25.520 --> 00:31:28.800 I ask, is it Christian when the nation wants to free itself 510 00:31:28.880 --> 00:31:32.320 from its eternal enemy, the Jew? 511 00:31:32.400 --> 00:31:35.560 Slovak, cast off your parasite. 512 00:32:03.920 --> 00:32:05.760 MADELINE: I have a letter here. 513 00:32:05.840 --> 00:32:07.600 This letter is from a six-year-old boy 514 00:32:07.680 --> 00:32:09.360 who wrote to Jozef Tiso. 515 00:32:09.800 --> 00:32:11.440 You know, I've got a seven-year-old, 516 00:32:11.520 --> 00:32:14.160 so this is like trying to imagine her 517 00:32:14.240 --> 00:32:16.280 writing a letter to do this is... 518 00:32:16.360 --> 00:32:18.480 Right. It's just mind-boggling. 519 00:32:18.560 --> 00:32:21.360 He's the youngest letter writer that I have found so far. 520 00:32:21.440 --> 00:32:23.240 This little boy writes, 521 00:32:23.320 --> 00:32:26.680 "Dear Mr. President, every night I pray for your health. 522 00:32:27.200 --> 00:32:30.240 Mommy always tells me that if I'm a good boy, 523 00:32:30.320 --> 00:32:32.560 Jesus will bring me the most beautiful gift 524 00:32:32.640 --> 00:32:37.280 from Mr. President," which is an exemption. 525 00:32:43.840 --> 00:32:45.520 I would like to talk to you a little bit 526 00:32:45.600 --> 00:32:50.400 about this piece of propaganda that is behind us. 527 00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:54.280 It says, "It is he. You know him by the star. 528 00:32:55.000 --> 00:32:58.520 It is he who grabs everything for himself. 529 00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:03.480 It is he who acts against the state and its friends." 530 00:33:03.560 --> 00:33:06.640 The wearing of the yellow Star of David 531 00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:09.320 was mandated by the Jewish Code. 532 00:33:09.400 --> 00:33:12.240 The Slovak press touted it 533 00:33:12.320 --> 00:33:16.600 as the most strict racial law in all of Europe, 534 00:33:16.680 --> 00:33:19.440 even stricter than that of the Nazis. 535 00:33:19.520 --> 00:33:21.880 You couldn't go to sporting events, 536 00:33:21.960 --> 00:33:25.240 parks, restaurants, movies. 537 00:33:25.320 --> 00:33:26.840 You couldn't even go to the market 538 00:33:26.920 --> 00:33:29.720 at the same time as everyone else. 539 00:33:30.200 --> 00:33:33.640 What kind of people, as human beings? 540 00:33:33.720 --> 00:33:35.520 MADELINE: So, these are the things that 541 00:33:35.600 --> 00:33:37.440 your parents would have seen. 542 00:33:37.520 --> 00:33:41.040 And they suggested that the Jews were responsible 543 00:33:41.120 --> 00:33:43.800 for all of the country's problems, 544 00:33:43.880 --> 00:33:44.960 which is impossible, 545 00:33:45.040 --> 00:33:48.280 because they were only 3.6% of the population at the time. 546 00:33:48.360 --> 00:33:50.200 Yeah, I know. It's mind-boggling, isn't it? 547 00:33:51.120 --> 00:33:53.320 To ask me to leave, they didn't come to the home. 548 00:33:53.400 --> 00:33:56.040 They just put out announcements 549 00:33:56.120 --> 00:34:01.320 that the oldest kids from every family 550 00:34:01.400 --> 00:34:03.840 have to come to that place, that evening. 551 00:34:04.440 --> 00:34:06.520 Otherwise, they will take the parents. 552 00:34:06.600 --> 00:34:08.240 It was up to me to go. 553 00:34:09.120 --> 00:34:10.240 So I went. 554 00:34:10.960 --> 00:34:14.800 I was 17 in March, 555 00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:18.440 and in April they had already deported us. 556 00:34:18.520 --> 00:34:20.160 INTERVIEWER: The Slovakian government 557 00:34:20.240 --> 00:34:21.360 came for your parents? 558 00:34:21.440 --> 00:34:23.960 Yeah. Not only for my parents. 559 00:34:24.040 --> 00:34:25.800 For all the Jews. 560 00:34:25.880 --> 00:34:28.760 Because they took everybody they could. 561 00:34:30.120 --> 00:34:32.760 The Slovak government paid 500 reichsmarks 562 00:34:32.840 --> 00:34:34.400 for every deported Jew. 563 00:34:34.800 --> 00:34:36.480 -Were you aware of that? -No. 564 00:34:36.560 --> 00:34:39.760 And they had to pay for "transportation." 565 00:34:39.840 --> 00:34:44.480 That makes it very uncomfortable to be in this country, 566 00:34:44.560 --> 00:34:47.120 right here, right now. 567 00:34:47.200 --> 00:34:49.480 A country that my parents lived in, 568 00:34:50.120 --> 00:34:52.000 their brothers and sisters lived in. 569 00:34:52.080 --> 00:34:54.600 And knowing that the government was happy 570 00:34:54.680 --> 00:34:57.480 to pay for them to be deported. 571 00:34:57.560 --> 00:35:00.440 I would just bring up the point, though, 572 00:35:00.520 --> 00:35:03.040 that not everyone hated Jews. 573 00:35:03.120 --> 00:35:03.960 Right. 574 00:35:04.040 --> 00:35:06.880 But there was tremendous social pressure not to... 575 00:35:06.960 --> 00:35:11.120 not to associate with Jews, and not to aid them in any way. 576 00:35:22.720 --> 00:35:25.400 INTERVIEWER: What was the response of the Jewish community 577 00:35:25.480 --> 00:35:26.600 to these actions? 578 00:35:27.160 --> 00:35:29.400 They had no response. 579 00:35:29.480 --> 00:35:32.840 They couldn't do anything. 580 00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:35.440 Nobody could do anything. 581 00:35:36.400 --> 00:35:37.720 GARY: I feel privileged. 582 00:35:38.240 --> 00:35:42.560 Every survivor needed some luck in their life, 583 00:35:42.640 --> 00:35:45.800 and I'm a reflection of that luck. 584 00:35:46.400 --> 00:35:47.520 GUARD: Keep in line! 585 00:35:48.320 --> 00:35:49.600 Come on, keep moving! 586 00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:51.160 Where are we going? 587 00:35:52.800 --> 00:35:53.800 Poland. 588 00:35:54.720 --> 00:35:56.400 GUARD: Keep moving forward! 589 00:35:56.480 --> 00:35:58.160 I hear they'll train you as a mechanic, 590 00:35:58.240 --> 00:36:00.040 fixing cars, engines. 591 00:36:12.800 --> 00:36:14.680 JONAH: It's funny being back here. 592 00:36:15.280 --> 00:36:20.080 This is where we filmed getting onto the carriages. 593 00:36:20.160 --> 00:36:21.960 And it was such a strange day of filming. 594 00:36:22.040 --> 00:36:23.560 Just me, as Jonah, 595 00:36:24.440 --> 00:36:26.600 trying to imagine what your dad went through, 596 00:36:26.680 --> 00:36:28.160 stepping onto a carriage, 597 00:36:28.240 --> 00:36:30.040 it's almost impossible to imagine. 598 00:36:30.960 --> 00:36:32.560 FILM DIRECTOR: And action! 599 00:36:33.120 --> 00:36:34.560 GARY: But what did you go through 600 00:36:34.640 --> 00:36:36.400 when you walked into the carriage? 601 00:36:45.520 --> 00:36:47.160 JONAH: They slammed the door shut, 602 00:36:47.240 --> 00:36:49.760 and everyone just goes completely quiet. 603 00:36:54.400 --> 00:36:56.280 It was impossible for it not to impact you 604 00:36:56.360 --> 00:36:58.080 on quite a profound level. 605 00:37:03.120 --> 00:37:06.120 LALI: Nobody knew what was going to happen. 606 00:37:10.680 --> 00:37:12.680 Nobody knew where we were going. 607 00:37:14.320 --> 00:37:15.840 He's just this one man, 608 00:37:15.920 --> 00:37:20.040 and he's so small in this enormous scale of this camp. 609 00:37:20.120 --> 00:37:22.160 And he's learning about the horror that's unfolding. 610 00:37:23.480 --> 00:37:26.840 GARY: I can see my dad in your eyes. 611 00:37:26.920 --> 00:37:30.320 I saw my dad in the way you looked at Anna. 612 00:37:30.400 --> 00:37:33.440 That look of love. 613 00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:37.640 GITA: Your eyes... 614 00:37:39.240 --> 00:37:40.280 Are they blue? 615 00:37:40.880 --> 00:37:41.880 LALI: Sometimes. 616 00:37:45.880 --> 00:37:47.080 OFFICER: Is there a problem? 617 00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:49.040 No. Um... 618 00:37:49.920 --> 00:37:51.280 Just getting some more ink. 619 00:37:54.480 --> 00:37:58.640 How difficult would it have been for you 620 00:37:58.720 --> 00:38:01.240 to play my mother 621 00:38:01.320 --> 00:38:04.600 in a Holocaust environment? 622 00:38:04.680 --> 00:38:07.000 ANNA: You know, it was very scary. 623 00:38:07.080 --> 00:38:09.800 I was terrified at first. 624 00:38:09.880 --> 00:38:12.840 I just felt this great responsibility. 625 00:38:13.840 --> 00:38:20.840 I felt the presence of your mom from then. 626 00:38:20.920 --> 00:38:24.400 And, I mean, I still feel that presence sometimes. 627 00:38:24.480 --> 00:38:26.400 -Serious? -ANNA: I do. 628 00:38:26.480 --> 00:38:28.640 How was it for you, 629 00:38:28.720 --> 00:38:31.800 to watch the story on the screen? 630 00:38:31.880 --> 00:38:34.520 So, I'll tell you what my biggest impacts were. 631 00:38:34.600 --> 00:38:36.560 You said, "God isn't going to help." 632 00:38:36.640 --> 00:38:40.360 And this is an ultra, ultra-orthodox woman, 633 00:38:40.440 --> 00:38:42.920 where everything is because of God. 634 00:38:43.000 --> 00:38:43.800 ANNA: Yeah. 635 00:38:43.880 --> 00:38:46.800 That was all Mom. 636 00:38:47.640 --> 00:38:48.640 Lali... 637 00:38:51.480 --> 00:38:53.000 Where is God? 638 00:38:56.840 --> 00:38:59.560 God can't help us, Lali, but we can help God. 639 00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:04.720 We can show him that love still exists, even here. 640 00:39:05.600 --> 00:39:08.080 I was brought up secular. 641 00:39:08.800 --> 00:39:12.840 And I think my mom let go of a lot of it, 642 00:39:12.920 --> 00:39:15.520 maybe because of a disappointment in God. 643 00:39:16.520 --> 00:39:17.800 Because of the war. 644 00:39:20.480 --> 00:39:22.440 How are you feeling generally about going? 645 00:39:22.520 --> 00:39:24.280 -Do you feel ready now? -No. 646 00:39:25.040 --> 00:39:26.920 Even more so not ready. 647 00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:29.000 All of a sudden, that's become... 648 00:39:29.080 --> 00:39:29.880 Look, I'm shaking. 649 00:39:29.960 --> 00:39:32.040 Just look at me. And that's not the cold. 650 00:39:32.120 --> 00:39:34.000 -That's thinking about... -Yeah, yeah. 651 00:39:34.080 --> 00:39:37.680 Walking into Birkenau has a different sense of reality 652 00:39:38.440 --> 00:39:40.320 than it ever did before, 653 00:39:41.360 --> 00:39:43.760 because I know so much now. 654 00:39:44.960 --> 00:39:46.600 If, for any reason, 655 00:39:46.680 --> 00:39:50.000 my parents' souls are not resting, 656 00:39:50.080 --> 00:39:52.200 maybe this will help both of them as well. 657 00:40:03.040 --> 00:40:04.760 This is it? We're getting on here? 658 00:40:13.560 --> 00:40:16.920 Mom's describing her arrival... 659 00:40:18.520 --> 00:40:19.680 in Auschwitz. 660 00:40:20.560 --> 00:40:22.600 "And through the little window in the wagon, 661 00:40:22.960 --> 00:40:24.960 we could see people in striped clothing 662 00:40:25.040 --> 00:40:26.280 working in the field. 663 00:40:28.080 --> 00:40:29.800 And so we talked to each other. 664 00:40:30.560 --> 00:40:33.200 'Well, they must be some criminals. 665 00:40:33.280 --> 00:40:36.760 Definitely not for us.' 666 00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:39.480 But when we arrived, 667 00:40:40.600 --> 00:40:44.360 we had a very, very bad surprise. 668 00:40:47.040 --> 00:40:49.920 The SS came in, and they started screaming, 669 00:40:50.560 --> 00:40:53.240 'You are not going to get out of here, 670 00:40:53.320 --> 00:40:55.160 and you are going to die.'" 671 00:41:00.600 --> 00:41:01.440 GUARD: Halt! 672 00:41:04.280 --> 00:41:07.680 Women this way, men over here. Thank you. Move along. 673 00:41:10.160 --> 00:41:11.560 GARY: I want to know now. 674 00:41:12.000 --> 00:41:13.840 I want to know what it was like for them 675 00:41:13.920 --> 00:41:16.000 as best as I possibly can, 676 00:41:16.080 --> 00:41:18.320 to walk in their footsteps. 677 00:41:18.400 --> 00:41:21.440 I didn't go four times before this trip. 678 00:41:22.480 --> 00:41:24.480 I don't want to make it number five. 679 00:41:25.240 --> 00:41:26.760 This time I'm going. 680 00:41:42.520 --> 00:41:43.760 HE EXHALES 681 00:41:44.200 --> 00:41:49.120 I'm actually surprised at how I'm feeling. 682 00:41:50.280 --> 00:41:53.480 I want to see what happened there. 683 00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:59.520 I want to be close to my mom and dad in there. 684 00:42:00.600 --> 00:42:01.600 I'm ready. 685 00:42:22.000 --> 00:42:23.520 GARY: I can't stop shaking. 686 00:42:23.600 --> 00:42:26.280 HE SOBS 687 00:42:26.960 --> 00:42:27.840 Okay. 688 00:42:27.920 --> 00:42:30.600 MAN: Come here. I've got you. Give me your hand. 689 00:42:31.800 --> 00:42:33.120 I'm okay, I'm okay. 690 00:42:37.120 --> 00:42:38.320 HE SNIFFLES 691 00:42:42.720 --> 00:42:44.440 -Hi, Pawel. -Hi, Gary. 692 00:42:44.520 --> 00:42:47.480 -I'm Gary. Nice to meet you. -Pleasure to meet you here. 693 00:42:47.560 --> 00:42:51.080 And I know it's going to be a challenging time, 694 00:42:51.160 --> 00:42:52.560 but thank you very much 695 00:42:52.640 --> 00:42:54.320 for coming to the memorial. 696 00:42:54.400 --> 00:42:57.280 I suppose we can start, so please follow me. 697 00:42:57.360 --> 00:43:00.720 [CHUCKLING] I can't stop my knees from shaking. 698 00:43:02.520 --> 00:43:03.920 -Okay. -Okay. 699 00:43:05.160 --> 00:43:09.480 From 1942, Auschwitz becomes an extermination camp. 700 00:43:10.760 --> 00:43:12.880 And what you can see here in front of us 701 00:43:12.960 --> 00:43:16.280 is this iconic entrance 702 00:43:16.360 --> 00:43:18.880 with the "Arbeit Macht Frei" inscription, 703 00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:20.600 "work makes one free." 704 00:43:21.400 --> 00:43:23.240 LALI: They took us to Auschwitz. 705 00:43:23.640 --> 00:43:24.720 I looked up. 706 00:43:24.800 --> 00:43:30.440 I saw "Arbeit Macht Frei" in the German language. 707 00:43:31.120 --> 00:43:34.440 And when we came in, the hell started there. 708 00:43:38.000 --> 00:43:41.880 I'm not ready to walk in yet. Sorry. [EXHALES] 709 00:43:49.840 --> 00:43:52.160 I can't stop my legs from shaking. 710 00:43:54.560 --> 00:43:55.560 Okay. 711 00:43:56.960 --> 00:43:58.800 No. [CHUCKLES] 712 00:44:00.200 --> 00:44:01.440 All right, let's do it. 713 00:44:15.320 --> 00:44:19.240 LALI: When we came out and we saw the SS 714 00:44:19.320 --> 00:44:23.000 and we saw the dogs and we saw the beating, 715 00:44:23.080 --> 00:44:26.160 then we knew what time it is. 716 00:44:36.640 --> 00:44:38.000 PAWEL: Most of these blocks 717 00:44:38.080 --> 00:44:40.360 were places where prisoners were sleeping. 718 00:44:41.320 --> 00:44:43.960 The number of people inside such a building 719 00:44:44.040 --> 00:44:45.400 could exceed 1,000. 720 00:44:47.840 --> 00:44:50.760 Do we have any idea which one my mom might have been in? 721 00:44:50.840 --> 00:44:51.720 No. 722 00:44:51.800 --> 00:44:54.960 We don't have documents related to your mother. 723 00:44:55.680 --> 00:44:58.680 The SS, before the evacuation, 724 00:44:58.760 --> 00:45:02.360 they ordered prisoners to burn the documentation. 725 00:45:02.440 --> 00:45:04.320 And our estimation is 726 00:45:04.400 --> 00:45:09.280 that even up to 95% of the camp documents were destroyed. 727 00:45:28.960 --> 00:45:30.600 GARY: So, over here, 728 00:45:30.680 --> 00:45:34.160 what we have is a collection of children's shoes. 729 00:45:36.400 --> 00:45:38.600 Some of these would have been for kids 730 00:45:38.680 --> 00:45:40.400 that were less than one year old. 731 00:45:41.520 --> 00:45:43.840 I'm trying to imagine Aviva's feet. 732 00:45:48.200 --> 00:45:49.560 Shocking, isn't it? 733 00:46:02.880 --> 00:46:04.080 PAWEL: We have to remember 734 00:46:04.160 --> 00:46:06.720 when we look at every single object here, 735 00:46:07.520 --> 00:46:08.560 it is one person. 736 00:46:08.640 --> 00:46:09.680 Yes. 737 00:46:09.760 --> 00:46:13.120 There's always one story, one name, one person, object. 738 00:46:14.160 --> 00:46:16.040 GARY: And this is a bit close to home as well. 739 00:46:16.120 --> 00:46:18.840 It's got my dad's first name on it, Ludwig. 740 00:46:20.200 --> 00:46:21.200 HE EXHALES 741 00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:24.800 The scale of that just... 742 00:46:43.640 --> 00:46:45.520 INTERVIEWER: Did they give you a number? 743 00:46:46.200 --> 00:46:47.240 LALI: Yes. 744 00:46:47.320 --> 00:46:50.360 32407. 745 00:47:05.480 --> 00:47:07.760 When people think about Auschwitz survivors... 746 00:47:07.840 --> 00:47:09.240 I'll think about tattoos. 747 00:47:09.320 --> 00:47:11.200 The tattoo is something essential. 748 00:47:11.280 --> 00:47:15.360 Survivors' children remember the tattoo, 749 00:47:15.440 --> 00:47:17.320 sometimes without understanding what it was. 750 00:47:17.400 --> 00:47:19.200 Because they don't want to explain to them. 751 00:47:19.280 --> 00:47:22.040 In this bureaucratic world of the SS, 752 00:47:22.120 --> 00:47:23.200 they didn't know who... 753 00:47:23.280 --> 00:47:24.960 -GARY: Who was who. -PAWEL: Who was who. 754 00:47:25.040 --> 00:47:26.040 Then they thought, 755 00:47:26.120 --> 00:47:29.560 "It will be more useful if this number will be permanent." 756 00:47:30.280 --> 00:47:32.200 And therefore they needed tattooists, 757 00:47:32.280 --> 00:47:34.400 and your father was one of them. 758 00:47:35.800 --> 00:47:39.280 End of the wood was two needles, right? 759 00:47:39.360 --> 00:47:40.400 One was longer. 760 00:47:40.480 --> 00:47:42.920 The other one a little bit shorter, right? 761 00:47:43.000 --> 00:47:45.720 And that's how we did the numbers. 762 00:47:47.640 --> 00:47:48.800 GARY: My mom, 763 00:47:48.880 --> 00:47:51.160 I remember her coming home one day 764 00:47:51.240 --> 00:47:53.240 with a big bandage on her arm, 765 00:47:53.320 --> 00:47:57.960 and she had just had her tattoo, her number, removed, 766 00:47:58.040 --> 00:48:00.280 because she just couldn't look at it anymore. 767 00:48:11.480 --> 00:48:13.800 LALI: The SS, they took you there. 768 00:48:13.880 --> 00:48:18.280 One day, I came to the bunker number 11. 769 00:48:19.360 --> 00:48:21.600 And they took me in. 770 00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:24.920 And they tortured you, right? 771 00:48:25.000 --> 00:48:26.320 They beat you. 772 00:48:26.400 --> 00:48:27.640 PAWEL: We don't know exactly 773 00:48:27.720 --> 00:48:32.120 how this investigation that led to his incarceration... 774 00:48:32.200 --> 00:48:36.000 It is likely that he could have been here. 775 00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:40.680 First, you will see the standing cells, 776 00:48:40.760 --> 00:48:43.360 which is a particularly harsh punishment. 777 00:48:43.440 --> 00:48:48.040 Up to four people standing in basically one square-meter space 778 00:48:48.120 --> 00:48:49.840 for the entire night. 779 00:48:49.920 --> 00:48:52.440 Each standing cell looks like this. 780 00:48:52.520 --> 00:48:54.000 It was bricked up. 781 00:48:54.480 --> 00:48:55.680 People crawled inside, 782 00:48:56.520 --> 00:48:58.720 and they were standing the entire night. 783 00:48:59.360 --> 00:49:01.400 And that's the only entrance of air. 784 00:49:01.960 --> 00:49:03.960 You can see there's a very small hole. 785 00:49:04.040 --> 00:49:05.720 It could be covered from the outside. 786 00:49:05.800 --> 00:49:09.120 So this was one of these extreme types of punishments 787 00:49:09.200 --> 00:49:10.720 that we have here. 788 00:49:13.320 --> 00:49:14.960 GARY: They had different designations. 789 00:49:15.040 --> 00:49:16.400 Standing cells, 790 00:49:16.960 --> 00:49:18.920 starvation cells, 791 00:49:19.360 --> 00:49:21.040 death by suffocation. 792 00:49:23.320 --> 00:49:25.720 PAWEL: This is the execution yard 793 00:49:25.800 --> 00:49:27.800 of the prison building. 794 00:49:27.880 --> 00:49:29.840 And they were shot in the back of their heads. 795 00:49:30.280 --> 00:49:33.840 So, this is a site which is a commemorative site, 796 00:49:33.920 --> 00:49:35.120 as you can see. 797 00:49:35.560 --> 00:49:38.800 And there is always this flag above, 798 00:49:38.880 --> 00:49:40.560 with the stripe pattern. 799 00:49:40.640 --> 00:49:42.680 -GARY: The uniform. -PAWEL: The uniform pattern. 800 00:49:42.760 --> 00:49:44.480 So it symbolizes the prisoners. 801 00:49:45.840 --> 00:49:47.360 But there was sand 802 00:49:47.440 --> 00:49:49.600 and sawdust that they were throwing here 803 00:49:49.680 --> 00:49:51.160 to drain the blood. 804 00:49:51.240 --> 00:49:54.560 And the blood reached meters into the ground. 805 00:50:35.800 --> 00:50:38.480 LALI: The gassing was separate, 806 00:50:38.560 --> 00:50:40.720 and the burning was separate. 807 00:50:43.760 --> 00:50:45.080 HE EXHALES 808 00:50:45.160 --> 00:50:47.720 LALI: They couldn't burn them that quick. 809 00:50:53.520 --> 00:50:57.000 There was a conveyor belt from the gas chamber 810 00:50:57.080 --> 00:50:59.960 which came into the crematorium. 811 00:51:00.040 --> 00:51:03.080 And the conveyor belt was working non-stop, 812 00:51:03.160 --> 00:51:05.960 24 hours a day, 813 00:51:06.040 --> 00:51:09.720 and bringing in those gassed people, naked. 814 00:51:16.680 --> 00:51:20.360 HE SOBS 815 00:51:49.200 --> 00:51:52.560 GITA: In July, we went to Birkenau. 816 00:51:52.640 --> 00:51:54.840 That's where the real trouble started, 817 00:51:54.920 --> 00:51:58.880 the real killings and disappearings. 818 00:52:01.520 --> 00:52:03.760 Here we go. There's the building. 819 00:52:04.800 --> 00:52:06.280 There's the train tracks. 820 00:52:09.640 --> 00:52:10.960 My heart's racing. 821 00:52:11.040 --> 00:52:16.760 GARY BREATHES QUICKLY 822 00:52:17.280 --> 00:52:20.080 So, this is the space that you can see... 823 00:52:20.840 --> 00:52:21.880 Just how vast. 824 00:52:21.960 --> 00:52:23.800 ...of basically... 825 00:52:23.880 --> 00:52:25.280 maybe not the entire, 826 00:52:25.360 --> 00:52:27.040 but the majority of the Birkenau site. 827 00:52:27.120 --> 00:52:28.240 But there's more? 828 00:52:28.320 --> 00:52:30.440 PAWEL: There are some parts in the forest 829 00:52:30.520 --> 00:52:32.600 that are difficult to see from here. 830 00:52:32.680 --> 00:52:37.360 But, basically, we can look at this around-500-acre space. 831 00:52:37.440 --> 00:52:40.400 When the SS moved the killing from Auschwitz-I, 832 00:52:40.480 --> 00:52:43.800 which is some three kilometers from here, to Birkenau, 833 00:52:43.880 --> 00:52:47.960 they're building an industry of murdering people. 834 00:52:48.800 --> 00:52:52.840 We have around one million Jews murdered in Auschwitz. 835 00:52:53.720 --> 00:52:55.320 In fact, in Birkenau, 836 00:52:55.400 --> 00:52:57.280 there were six homicidal gas chambers 837 00:52:57.360 --> 00:52:58.560 and four crematoria. 838 00:52:58.640 --> 00:53:00.920 GARY: Just in time for my family to come, yeah. 839 00:53:02.720 --> 00:53:06.080 LALI: The headquarter was Auschwitz. 840 00:53:06.160 --> 00:53:09.160 The factory killing was done in Birkenau. 841 00:53:09.240 --> 00:53:12.200 In the whole world, they mention Auschwitz, 842 00:53:13.480 --> 00:53:16.320 but the real McCoy was Birkenau. 843 00:53:17.480 --> 00:53:20.200 PAWEL: Here you can see a historical freight train car. 844 00:53:20.280 --> 00:53:23.200 And most of the Jews were deported in freight train cars. 845 00:53:23.520 --> 00:53:25.360 Sometimes people talk about cattle train cars, 846 00:53:25.440 --> 00:53:27.200 but cattle would get a lot of air. 847 00:53:27.280 --> 00:53:29.880 In many testimonies we have people who have lack of air, 848 00:53:29.960 --> 00:53:32.400 and it's overcrowded, around 80 people in it. 849 00:53:32.480 --> 00:53:33.680 GARY: Oh, God. 850 00:53:34.880 --> 00:53:36.040 So that's all they had? 851 00:53:36.120 --> 00:53:38.600 Yes. There's one for the air on one side. 852 00:53:38.680 --> 00:53:40.560 There was something on the other side. 853 00:53:40.640 --> 00:53:44.200 Many survivors talk that finding a place near this little window 854 00:53:44.280 --> 00:53:45.120 would be... 855 00:53:45.200 --> 00:53:47.520 -Lifesaving. -Because you would get air. 856 00:53:47.600 --> 00:53:48.400 Right. 857 00:53:48.480 --> 00:53:52.120 PAWEL: And this is the place where the selection happened 858 00:53:52.200 --> 00:53:54.040 when the transport of Jews arrived, 859 00:53:54.120 --> 00:53:56.600 because non-Jews do not go to the selection. 860 00:53:56.680 --> 00:53:59.920 And we estimate that around 75% of Jews 861 00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:01.920 are murdered immediately. 862 00:54:02.280 --> 00:54:04.920 Not everybody came into the camp. 863 00:54:05.000 --> 00:54:07.000 Only the stronger people came. 864 00:54:07.080 --> 00:54:11.720 The rest went straight away to be killed, to be gassed. 865 00:54:11.800 --> 00:54:14.200 If you had a little pimple on your hand, 866 00:54:14.280 --> 00:54:15.600 you went to the left. 867 00:54:17.120 --> 00:54:20.120 Most of the girls from my town were taken 868 00:54:20.200 --> 00:54:22.840 for nothing, nothing. 869 00:54:23.640 --> 00:54:24.760 PAWEL: People have no idea 870 00:54:24.840 --> 00:54:27.200 that they will never see each other again. 871 00:54:27.280 --> 00:54:29.920 And then, some of them become prisoners. 872 00:54:30.400 --> 00:54:33.440 They get to a place where someone makes the tattoo, 873 00:54:33.520 --> 00:54:35.360 and then they enter into the camp. 874 00:54:36.240 --> 00:54:38.040 And they learn in a moment 875 00:54:39.160 --> 00:54:41.440 that the others were taken to the gas chambers. 876 00:54:41.520 --> 00:54:42.800 The prisoners do not have... 877 00:54:42.880 --> 00:54:45.040 You know, they don't sugarcoat it. 878 00:54:45.120 --> 00:54:47.280 They tell them the blunt truth. 879 00:54:47.360 --> 00:54:48.760 And for many of those people, 880 00:54:48.840 --> 00:54:50.400 it is simply too much to take in. 881 00:54:50.480 --> 00:54:54.400 In the early days, people couldn't take it. 882 00:54:55.280 --> 00:54:59.920 They ran to the Postenkette, 883 00:55:00.000 --> 00:55:03.440 and there were 3,000 or 4,000 volts in it. 884 00:55:03.520 --> 00:55:05.520 They grabbed the wire, 885 00:55:05.600 --> 00:55:07.880 and they would be killed straight away. 886 00:55:07.960 --> 00:55:09.320 The power killed them. 887 00:55:09.400 --> 00:55:12.200 And that was on a daily basis. 888 00:55:12.800 --> 00:55:16.800 Those were the early days in Birkenau. 889 00:55:17.680 --> 00:55:18.680 GARY: It's so massive. 890 00:55:18.760 --> 00:55:20.920 When you look down this row, 891 00:55:21.000 --> 00:55:25.040 and there's row after row after row. 892 00:55:25.120 --> 00:55:26.520 The effort they put in. 893 00:55:27.080 --> 00:55:29.120 You know, all the logistics 894 00:55:29.200 --> 00:55:31.400 that went into building and killing 895 00:55:31.480 --> 00:55:33.160 and transporting. 896 00:55:34.880 --> 00:55:36.720 I have nothing else to say, Stephen. 897 00:55:37.160 --> 00:55:39.360 You can't get blood out of a stone. 898 00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:40.840 I'm kind of, like... 899 00:55:43.320 --> 00:55:44.200 Yeah. 900 00:56:06.080 --> 00:56:09.680 My dad, when he said, "I want to apologize 901 00:56:10.320 --> 00:56:13.960 to the people whose lives I couldn't save," 902 00:56:14.040 --> 00:56:18.520 his only curiosity about all the gas chambers was this one. 903 00:56:19.600 --> 00:56:21.200 Crematorium III. 904 00:56:34.640 --> 00:56:38.080 PAWEL: This is a place where tens of thousands 905 00:56:38.160 --> 00:56:39.160 would walk down. 906 00:56:39.240 --> 00:56:43.120 And I know you wanted to specifically say a prayer here. 907 00:56:48.000 --> 00:56:53.200 PRAYS IN HEBREW 908 00:57:04.520 --> 00:57:08.760 HE SOBS 909 00:57:41.480 --> 00:57:43.040 GARY: So, what are we entering now? 910 00:57:43.120 --> 00:57:47.080 PAWEL: So, we are entering into one of the smaller sections. 911 00:57:47.160 --> 00:57:49.480 And this was called the Zigeunerlager. 912 00:57:49.560 --> 00:57:51.840 It was the camp for the Roma and Sinti prisoners. 913 00:57:52.320 --> 00:57:53.640 In the family camp, 914 00:57:53.720 --> 00:57:56.920 your father stayed for some time in one of the wooden barracks, 915 00:57:57.000 --> 00:57:58.560 and it's over here. 916 00:57:59.080 --> 00:58:03.160 Unique in the stories that Lali said that he lived on his own. 917 00:58:03.240 --> 00:58:04.160 GARY: Yes. 918 00:58:04.240 --> 00:58:05.120 PAWEL: What we think 919 00:58:05.200 --> 00:58:07.720 is that he lived as part of the larger group 920 00:58:07.800 --> 00:58:09.000 of this whole unit. 921 00:58:09.080 --> 00:58:12.720 Maybe their conditions of life were better. 922 00:58:12.800 --> 00:58:14.520 So this is maybe, 923 00:58:14.600 --> 00:58:17.480 kind of the reason for this isolation, or the feeling... 924 00:58:17.560 --> 00:58:19.240 But that makes no sense. 925 00:58:19.320 --> 00:58:23.360 I can understand some of his memories would be very vague 926 00:58:23.440 --> 00:58:25.240 as an 89-year-old man, 927 00:58:25.320 --> 00:58:28.840 but one thing that is impossible to be vague 928 00:58:28.920 --> 00:58:33.160 is not knowing if you are in your own room or not. 929 00:58:33.240 --> 00:58:34.040 That's... 930 00:58:34.120 --> 00:58:37.240 And I can still distinctly remember 931 00:58:37.320 --> 00:58:39.520 my mom yelling at my dad 932 00:58:39.600 --> 00:58:41.160 when he was describing the room. 933 00:58:41.240 --> 00:58:44.840 Yelling at him that it wasn't a six-star hotel. 934 00:58:45.600 --> 00:58:48.200 But maybe they had enough space 935 00:58:48.280 --> 00:58:49.720 that they would be able to have 936 00:58:49.800 --> 00:58:52.600 their own kind of sleeping places. 937 00:58:52.680 --> 00:58:54.360 Maybe that's the explanation. 938 00:58:54.440 --> 00:58:56.040 GARY: Or he just had his own room. 939 00:58:56.120 --> 00:58:57.640 -PAWEL: Maybe that also. -GARY: Yes. 940 00:58:57.720 --> 00:58:59.840 PAWEL: But there could be maybe several of them. 941 00:59:01.400 --> 00:59:03.560 This sector at the very back of Birkenau 942 00:59:03.640 --> 00:59:06.600 has a German name, Effektenlager. 943 00:59:06.680 --> 00:59:10.080 Your mother worked here, and that was considered to be, 944 00:59:10.600 --> 00:59:11.960 somehow, privileged work. 945 00:59:12.040 --> 00:59:13.320 GARY: Yes, correct. 946 00:59:13.400 --> 00:59:16.320 And then something that is unique for this place 947 00:59:16.400 --> 00:59:18.320 is that on the other side of the fence, 948 00:59:18.400 --> 00:59:20.400 you can see this red line. 949 00:59:20.480 --> 00:59:22.920 This is the ruins of Gas Chamber number 4. 950 00:59:23.000 --> 00:59:26.000 So they were also close witnesses 951 00:59:26.080 --> 00:59:28.240 to the killing process. 952 00:59:28.760 --> 00:59:31.640 GITA: We heard the screams from where they went... 953 00:59:33.200 --> 00:59:34.400 to the gas. 954 00:59:36.640 --> 00:59:38.880 All my friends were taken. 955 00:59:44.000 --> 00:59:46.240 GARY: When you look across everything, 956 00:59:46.640 --> 00:59:49.240 it's mind-boggling, the vastness of this. 957 01:00:29.400 --> 01:00:33.800 Walking in my parents' footsteps is very special. 958 01:00:36.560 --> 01:00:39.280 I don't think I could ever have been closer talking to them 959 01:00:39.360 --> 01:00:41.000 than I was here. 960 01:00:41.800 --> 01:00:43.960 When you put it in perspective 961 01:00:44.040 --> 01:00:46.640 of all my family members that didn't survive, 962 01:00:47.400 --> 01:00:51.320 I feel honored that, for whatever reason, 963 01:00:51.400 --> 01:00:55.560 my mom and dad were lucky enough to survive. 964 01:00:56.840 --> 01:00:58.320 I'm going back to Melbourne, 965 01:00:58.400 --> 01:01:02.480 and I can talk to my children in a whole different way 966 01:01:02.560 --> 01:01:04.080 about their family. 967 01:01:09.360 --> 01:01:11.640 I remember my mom and dad saying 968 01:01:12.520 --> 01:01:16.080 that they wanted to get as far away from Europe 969 01:01:16.160 --> 01:01:17.880 as they possibly could. 970 01:01:18.400 --> 01:01:22.600 And you can't really get much further away than Australia. 971 01:01:23.640 --> 01:01:25.480 -Welcome. -Nice to meet you. 972 01:01:25.560 --> 01:01:27.160 -Nice to meet you. -Thank you so much. 973 01:01:27.240 --> 01:01:29.680 This is Mali, my youngest daughter. 974 01:01:29.760 --> 01:01:30.960 Yes. 975 01:01:32.600 --> 01:01:33.480 MAN: Shall we go in? 976 01:01:33.560 --> 01:01:34.960 MAN 2: Yes, let's move. 977 01:01:35.040 --> 01:01:36.520 MAN: Puts on some beautiful music, 978 01:01:36.600 --> 01:01:38.160 and they do a dance of tango. 979 01:01:38.240 --> 01:01:39.840 GARY SPEAKS IN HEBREW 980 01:01:40.360 --> 01:01:41.560 Twinkle Toes. 981 01:01:41.640 --> 01:01:43.240 THEY LAUGH 982 01:01:43.320 --> 01:01:45.280 We dance a lot in here. 983 01:01:45.680 --> 01:01:46.640 Fantastic. 984 01:01:46.720 --> 01:01:49.280 Are we hungry? Yes? Good. 985 01:01:49.360 --> 01:01:51.600 Well, we've got lots of food. Why don't you come in? 986 01:01:52.560 --> 01:01:54.200 GARY: Shall we go in? 987 01:01:54.280 --> 01:01:56.600 We forgot the pickles. How can we forget the pickles? 988 01:01:57.440 --> 01:01:59.080 GARY: You can sit down with Mother. 989 01:01:59.640 --> 01:02:02.640 Your parents never talked about the Holocaust? 990 01:02:02.720 --> 01:02:04.720 -A few stories, you know? -Yeah. 991 01:02:04.800 --> 01:02:08.160 We grew up with everything, with Dad telling us 992 01:02:08.240 --> 01:02:10.400 from when we were really young. 993 01:02:10.480 --> 01:02:12.440 Yes, I did a lot to survive, 994 01:02:12.520 --> 01:02:16.760 but I still consider it was 99% of luck 995 01:02:16.840 --> 01:02:23.120 because every moment of the day, you could be shot, killed, 996 01:02:23.200 --> 01:02:26.880 beaten to death or sent to the gas chamber. 997 01:02:27.320 --> 01:02:30.160 CHARLIE: But whatever question we ever had 998 01:02:30.240 --> 01:02:31.520 was always answered. 999 01:02:31.600 --> 01:02:32.920 -Brilliant. -CHARLIE: Always. 1000 01:02:33.000 --> 01:02:35.360 When I was ten, I turned around to Dad one day 1001 01:02:35.440 --> 01:02:38.000 and I said to him, "Dad, do you hate the Germans?" 1002 01:02:38.080 --> 01:02:40.320 And he said, "Don't you ever use that word, 1003 01:02:40.400 --> 01:02:42.320 because once you give in to that emotion, 1004 01:02:42.400 --> 01:02:44.040 what is it that you become?" 1005 01:02:44.120 --> 01:02:45.600 -As bad as that. -CHARLIE: Yeah. 1006 01:02:45.680 --> 01:02:49.000 So, to me, that was a lesson in not only survival, 1007 01:02:49.080 --> 01:02:53.360 but survival with your humanity and your dignity intact, yeah. 1008 01:02:53.440 --> 01:02:54.760 GARY: That's the right message. 1009 01:02:54.840 --> 01:02:56.720 He's an amazing man, this one. 1010 01:02:56.800 --> 01:02:57.840 INDISTINCT 1011 01:02:57.920 --> 01:03:01.280 So, really, this trip has been amazing for you. 1012 01:03:01.360 --> 01:03:02.600 Just phenomenal. 1013 01:03:02.680 --> 01:03:05.880 You're telling everything to your children now. 1014 01:03:05.960 --> 01:03:10.160 I don't want them to have that same emptiness that I had. 1015 01:03:10.760 --> 01:03:12.520 HELEN: It's quite profound on me 1016 01:03:12.600 --> 01:03:16.440 how you're telling the stories that you never heard. 1017 01:03:16.520 --> 01:03:18.520 It's so important. 1018 01:03:22.960 --> 01:03:25.760 GEORGE: Now, having come back, how are you feeling, 1019 01:03:25.840 --> 01:03:29.160 to have a lived experience of Auschwitz? 1020 01:03:29.240 --> 01:03:30.240 GARY: Relieved. 1021 01:03:30.680 --> 01:03:32.040 I'm a different person. 1022 01:03:32.600 --> 01:03:35.320 -In what way? -I'm not empty anymore. 1023 01:03:35.800 --> 01:03:36.800 Oh! 1024 01:03:37.880 --> 01:03:40.240 Maybe I don't know the right terminology, 1025 01:03:40.880 --> 01:03:43.320 but it's almost like peace of mind. 1026 01:03:43.400 --> 01:03:45.360 -Okay. -If that makes sense? 1027 01:03:45.440 --> 01:03:47.840 -Yes. -GARY: I am comforted 1028 01:03:48.400 --> 01:03:53.560 and fulfilled by the fact that I now know so much more. 1029 01:03:53.640 --> 01:03:54.440 GEORGE: Yes. 1030 01:03:55.320 --> 01:03:57.520 How do you think you coped with the emptiness 1031 01:03:57.600 --> 01:03:58.880 all the years before? 1032 01:03:59.560 --> 01:04:02.040 I think I knew it was there, but I ignored it. 1033 01:04:02.520 --> 01:04:04.320 There's a way of looking at trauma 1034 01:04:04.400 --> 01:04:06.960 that is not actually a state of mind, 1035 01:04:07.040 --> 01:04:08.880 but a state of body. 1036 01:04:10.200 --> 01:04:12.120 Now, you're noticing this 1037 01:04:12.200 --> 01:04:14.160 and you're saying it's peace of mind. 1038 01:04:14.840 --> 01:04:18.280 And many people might say, "What a paradox. 1039 01:04:18.360 --> 01:04:20.520 You're going to Auschwitz, 1040 01:04:20.600 --> 01:04:22.440 and you come back with peace of mind." 1041 01:04:22.520 --> 01:04:23.640 How do you...? 1042 01:04:25.680 --> 01:04:28.800 I don't know the answer to that. I just know I have that feeling. 1043 01:04:28.880 --> 01:04:31.000 -GEORGE: It's very real. -And I've noticed it. 1044 01:04:31.080 --> 01:04:33.480 -It's very real. -GARY: Yeah. 1045 01:04:33.560 --> 01:04:36.440 I'm going to have such a different relationship 1046 01:04:36.520 --> 01:04:40.360 with my children, as a parent and as a friend. 1047 01:04:40.440 --> 01:04:43.200 I think I'm going to like myself a lot more, too, 1048 01:04:43.280 --> 01:04:45.160 in the way I relate because of that. 1049 01:04:45.240 --> 01:04:46.600 -GEORGE: Please do. -Yeah. 1050 01:04:48.120 --> 01:04:52.680 It's an absolute honor to be in your presence. 1051 01:04:52.760 --> 01:04:55.520 GARY: Thank you. It's a very warm feeling. 1052 01:04:57.120 --> 01:04:58.440 Oh. 1053 01:04:58.520 --> 01:05:00.760 -I'm sorry. -GEORGE: Please, please. 1054 01:05:00.840 --> 01:05:02.400 -It's a release. -GARY: Okay. 1055 01:05:02.480 --> 01:05:03.920 This is not a negative. 1056 01:05:19.880 --> 01:05:22.240 MALI: Does it go in order, like in the alphabet? 1057 01:05:22.320 --> 01:05:23.360 -No. -No? 1058 01:05:23.440 --> 01:05:26.320 No, it's wherever you buy the plots. 1059 01:05:31.280 --> 01:05:33.760 Here you go. This is Mom and Dad. 1060 01:05:34.480 --> 01:05:35.480 Look at that. 1061 01:05:37.080 --> 01:05:39.280 I miss you guys very much. 1062 01:05:39.360 --> 01:05:42.120 First time I've brought your grandchildren out to see you. 1063 01:05:42.200 --> 01:05:46.160 This is Mali, and this is Aviva. 1064 01:05:46.240 --> 01:05:49.480 So, I've got stones from both your hometowns. 1065 01:05:50.400 --> 01:05:51.680 So let's all put one on, 1066 01:05:51.760 --> 01:05:53.760 just to let them know we've been here. 1067 01:05:54.480 --> 01:05:57.280 Dad, look at that. From outside your front door. 1068 01:05:57.360 --> 01:06:02.040 So you've got a bit of home to have as well. 1069 01:06:02.120 --> 01:06:03.400 Oh! 1070 01:06:03.480 --> 01:06:05.200 GARY KISSES 1071 01:06:09.840 --> 01:06:11.480 I wish you could have met them. 1072 01:06:12.640 --> 01:06:15.680 How my dad would have fussed over you two, 1073 01:06:15.760 --> 01:06:18.400 and Mom would have had you in the kitchen, 1074 01:06:18.480 --> 01:06:21.360 teaching you songs and watching her bake. 1075 01:06:21.440 --> 01:06:22.880 She would have been in heaven. 1076 01:06:23.520 --> 01:06:25.920 How you going, choop? Doing good? 1077 01:06:26.280 --> 01:06:27.080 Yeah. 1078 01:06:29.880 --> 01:06:33.600 INTERVIEWER: How did you find Gita after you were liberated? 1079 01:06:33.680 --> 01:06:35.240 I couldn't go by train 1080 01:06:36.480 --> 01:06:38.040 because it was bombed. 1081 01:06:38.560 --> 01:06:41.080 The train couldn't go through the bridges. 1082 01:06:41.600 --> 01:06:43.200 So I bought a horse. 1083 01:06:44.320 --> 01:06:45.240 You know? 1084 01:06:45.800 --> 01:06:47.320 And I took my horse, 1085 01:06:47.840 --> 01:06:51.360 and I was going hundreds of kilometers 1086 01:06:52.480 --> 01:06:53.760 to look for her. 1087 01:06:54.560 --> 01:06:57.800 GITA: And, one day, turns up a horse 1088 01:06:57.880 --> 01:07:00.400 on two wheels. You know, that carriage? 1089 01:07:00.480 --> 01:07:02.760 I look back there, and it's my husband. 1090 01:07:04.120 --> 01:07:05.320 GITA: Lali! 1091 01:07:19.200 --> 01:07:20.960 SHE SOBS 1092 01:07:22.200 --> 01:07:26.920 He chased me and found me, and we are happy together. 1093 01:07:38.240 --> 01:07:40.320 -GARY: Do you know who that is? -AVIVA: That's... 1094 01:07:40.400 --> 01:07:41.600 That's your dad. 1095 01:07:41.680 --> 01:07:43.200 -GARY: Who's that? -AVIVA: Your mom. 1096 01:07:43.280 --> 01:07:44.360 -And who's that? -You. 1097 01:07:44.440 --> 01:07:47.240 Yeah. This is from their 50th wedding anniversary. 1098 01:07:47.320 --> 01:07:50.200 I threw a really big party for them. 1099 01:07:51.040 --> 01:07:53.240 Pretty good-looking dude, your dad, huh? 1100 01:07:53.320 --> 01:07:56.760 -AVIVA: No, he looks better. -GARY: Really? [LAUGHS] 1101 01:07:56.840 --> 01:07:57.680 Thanks. 1102 01:07:59.040 --> 01:08:00.680 It's okay. I love you still. 1103 01:08:01.160 --> 01:08:02.080 MALI: Watch this! 1104 01:08:02.160 --> 01:08:04.280 GARY: My parents found each other, 1105 01:08:05.320 --> 01:08:08.880 and they got married in Krompachy. 1106 01:08:08.960 --> 01:08:13.000 And what I have here just shows you how much they were in love. 1107 01:08:13.080 --> 01:08:16.960 So, this is a photo from the Tatras mountain range, 1108 01:08:17.040 --> 01:08:20.360 and my parents went there on their honeymoon. 1109 01:08:20.720 --> 01:08:21.720 Have a look. 1110 01:08:21.800 --> 01:08:25.280 This is post-war, with hair, 1111 01:08:25.360 --> 01:08:31.040 just so, so very happy and in love. 1112 01:08:31.120 --> 01:08:37.640 So I'm the result of one of the most amazing romances 1113 01:08:37.720 --> 01:08:42.600 in the most horrific place that ever existed. 1114 01:08:42.680 --> 01:08:44.520 I mean, even the fact that I'm around 1115 01:08:44.600 --> 01:08:47.720 is also seriously good luck. 1116 01:08:48.400 --> 01:08:49.600 Wahoo! 1117 01:08:51.920 --> 01:08:53.480 It's amazing! 1118 01:08:53.560 --> 01:08:55.040 I love it! 1119 01:08:56.720 --> 01:08:58.760 GARY: I have two beautiful girls. 1120 01:08:59.240 --> 01:09:03.440 They will be able to continue the story, 1121 01:09:03.520 --> 01:09:05.520 and that is my greatest happiness. 1122 01:09:07.240 --> 01:09:08.280 MALI: Go run. 1123 01:09:08.360 --> 01:09:10.360 AVIVA: Go for a run. Get some exercise in. 1124 01:09:11.880 --> 01:09:13.400 THEY LAUGH